Sheehan considers challenge to Pelosi

[oberliner]

Source: Associated Press

CRAWFORD, Texas - Six weeks after announcing her departure from the peace movement, Cindy Sheehan said Sunday that she plans to run against House Speaker Nancy Pelosi unless she introduces articles of impeachment against President Bush in the next two weeks.

Sheehan said she will run against the San Francisco Democrat in 2008 as an independent if Pelosi does not seek by July 23 to impeach Bush. That's when Sheehan and her supporters are to arrive in Washington, D.C., after a 13-day caravan and walking tour starting next week from the group's war protest site near Bush's Crawford ranch.

"Democrats and Americans feel betrayed by the Democratic leadership," Sheehan told The Associated Press. "We hired them to bring an end to the war. I'm not too far from San Francisco, so it wouldn't be too big of a move for me. I would give her a run for her money."

Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070708/ap_on_el_ho/cindy_sheehan_pelosi;_ylt=AplUnHptbkSTlCaMbgSPZUOs0NUE

[still_one]

1. Really, how about the last six years of republican leadership? /nt

[Diane R]

261. I wish she wouldn't.....what a waste of time and energy. With the wrong target.

[aquart]

2. Yeah, toss out all that hardwon seniority. Thanks, Cindy.

And we all respond so well to blackmail.

[Pale Blue Dot]

5. I'll bet it's the one thing she WILL respond to.

:popcorn:

[aquart]

20. Deliberately attacking the only female with seniority

Is NOT a popcorn moment. It sucks.

[Pale Blue Dot]

21. Hyperbole sucks. THIS is interesting.

:popcorn:

[fightthegoodfightnow]

52. A Free Pass for a Leader Merely Because She is a Woman is Insulting

........to Nancy Pelosi and every other woman who has had to fight hard to stay on her game.

Nancy Pelosi is not on her game.

[PurpleChez]

86. ROKK ON!!!!!

Pelosi is on her way to becoming a female left-coast version of arch-enabler Joe Lieberman. She's got to turn things around pretty damn soon or I'm gonna stop giving a good god damn about her. Rock on, Cindy.

[ProudToBeBlueInRhody]

172. She isn't anything like Lieberman

But don't ley hysteria stop anyone at DU from making such points.

[PurpleChez]

174. Then let's see her stand up to the MINORITY party

and stop enabling the chimp. You're right, she's not Lieberman...not yet...but my gushing admiration for her has turned to disinterest and will fester into disgust if she doesn't do something soon.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

187. Gosh.........Let's See

Who exactly voted to continue funding the war *despite* the last election?

Oh.........that's right...........Nancy Pelosi and Joe Lieberman.

Enough........<should I shout>..............ENOUGH ! ! !

[PurpleChez]

200. Thank you!

[chervilant]

248. And, have you noticed

how QUIET Pelosi has grown of late? Furthermore, WHATEVER path Sheehan's current activism follows, I strongly support her activism and her courage. She's doing a helluva lot more than most of her detractors.

Cindy, if you're reading this, PLEASE don't let the naysayers bring you down! Read Don Miguel Ruiz's "The Four Agreements." Part of your destiny is surviving the taunts and jibes of those who fear your passion and would squash you into their convenient little box of "how you should act." I hope I have your courage when I'm up against the barricades!

[NotGivingUp]

369. There are more and more of us, Cindy, that see the light. We are behind you! nt

[knight_of_the_star]

251. That's a load of horseshit

Pelosi voted AGAINST the war funding bill thankyouverymuch! Say what you want about Madame Speaker, but at least TRY to be truthful when you do.

[Lionel Mandrake]

280. Here's how Democrats voted, according to the Washington Post (5/25/07)

House Democrats who voted Yes
Jason Altmire, Robert Andrews, Joe Baca, Brian Baird, John Barrow, Melissa Bean, Shelley Berkley, Marion Berry, Sanford Bishop, Dan Boren, Leonard Boswell, Rick Boucher, Allen Boyd, Nancy Boyda, G.K. Butterfield, Dennis Cardoza, Christopher Carney, Ben Chandler, James Clyburn, Jim Cooper, Jim Costa, Bud Cramer, Henry Cuellar, Lincoln Davis, Susan Davis, Norman Dicks, John Dingell, Joe Donnelly, Chet Edwards, Brad Ellsworth, Rahm Emanuel, Bob Etheridge, Gabrielle Giffords, Kirsten Gillibrand, Charles Gonzalez, Bart Gordon, Gene Green, Stephanie Herseth, Baron Hill, Rubén Hinojosa, Tim Holden, Steny Hoyer, Steve Kagen, Paul Kanjorski, Dale Kildee, Ron Kind, Nicholas Lampson, Rick Larsen, Sander Levin, Daniel Lipinski, Tim Mahoney, Jim Marshall, Jim Matheson, Mike McIntyre, Kendrick Meek, Charles Melancon, Harry Mitchell, Alan Mollohan, Dennis Moore, John Murtha, Solomon Ortiz, Collin Peterson, Earl Pomeroy, Nick Rahall, Silvestre Reyes, Ciro Rodriguez, Mike Ross, Dutch Ruppersberger, John Salazar, Debbie Wasserman Schultz, Allyson Schwartz, David Scott, Joe Sestak, Heath Shuler, Ike Skelton, Vic Snyder, Zachary Space, John Spratt, Bart Stupak, John Tanner, Gene Taylor, Bennie Thompson, Mark Udall, Peter Visclosky, Timothy Walz, Charles Wilson

House Democrats who voted No
Neil Abercrombie, Gary Ackerman, Thomas Allen, Michael Arcuri, Tammy Baldwin, Xavier Becerra, Timothy Bishop, Earl Blumenauer, Robert Brady, Bruce Braley, Corrine Brown, Lois Capps, Michael Capuano, Russ Carnahan, Julia Carson, Kathy Castor, Yvette Clarke, William Clay, Emanuel Cleaver, Steve Cohen, John Conyers, Jerry Costello, Joe Courtney, Joseph Crowley, Elijah Cummings, Artur Davis, Danny Davis, Peter DeFazio, Rosa DeLauro, William Delahunt, Lloyd Doggett, Michael Doyle, Keith Ellison, Anna Eshoo, Sam Farr, Chaka Fattah, Bob Filner, Barney Frank, Al Green, Raúl Grijalva, Luis Gutiérrez, John Hall, Phil Hare, Jane Harman, Alcee Hastings, Brian Higgins, Maurice Hinchey, Mazie Hirono, Paul Hodes, Chris Van Hollen, Rush Holt, Mike Honda, Darlene Hooley, Jay Inslee, Steve Israel, Jesse Jackson, Sheila Jackson-Lee, William Jefferson, Eddie Johnson, Hank Johnson, Marcy Kaptur, Patrick Kennedy, Carolyn Kilpatrick, Ron Klein, Dennis Kucinich, James Langevin, Tom Lantos, John Larson, Barbara Lee, David Loebsack, Zoe Lofgren, Nita Lowey, Stephen Lynch, Carolyn Maloney, Edward Markey, Doris Matsui, Carolyn McCarthy, Betty McCollum, Jim McDermott, James McGovern, Jerry McNerney, Michael McNulty, Martin Meehan, Gregory Meeks, Michael Michaud, Brad Miller, George Miller, Gwen Moore, James Moran, Christopher Murphy, Patrick Murphy, Jerrold Nadler, Grace Napolitano, Richard Neal, David Obey, John Olver, Frank Pallone, Bill Pascrell, Ed Pastor, Donald Payne, Nancy Pelosi, Ed Perlmutter, David Price, Charles Rangel, Steven Rothman, Lucille Roybal-Allard, Bobby Rush, Tim Ryan, Loretta Sanchez, John Sarbanes, Jan Schakowsky, Adam Schiff, Robert Scott, José Serrano, Carol Shea-Porter, Brad Sherman, Albio Sires, Louise Slaughter, Adam Smith, Hilda Solis, Pete Stark, Betty Sutton, Linda Sánchez, Ellen Tauscher, Mike Thompson, John Tierney, Edolphus Towns, Tom Udall, Nydia Velázquez, Maxine Waters, Diane Watson, Melvin Watt, Henry Waxman, Anthony Weiner, Peter Welch, Robert Wexler, Lynn Woolsey, David Wu, Al Wynn, John Yarmuth

Not Voting
Howard Berman, Diana DeGette, Eliot Engel, Stephanie Jones, John Lewis, James Oberstar

[Virginia Dare]

306. Pelosi voted against it...n/t

[Warren DeMontague]

192. "Pelosi = Lieberman"? Where the hell do you get that nonsense? You don't honestly believe your own

baloney, do you?

That's totally fucking absurd. Beyond fucking absurd.

http://www.africasia.com/services/news/newsitem.php?area=mideast&item=070708070701.gxtbheku.php

House speaker Nancy Pelosi plans to introduce a bill within weeks to authorize troop redeployments to start within four months and to be completed by April 1, 2008, a formula Bush has already blocked once with a presidential veto.

How is that anything remotely like Joe Lieberman?

Cindy Sheehan has more in common with Lieberman than Pelosi does- because neither Sheehan nor Lieberman are Democrats.

[PurpleChez]

199. Try actually reading my post

and you won't see "Pelosi = Lieberman" anywhere. I wrote that Nancy is well on the way to becoming as big an enabler as Joe. But I'd sincerely love to see her prove me wrong.

"House speaker Nancy Pelosi plans to introduce a bill within weeks to authorize troop redeployments..." --I'll believe it when I see it. And I'll be the first to give her mad props if she doesn't cave to the chimp like she did the last time.

"Cindy Sheehan has more in common with Lieberman than Pelosi does- because neither Sheehan nor Lieberman are Democrats." --as far as I'm concerned it's beyond fucking absurd to pin so much on whether or not someone is self-identified as "Democrat". Non-Dem Sheehan did more for the anti-war movement than almost any of our congresscritters, while most Dems cowered in fear of being called nasty names by the imbicile in the white house. You are most certainly entitled to disagree with Cindy Sheehan but I hope that your criteria run deeper than "she's not a democrat".

[Virginia Dare]

307. I read your entire post and it was inaccurate, check your "facts"..n/t

[fightthegoodfightnow]

222. My Friends are Those Who Want to End This War NOW

........and I count Cindy Sheehan amoung them.

Nancy and Joe voted to extend the war and enabled Bush to increase troop levels.

[PurpleChez]

257. You said that much better than I could

Joe Lieberman ain't the only (one-time) Dem who cheered on the war and enabled the Chimp until it was expedient to do otherwise. I won't name names (Hillary!) for fear of starting another argument altogether. And, let's not forget that there are at least a few repulicans out there who opose the war and the Chimp. Maybe some of them came to that position a little slowly and perhaps their reasons were less than noble, but would we rather have them remain cheerleading bushbots?

[fightthegoodfightnow]

365. Thank You

You're right about Hillary.

I thought it would be great to see a woman in the White House in my lifetime, but her positions over the last four years have disappointed me soo much. I'm tired of the centrist and blue dog Dems pandering to the right.

Dems need to take an extreme position on EVERYTHING so that we can balance the extreme positions of the right and by so doing start to change how the conversation is held.

The GOP was successful in crafting the debate to how long we should be in Iraq rather than should we be there at all.

[PurpleChez]

375. I would still vote for Hillary

if she ended up the Dem candidate. I just have no illusions about her being an heroic or ideal figure.

[Warren DeMontague]

281. Thank you for your concern.

You're obviously paying very close attention to what's going on.

[Raine]

197. RIDICULOUS!!!

she is NOT another Lieberman and she does NOT enable chimpie!

[PurpleChez]

204. No...she just caved like a sandcastle

I'd say that doing so freaking little to stand up to the minority party and a president with 28% approval rating is, for all intents and purposes, enabling the actions of those murderers. Look...this woman used to be my hero. I would LOVE to see her DIS-ABLE the chimp, but I'm no longer holding my breath waiting for it to happen.

[Zhade]

238. You are, of course, correct.

NT!

[PurpleChez]

255. Thanks! I was thinking there that we must be talking about two different Nancy Peolsis

But, I guess, we actually were. One from 2006, the other from 2007.

[pokercat999]

301. Taking impeachment off the table wasn't enabling? Man

I want you on my negotiating team.....not.

[othermeans]

241. I'm with you. I'm sick and tired of listening to the bitching that goes on

here about DINOs and when someone steps up to challenge them they get slammed as not being party loyalist.

[SharonRB]

325. Nothing like exaggeration.

Nancy Pelosi is nothing like LIEberman.

[Exiled in America]

103. ABSOLUTELY!! Thank you for making the correct point.

[calimary]

A free pass from that leader to another "leader" who's done nothing

but break the law and wiped his ass on the Constitution since he stole his way into the Oval Office is just as insulting.

I hope this DOES shake Pelosi back to her senses. SET THE TABLE, NANCY.

Let's see what kind of change in the wind this coming week brings, on the heels of libbygate. The NYTimes is out with a full page editorial today (Sunday) saying it's time to get OUT of Iraq - like NOW, not later. And the loud, insistent calls for IMPEACHMENT have grown louder and more insistent. The anger has spread and expanded. Damned near exploded - is more like it. Let's see her keep sheltering george now that the momentum is growing dramatically in the other direction.

Tomorrow morning we have to resume our push - anyone who can, that is, and has a couple of extra moments. Handy TOLL FREE Capitol Hill switchboard numbers always conveniently located in my sig line below.

[PurpleChez]

215. Great post. Polosi needs to prove whose side she's on.

I would love to see her stand up to the doofus. Her recent actions don't give me a lot of hope but I'd love for her to prove me wrong.

[OzarkDem]

339. As a feminist, I must agree

There are a few of the first wave feminists who advanced in elected office and were put on a pedestal by the women who supported and help get them there. No one was allowed to question them or even discuss policy, we were all just supposed to support "Jane" or whomever because "she will be the first woman (fill in the blank)!"

As women, we have to hold these women to the highest standards of excellence and accountability, just as we would men. Nancy's crown is slipping, she's showing that, other than fundraising and using sharp elbows to advance in the political world, she may not have a whole lot more to offer.

I hope I'm wrong and I hope she proves otherwise very quickly.

[puebloknot]

72. Are you suggesting that Pelosi should get a pass because...

...she's the "only female with seniority."

As a female, I've said all along that her gender is not important to me. I don't care about all her "marble ceiling" crap. I just want her to do the job she was elected to do.

[Raine]

195. Cindi seems to be one of those women who

hate other women especially other women who make it. x(

[uberllama42]

223. Do you have any evidence for that?

As I'm sure you're aware, that's a hell of an accusation to make without any way to back it up.

[orleans]

236. oh please. are you fucking kidding me? n/t

[Zhade]

239. Do you normally just make shit up?

NT!

[othermeans]

242. WTF? She hates other women please get a grip

[Binka]

357. Shit Like This Is Why I Rarely Hang Out On DU

What a fucking absurd post. :wtf: ABSURD. This sounds like projection to me. See ya later alligator you are on IGNORE.:wtf:

[Umbram]

377. Naa...this is educational.

We know what kind of freeper thinking gives all conservatives a bad name. Sometimes it's interesting to see what kinds of "progressive" "thinking" (I'm hesitant to apply either word to this situation) gives progressives a bad name.

I liken this post to one of my personal favorites here at DU, a quote along the lines of "I'll believe any African American woman who claims she was raped by a White man." (Ie. I decide issues of justice based on people's race.)

Bravo. Maybe I'll start keeping a list of my favorites as a blog.

[purduejake]

260. I believe in equality.

Why should somebody who's not doing their job be kept in that position just because of their gender? That is ridiculous and hurts the cause of true equality.

[still_one]

10. She will get attention, that will be directed against the Democrats, NOT the repugs

who started the whole mess

Don't get me wrong, I definitely believe in a dialog, and influencing getting us out of Iraq, but past performance shows the media will use this to bash the Democrats, instead of real change

[ben_meyers]

23. careful!

attention?

[still_one]

161. LOL /nt

[Ino]

12. hard-won seniority... that's what they said about Lieberman

Go for it, Cindy!

[puebloknot]

18. All that hard-won seniority is doing *nothing* to stop the funding...

...for the war in Iraq, nothing to take *tangible* steps to hold Bush/Cheney accountable for their crimes, nothing to prevent an attack on Iran.

Nancy Pelosi doesn't think Bush is "worth an impeachment," and she's making plans for a really incredible election in 2008. (Imagine the victory parties that will take place in D.C., with Nancy in smiling attendance.) Meanwhile, my daughter's friend Sarah is headed back to Iraq for further service in the National Guard (which she thought would involve service in New Mexico, and because she hoped to get help with college expenses) because she wasn't born to a mother like Nancy Pelosi, whose children will never serve in Iraq.

Seniority is an anchor that is keeping this country from moving forward.

[freefall]

53. Thank you, puebloknot. Well said. n/t

[datavg]

57. You Know...

...it's funny you bring that up. We live in Los Angeles but I'm on a contract in Northern California, and I can't tell you how many times I've seen these stiff and stodgy (and wealthy, from pensions and 401Ks) Baby Boomers gumming up the works. We've got project after project that's being held back because this and that Boomer has thirty years service to the company, can't be gotten rid of or retired and doesn't want to do anything.

We've got one manager who fits this description who had a recent minor stroke and his standard response to someone wanting his help on something is "no, no" and then he stumbles off down the hall to some meeting. I've seen similar situations in Los Angeles but NOTHING like what I've seen here in the Bay Area.

It feels like the whole country has dry rot...from many perspectives.

Maybe we really NEED Obama, but if the Democrats nominate him it's a suicide move. He could never carry states in the South and that means he can't win.

[ohio2007]

96. Career politicians cultivate special interests

not all politicians are interested in the districts they represent. In fact, some spend their time accruing nothing at all for those that sent them into the halls of congress.

They have special interests to take care of. And they have the power to give themselves a pat on the back pay raise whenever they feel the need.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

162. hard won experience/ seniority/ BULLSHIT!

this is not a woman thing. this is not a seniority thing, except in one respect. EVERY SINGLE congresscritter who spends too much time inside the beltway becomes infected, corroded and paid off. And the same damn thing happened to the Dems in the short while that we have had a majority. She clearly has, otherwise we would have had an ethics reform bill, an exit strategy out of Iraq, and national health care for every single person here.

Her hundred hours was nothing but a sham. NOT ONE SIGNIFICANT EFFORT to fix the serious wrongs has started. not one. Sure there is nibbling at the edges, and that is only because we have others, (waxman, conyers and a VERY FEW OTHERS) willing to go ahead despite her.

She has not been a leader, to the contrary, she has spent her time pacifying us, collecting lobbyist $$$$ and aiding and abetting the DLC. Being careful and keeping one's powder dry
worked when the brits and french fleets attacked one another. Time for new leadership. NOW

[SharonRB]

326. They haven't done anything? You haven't been paying attention

The House has done a lot, but the slim majority in the Senate and Bush's veto threats have prevented most of it from being coming law.

From Speaker Pelosi:

The 110th Congress is making progress for the American people on the toughest challenges we face—working together to defend our country, restore accountability, grow our economy, strengthen our families, and preserve our planet.

Since January, more than 50 key measures have passed the House, 72 percent with significant bipartisan support. In critical instances, the President and his Republican allies in Congress have stubbornly stood in the way of progress with more than 30 veto threats, obstruction and delay.

The New Direction Congress is working to change course in Iraq. This war, now into its fifth year, has not made America safer, even as our troops have bravely performed their duties. This Congress continues to demand that President Bush and the Administration be held accountable, that the Iraqi government take responsibility for its own country, and that we responsibly bring this war to an end.

The New Direction Congress is protecting America—acting to finally make the work of the independent 9/11 Commission the law of the land. We are rebuilding our military readiness and requiring that we re-engage our diplomatic allies. We are honoring our troops and veterans with pay, services, and care they deserve. We are declaring our energy independence and working to reverse global warming.

The New Direction Congress is providing the keys to the American dream—investing in American ingenuity and innovation. We are working to bring quality health care to every American child, and every child to school ready to learn. We are making America’s rural heartland a key to America’s future economic and energy security. We have changed the way we do business in Washington by restoring fiscal responsibility, government transparency, and the highest ethical standards to Congress.

These are the first of many steps in a New Direction for a stronger and more secure America.

DEFEND OUR COUNTRY

require benchmarks and progress report requirements for the war in Iraq—SIGNED INTO LAW
support timetables to bring our troops home from Iraq—VETOED BY THE PRESIDENT OVER THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE
provide critical support for veterans, military health care and military readiness—SIGNED INTO LAW
provide the largest increase in support for veterans’ services in history—PASSED THE HOUSE
require quality care for our wounded warriors—PASSED THE HOUSE
i finally implement 9-11 Commission recommendations, three years later—PASSED THE HOUSE AND SENATE
provide 3,000 new border patrol agents and tougher aviation and port security—PASSED THE HOUSE
provide emergency wildfire funding—SIGNED INTO LAW

RESTORE ACCOUNTABILITY


restore pay-as-you-go budget discipline for the first time in six years—DONE
pass a budget that balances by 2012 with no tax increase—DONE
impose rules for the highest ethical standards in Congressional history—DONE
pass the most sweeping lobby reform effort in a generation—PASSED THE HOUSE AND SENATE
restore strong Congressional oversight, saving billions, exposing corruption and incompetence—ONGOING
clean up government contracting with reforms to end waste, fraud, and abuse—PASSED THE HOUSE
provide more protections for whistleblowers who save tax dollars—PASSED THE HOUSE
bring overdue assistance to Gulf Coast communities—SIGNED INTO LAW
remove politics from influencing the appointment of U.S. Attorneys in the wake of White House scandal—SIGNED INTO LAW

GROW OUR ECONOMY


increase the minimum wage for the first time in a decade—SIGNED INTO LAW
send overdue disaster aid to American farmers and ranchers—SIGNED INTO LAW
create innovation scholarships for 100,000 math and science students and 25,000 highly trained math and science teachers—PASSED THE HOUSE
double basic research and development funding—PASSED THE HOUSE AND SENATE
create incentives for small business innovation investments—PASSED THE HOUSE

STRENGTHEN OUR FAMILIES

provide emergency assistance to ensure children receive quality health care through SCHIP (State Children’s Health Insurance Plan)—SIGNED INTO LAW
require Medicare to negotiate cheaper prescription drugs—PASSED THE HOUSE
prevent health care discrimination based on inherited conditions—PASSED THE HOUSE AND SENATE
expand medical science through stem cell research—VETOED BY THE PRESIDENT OVER THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE
cut student loan interest rates in half and crack down on lending abuses—PASSED THE HOUSE
improve and expand Head Start preschool—PASSED THE HOUSE AND SENATE
convene the National Summit on America’s Children—aligning policies with cutting-edge science—DONE
put 50,000 new police officers on the street—PASSED THE HOUSE
facilitate states in reporting criminal and mental health data for gun purchase background checks—PASSED THE HOUSE

PRESERVE OUR PLANET


by July 4th, deliver a wide-ranging Energy Independence Day initiative to strengthen our national security, create new American jobs, and reduce global warming—REPORTED TO HOUSE
repeal $14 billion in taxpayer subsidies to Big Oil to be reinvested into clean alternative energy and energy efficiency—PASSED THE HOUSE
fight gas price gouging and OPEC price fixing—PASSED THE HOUSE AND SENATE
direct $3 billion to curb global warming and spur renewable energy—PASSED THE HOUSE
develop a plan to Green the Capitol, reducing the carbon footprint 50%—DONE
expand our efforts to ensure safe drinking water—PASSED THE HOUSE
Download a .pdf of this document>>

[ChairmanAgnostic]

332. and for every point she has raised I have several

criticisms. The health care issue deals with a minor point - inherited issues, but ignores the real killer - pre-existing conditions.
The medicare prescription bill was a fiasco of gigantic proportions. What Pelosi did in response was to find a small bandaid, when in fact, repeal of the entire bill would have served everyone in this country better. 1/3 of all seniors now PAY MORE for prescription drugs, AND the bandaid provision Pelosi baby-sat, well it does little to correct it, except in name only.

the disaster aid bill for farmers missed the target, and most congresscritters from rural areas knew it. This was a ConAgra bailout, with little or nothing for the individual farmer. Have you seen the details of the bill? It is ridiculous to claim this as some sort of victory.

Iraq - SHE CLAIMS VICTORY while throwing sand in the eyes of the American public. Her claims are bogus. There was one easy way to stop the madness in IraqNam. CUT THE FUNDING. That is the power of the House. But Pelosi is too scared and too beholded to AIPAC to use it. Shame on her and her lies. She spins almost as well as the White House whores who spew this type of BS every day.

[Zhade]

205. Indeed. Nailed it.

NT!

[Virginia Dare]

308. Anybody who thinks the answer is to oust Nancy Pelosi

and replace her with Cindy Sheehan is deluded. This will solve NOTHING IMO.

[puebloknot]

341. Pelosi is deluded, IMO. To invoke a biblical phrase...

...(which I hesitate to do because I do not follow "Christian" dogma)...she "strains at the gnat and swallows the camel."

[J R]

33. Pelosi Isn't Doing A Good Job, Folks

I have to put my two cents in... I have been fundamentally against Nancy Pelosi ever since her "Impeachment is off the table" line. Cindy Sheehan might not have such political experience, but I'd vote for her over Nancy Pelosi any day of the week. I'm THAT disappointed in Nancy Pelosi's performance! I don't think we should consider Pelosi's gender when she just plain sucks, I don't care if she IS the first female Speaker. Until Pelosi starts DOING HER JOB I'm supporting Cindy Sheehan!!!

[Psephos]

41. We seem to have an emperess with no clothes

Hat tip to Hans Christian Andersen.

I don't want to bash Pelosi, and I equally don't want to shove stuff under the carpet. I'm glad that you said what needed to be said, J R.

The best situation would be for the House and its leaders to start doing what was promised last fall.

[ixion]

130. I was behind her until that point, too

but her saying that was a blatant capitulation to BushCo, IMO.

[proud2BlibKansan]

147. Got a better idea?

[Zhade]

202. Well, it's not like Pelosi's doing the important work with that seniority.

SOMEONE needs to get serious about holding these criminals accountable.

[yurbud]

291. those stupid fucks sure aren't responding to anything else except corporate donors.

[ayeshahaqqiqa]

3. Go Cindy!

The people are speaking out about this. It's time for the "leadership" to catch up.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

15. damned straight. except it is way past the time for them to catch up.

and shame on us for not pushing them faster and harder.

[Middle finga]

4. I'll support her and I'm not even from Cali

[ohio2007]

90. moot point. you don't cast a vote in that contest nt

[jgraz]

98. Are you trying to say votes count more than money?

:rofl: stop it, you're killing me!

[ohio2007]

175. You can buy elections without votes, yes,thats a given

but remember,
a fool and his money are soon parted

[jgraz]

178. "a fool and his money are soon parted"

Tell me about it. I gave 1k to Kerry in '04 :banghead:

My real, non-smartass point is that anyone can support a candidate, and support them well, without having to cast a vote for them. There's donations, posts, volunteering, etc. In the last election, I didn't vote for ANY of the candidates I "supported". Simply casting a Berkeley vote for Barbara Lee and Barbara Boxer is truly the definition of "the least you can do".

[proud2BlibKansan]

321. But you can donate to a campaign regardless of where you live

[Decruiter]

372. Send in that woman in Crawford

She can carry the ball.




YOU gonna do it?

[2008]

6. oh HELL yes

that's the best news I've heard all day

[uberllama42]

229. I'd just like to say

that that was a great reaction. I felt the same way.

[rodeodance]

7. I have noticed that the media has taken some interest in her.

[OffWithTheirHeads]

8. I would much rather she ran against Di Fi

Actually, I would much rather see "The Dick" impeached and "The idiot King" indicted. That way President "The Dick" can't pardon his little hand job puppet.

Running against Pelosi is, I don't think, a good idea.

[hooraydems06]

132. I totally agree...

She seems to be interested in running against every woman in office other than Dianne Feinstein, who really deserves it! I don't understand why she didn't run on either the Green ticket or Peace and Freedom ticket last year against her for the senate seat.

If this is just a warm-up for that in 2012, great. Otherwise, leave Pelosi alone, Cindy.

[surfermaw]

9. She should be working to get more democrats in the houses.

[LiberalFighter]

37. There you go... That would also put pressure on Pelosi to put impeachment back on table

Targeting Democrats AND of course Republicans that

a) Don't support impeachment
b) Continue to support the Iraq War

[proud2BlibKansan]

149. She did that

Hell, we all did that for the last election. And where did it get us? 6 months later, we are still at war, we still have a criminal in the White House and we have a Democratic majority in Congress that ignores the will of the people.

So working to get Democrats elected accomplishes what exactly?

[thereismore]

11. Cindy is baaack! Nancy has got to be thinking: Cindy is much more

dangerous as an independent, because the only candidate she will syphon votes from is Nancy. If Nancy doesn't want to hand over her seat to a repuke, she better put impeachment on the table real quick.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

62. $$$$$$$$$ WHERE DO I SEND $$$$$$$$$$ $$$$$$$$$ WHERE DO I SEND $$$$$$$$$$

Tell me where to send the check.

Cindy will do San Francisco right.

It's about time that city got someone elected with ..........balls.

[ohio2007]

91. Is Cindy even a resident in the Pelosi district ?

just sayin

[proud2BlibKansan]

150. She will move there

[mtowngman]

158. I believe I read today that California has no residency requirements

for congressional members

[donco]

159. I believe she is still a resident of Vacaville Ca

, don’t know what district that is though, most likely in Pelosi district if she is rattling the Nader saber.

[Retrograde]

338. so if she's planning to move,

why not move to a district that currently has a Republican representative in Congress, such as one in Southern California, rather than replacing one of the Democrats in the Bay Area delegation? She'll have just as much seniority if she gets elected, and potentially increases the (D)s in the House. A much better move strategically, IMHO: as much as I'd like to see immediate change after 2006, reality doesn't necessarily agree. The Democratic edge is not big enough for radical, veto-proof change: the GOP still controls 2 branches of the government, with a sizable minority in the 3rd.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

189. If Dick Cheney and George Bush can circumvent the Constitution

........by moving from one state to another so that both are not from the same state (as prohibited by the Constitution)............I'm sure that Cindy can do the same in what the ................TWO years to do the same!!!

[hooraydems06]

133. A repuke...

... will *NEVER* win Nancy's seat. NEVER.

[fujiyama]

13. Sounds like a waste of time to me

I somehow doubt this is going to keep Pelosi up at night.

[LiberalFighter]

38. How long did it take for Nixon to resign after the Watergate breakin?

Between now and early next year we should be able to get impeachment proceedings started. Maybe closer to the election so that the Republicans up for re-election get pounded in their own races.

[Nightjock]

14. I think I like this move by Cindy

But I am not sure yet......
My first instinct is we have to make Pelosi and other dems listen and ACT to the people who put them back in the majority. If someone has a better idea......?

[harun]

333. I think it is brilliant

We have to keep the publicity up on how serious the people are about ending the occupation of Iraq. The elected leaders are not there because we just like them so much, they are there for one reason only and that is to get the job done that we want done, period. They need to be reminded to do that job and not get sidetracked by the nonsense of washington bickering. Do the job or get the boot.

[Chichiri]

16. I hope Nancy gets the message.

If not, and if I lived in that district, I'd have a very hard time deciding whom to vote for.

[qazplm]

17. sheehan

wouldnt stand a chance quite frankly. But, everyone has a right to run if they qualify.

[hooraydems06]

136. Well, Sheehan...

... stands more chance to win the seat than a Republican does in a three-way race (contrary to some worries by some not so educated people) -- I'll tell you that.

[Maribelle]

19. Sheehan voted for Bush

Shame on Sheehan for blaming Pelosi for Sheehan's own stupidity and ignorance. The work Gore could have accomplished in the last seven years was stolen from my children by the likes of Sheehan - - and I will never ever forgive them for the rest of my life.

This Iraqi war and all the additional damage that has been done to our environment would not have happened had Gore been president.

[Moochy]

22. self-delete

I'm an idgit who can't read pronouns.

[Maribelle]

24. "by the likes of" ... "them" ....

If you tell me which language you do understand, I would be more than happy to translate for you.

[ima_sinnic]

26. Cindy has gone the extra mile in atoning for that mistake

--even people who voted for Gore have not made the sacrifices, run the risks, subjected themselves to the ridicule, displayed the courage, and walked the walk that Cindy has. Her epiphany should be an inspiration, not subject to belittlement and disparaging. Would that all well-meaning but deluded repuke voters would have her insight and courage.

Furthermore, Gore DID win, in case you didn't notice. It is not Cindy's fault that the pin-headed prick was anointed by judicial fiat.

[Maribelle]

32. Oh please. Atoning? Eskimo villages are plunging into the Artic Ocean ......

Perhaps some people that voted for Gore have not made sacrifices.

But others - - - - innocent others - - - are paying a far greater price than Sheehan could ever pay.

What about those suffering from Cancer? Do you think money Bush spent on Iraq could have been spent on Cancer research? Treatments could be far better today, and even maybe, perhaps by some remote miracle, a total cure could have been found by now.


And that's just the tip of the (melting) iceberg.

[dsa]

50. Oh brother

So now voting republican causes cancer? :crazy:

[Maribelle]

92. Do you think money Bush spent on Iraq could have been spent on Cancer research?

I asked a valid question. Sorry if it was over you head.

[Big Pappa]

119. Thanks

for the hostility. Take a breath before responding. You will feel better.

[ima_sinnic]

77. I see--Cindy is now supposed to come up with the cure for cancer

You are welcome to your hatred of anyone who voted for Bush, no matter what contribution they have made since, but I already find you tiresome. Apparently her one misjudgment, her sin of using her constitutionally guaranteed right to vote for whomever she wanted, a vote for someone you didn't, is unforgivable in your high and mighty, sanctimonious, perfect eyes. Her sin of not being able to predict the future, not know (as you apparently have known, oh omniscient one) that having * as president would not only cause her son to be murdered in a useless war, but also to greatly further the ecological collapse of the planet--she can never redeem herself from that, her humanness.

I will continue to respect Cindy--no, to be in awe of her, because I just don't have what it takes to relentlessly pursue the son of a bitch who is squatting in the WH and demand justice. But I'm sure I have some quality that would cause you to hate me, also.

[Maribelle]

Hatred?

Not me. You would not be able to verify your false accusation with anything I posted, especially the one you responded to.

And what I said about Sheehan was Shame on Sheehan for blaming Pelosi for Sheehan's own stupidity and ignorance

The key phrase in that sentence was "for blaming". And while you seem to not understand my point - - it is shameful to blame others for our mistakes, no matter who you are.

And I ask you too: Do you think money Bush spent on Iraq could have been spent on Cancer research? Or is that also over your head?

[DemSoccerMom]

166. Yes.

I think the money could have been spent on cancer research. Or it could have been spent on Parkinson's research. Or diabetes research. Or poly-cystic ovarian syndrome research.

The money could have been spent on plenty of different things. However, I think you may be missing the point. Just because it COULD have been spent on any number of worthy causes, doesn't mean it WOULD have been spent that way.

So your point is really rather inflammatory. You seem to be implying that all the money that has been spent thus far in Iraq would have gone to cancer research; however, I have seen no empirical proof that money was taken FROM cancer research to fund the war. If you have such a source, please provide a link.

[Robeysays]

262. she lost her son.

i think if she feels that the democrats have failed her, she has the civil obligation to run for the seat. It's called democracy, not those in power are right no matter what.

[creeksneakers2]

51. Cindy doesn't care one bit about what happens to people

This isn't the first time she's tried to start trouble like this. Cindy announced she was going to run against Hillary Clinton and Dianne Feinstein too. Is Cindy ever going to threaten to run against a Republican? No. Here's why.

Cindy thinks everybody should believe in her and her alone. She doesn't see anything as a movement objective. She sees Nancy Pelosi and Hillary Clinton and Dianne Feinstein as competitors for attention that Cindy wants for herself.

The same far lefties who could have prevented Iraq and impeachment and all these things could have helped the Democrats instead of the Republicans in 2000 and none of this would have happened. They've done everything to could do to hurt Democrats since then. They're all meeting in San Francisco now to hurt Pelosi. What terrible thing will these Democrat haters cause next that they'll say is proof that the world isn't following Democrat haters enough?

The most stupid thing about Cindy's strategy she closes her eyes to. Cindy says that if we don't agree with everybody else on our side we ought to splinter off. That means she's forming an organization of people who refuse to compromise. But you can't form an organization WITHOUT compromise. In Cindy's phony resignation letter, one of the reasons she gave for leaving was that the people in her movement wouldn't all agree and fought with each other. What did the dumb bitch think would happen? Oh,that's right, she thought everybody would follow HER but would not follow anybody else they might have a difference with.

Cindy should think how if feels for Nancy Pelosi to work day and night to stop George Bush only to have her supporters stab her in the back.

I know what I'm saying will make lots of people mad and I've been holding back for as long as Cindy didn't work for Republicans. I wish that lady would go home.

[ima_sinnic]

80. oh please -- Nancy's working "day & night" to "stop George Bush"?

when did that start?

All I see is appeasement and kowtowing.

I notice you are one of several who have flocked here to diss Cindy -- ho hum, it's so predictable, like the "debunkers" in "the dungeon" coming out en masse to sow discord.

Since Nancy is doing absolutely NOTHING to "stop Bush," I admire anyone who is willing to confront her on the most elemental level.

[creeksneakers2]

106. I'm not from a dungeon

Nor am I part of any flock. The people who are sowing discord are the people who are trying to break the left in half by splintering away from the Democratic Party.

Nancy Pelosi led the Democrats for a bill that mandated withdrawal from Iraq. Bush vetoed that. The votes weren't there to cut off funding. There isn't anything else they can do, yet.

You say she did nothing but that probably means she didn't go off on wild crusades that you think she should be on. Go to her website, look her up on Google. She is far from doing nothing. Come September, you can bet she'll take another shot at Bush.

[knight_of_the_star]

252. Exactly!

I think specifically what happened with the votes disappearing was Hoyer and some of those other Blue Dog Bastards undermining Pelosi to make sure the new funding bill passed.

[Big Pappa]

120. But what if that "discord"

is actually the truth. Of course some really do not like the truth.

[creeksneakers2]

138. If the Democrat haters had truth

they could start a positive movement to elect their own people and stop spending all their efforts on tearing down those who are on our side.

[Big Pappa]

142. I agree completely but,

you specifically mentioned the 9-11 forum and the OCT

[PurpleChez]

227. IS Nancy "on our side"?

I hope she does all of the things her supporters are saying she's gonna do but I don't have high hopes. In November she was my hero...she has not maintained my affections. I so want to see her stand up to the Chimp, and I will be the first to cheer for her WHEN AND IF she does it.

[Moochy]

124. Well They are nothing if not predictable.

If you go through these Cindy threads and see the screeds against Cindy coming from the same Pro-Hilary hyperpartisan jerks. Ignore is your friend, but its not DU's friend.

[emilyg]

263. I resent that.

[Moochy]

259. Hilary's Empty Sock Drawer

More like someone got an instant message and cleaned out their sock drawer...

Sounds imminently reasonable to me, Mother, Soccer, Dem. I for one, fully buy the above post hook, line and sinker.

[ToeBot]

87. And I didn't think anyone at DU really called Sheehan an attention whore, my mistake. nt

[creeksneakers2]

110. If her role in ending the war was so important to her

she wouldn't have even thought of quiting because somebody called her a name.

[Virginia Dare]

309. True, she got upset because of a name she was called on DU...

she should look around and see the names that Nancy Pelosi is being called, compared to that, attention whore is pretty soft.

[proud2BlibKansan]

157. Uh yes they did

Several people on DU called her an attention whore.

[sendero]

317. That's really funny..

.... since almost no one who is successful in politics is NOT an attention whore.

[hooraydems06]

140. I wish she *HAD* run against Feinstein...

... it would have made more sense than running against Pelosi, anyway.

At least Pelosi has been on congressional record as being against Bush's war since she initially voted against it in 2002. Can't say the same about Feinstein.

[proud2BlibKansan]

155. Pelosi is working night and day to stop Bush???

Good grief, where did you ever get that idea?

:rofl:

[creeksneakers2]

176. Places like this

Opposition to Iraq War troop surge of 2007
Main article: Iraq War troop surge of 2007
On January 5, 2007 reacting to suggestions from President Bush’s confidantes that he would increase troop levels in Iraq (which he announced in a speech a few days later) Pelosi joined with Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid to condemn the plan. They sent Bush a letter saying, “there is no purely military solution in Iraq. There is only a political solution. Adding more combat troops will only endanger more Americans and stretch our military to the breaking point for no strategic gain. Rather than deploy additional forces to Iraq, we believe the way forward is to begin the phased redeployment of our forces in the next four to six months, while shifting the principal mission of our forces there from combat to training, logistics, force protection and counter-terror.”<16>

On February 15, 2007 it was reported that Pelosi said President Bush lacks the authority to invade Iran without specific approval from Congress, "I do believe that Congress should assert itself, though, and make it very clear that there is no previous authority for the president, any president, to go into Iran."<17>

ALSO

In 2002, Pelosi opposed the Iraq Resolution authorizing President Bush to use military force against Iraq,<45> while stating that Iraq, like "other countries of concern", had WMD.<46> In explaining her opposition to the resolution, Pelosi noted that Central Intelligence Agency Director George Tenet had told Congress that the likelihood of Iraq's Saddam Hussein launching an attack on the U.S. using weapons of mass destruction was low. "This is about the Constitution," Pelosi said. "It is about this Congress asserting its right to declare war when we are fully aware what the challenges are to us. It is about respecting the United Nations and a multilateral approach, which is safer for our troops."

ALSO

DISPLAYING ABSTRACT - House Democrats may push ahead with new war spending bill that would provide money for combat operations through midsummer, withholding rest of funds sought by Pres Bush until commanders in Iraq provide report on conditions there; proposal is intended to keep pressure on Bush over his conduct of war; Speaker Nancy Pelosi is said to be leaning toward this approach; measure would not include timeline for withdrawal, but would require second vote by Congress to release bulk of money; spokesman for Sen Harry Reid, majority leader, softens his tone about concept Democratic Senators had earlier dismissed; Republicans are putting new emphasis on need for White House and Iraqi leaders to begin showing some results by Sept

ALSO

Top US congressional Democrats bluntly told President George W. Bush Wednesday that his Iraq troop "surge" policy was a failure.
Senate Majority leader Harry Reid and House of Representatives Speaker Nancy Pelosi challenged the president over Iraq by sending him a letter, ahead of a White House meeting later on Wednesday.

"As many had forseen, the escalation has failed to produce the intended results," the two leaders wrote.

"The increase in US forces has had little impact in curbing the violence or fostering political reconciliation.

"It has not enhanced Americas national security. The unsettling reality is that instances of violence against Iraqis remain high and attacks on US forces have increased.

"In fact, the last two months of the war were the deadliest to date for US troops.

The letter appeared to preview a fresh showdown over Iraq between anti-war Democrats and the president, just a few weeks after Bush forced his foes to strip troop withdrawal timelines from a 100 billion dollar emergency war budget.

It also came a few days after the US military mourned its 3,500th soldier killed in action in Iraq.

Pelosi and Reid told Bush in the letter that they planned to send him new legislation to "limit the US mission in Iraq, begin the phased redeployment of US forces, and bring the war to a responsible end."

On Tuesday, Reid said that Senate Democrats would attach troop withdrawal deadlines to a Defense Department Authorization bill, due to be debated within weeks

MANY MORE BUT
IF PELOSI DID WHAT THE CINDY SHEEHAN WING WANTED

She'd be ignoring Bush and trying to get rid of Harry Reid. That would be right in line with Cindy's goals.

[Sonicmedusa]

165. Believe me, I think Cindy has a good sense of that.

" Cindy should think how if feels for Nancy Pelosi to work day and night to stop George Bush only to have her supporters stab her in the back. "

I only wished I lived in SF just to vote for Cindy. I can still send her money, though

[Middle finga]

246. Maybe Nancy need a high profile threat from Cindy

because she seem to be ignoring the angry letters and email she's been receiving. Cindy sent Nancy a challenge that she'll have to answer because Cindy's ultimatum has made the national headlines unlike the thousands of emails and phone calls that we make that she chooses to ignore.

[Vidar]

272. Pelosi has squandered the 65 % initial approval rating this Congress had

through her downright appeasement of Bush. "Working day and night to stop Bush"--what a joke.

[sendero]

319. Exactly..

... so many here want to attribute the dismal, literally DISMAL rating the congress is getting right now to the Republicans - pure folly on their part.

Rank and file Americans see that NOTHING is happening. Bush continues to act like a belligerent tot and only Waxman, Leahy and Conyers are doing JACK about it and they cannot do it all on their own.

Americans are giving Congress a 19% approval rating because the pukes are still acting like thugs and the Dems are cowering in the corner.

[NoSheep]

334. "Cindy thinks everybody should believe in her and her alone." ? Where did that come from?

I think she's just trying to do what she CAN do; what her conscience tells her to do. You may disagree with her choices of WHAT she does, but making a statement like that is off base. I think she hopes to inspire all of us to do what we can, NOT worship her. What evidence do you have for that?

I feel she'd like us to support her efforts and ANYONE'S who is willing to sacrifice their time and energy to affect change if we agree with them. It is only a mere assumption on your part as to what her motives are.

You also said: "Cindy should think how it feels for Nancy Pelosi to work day and night to stop George Bush only to have her supporters stab her in the back". I feel it is fair to criticize her for not having the spine to lead the cause for impeachment.

In post 77, someone quotes Pelosi as saying: Bush is a"LOVELY" human being from a "PATRIOTIC" family!
Pelosi has also said impeachment is off the table.
Both those statements sound insane to me under the circumstances. We got out and voted for change where Iraq is concerned but with Pelosi, we are nowhere it seems.

I'm responding to your post not because I disagree with everything Nancy Pelosi has done but because I think your post reads that you care about fairness and I don't think you yourself are being very fair when you make such absolute statements about Cindy Sheehan's motives for what she does.

[creeksneakers2]

337. I got it from her resignation letter

Cindy thinks she's the center of everything:

"I became the so-called "Face" of the American anti-war movement."

"I guess no one paid attention to me when I said that the issue of peace and people dying for no reason is not a matter of "right or left", but "right and wrong."

If everybody doesn't agree she whines that nobody listened to her? Should everybody listen to her?(manipulative too)

Manipulation:

"The most devastating conclusion that I reached this morning, however, was that Casey did indeed die for nothing."

Professes that adhesiveness to the group should take a back seat except when its HER group:

"I have also tried to work within a peace movement that often puts personal egos above peace and human life. This group wont work with that group; he wont attend an event if she is going to be there; and why does Cindy Sheehan get all the attention anyway? It is hard to work for peace when the very movement that is named after it has so many divisions."

Cindy apologizes but says she can't remake the whole country if they don't all listen to her (in manipulation speech):

"Good-bye America ...you are not the country that I love and I finally realized no matter how much I sacrifice, I cant make you be that country unless you want it"


OTHERS can draw a different conclusion. I drew the one I posted.

[NoSheep]

350. I can certainly see your point from the quotes you cite. (But truth is truth)

I can't help being reminded of the incident when John Lennon said in so many words at a press conference that the Beatles were bigger than Jesus. And just how misunderstood that quote became and how much he was hated for saying it by many who identified themselves as Christians.
The fact is, the Beatles were becoming a savior for many...it was just the truth.

When I read those quotes you listed, I just see the sad truth:

1. She did become the face of the war movement. (At first it was just Cindy getting noticed).
2. Most people did not pay "attention to her when she said that the issue of peace and people dying for no reason is not a matter of "right or left", but "right and wrong."
3. It is a devastating fact that her son Casey, (and all our military people) died in Iraq for nothing. (but $ in the pockets of the military industrial complex)
4. The peace movement does have many divisions to its detriment.
5. Her efforts (and I would imply the efforts of others as well) will not make this a better country unless we want it.

I wish it weren't so easy to bash her. If she were a faceless, voiceless creature, it would be impossible, but the American people cannot continue to be faceless and voiceless while the government kills our children and our moms and dads and sacrifices a large innocent population in another country.

I'm sure there are many others working for peace in ways that aren't as visible...but we need the visible. We need Cindy and Code Pink. We need them to stand up and tell the truth. Out loud.

Nancy Pelosi is an elected official whose constituency has spoken. The majority of this country has spoken. I feel she deserves the harshest criticism for "being polite". Cindy Sheehan, on the other hand, shouldn't have to be polite. She shouldn't have to worry about being seen as an egomaniac just because she speaks the truth.

Thanks for being willing to discuss this. It's hard. This thread shows how hard it is.

[bitchkitty]

302. thank you n/t

[dbackjon]

36. Amen

[fightthegoodfightnow]

56. What the Heck do you think FUELS Sheehan?

At least she is angry, which is alot more than we can say about Hillary Clinton who gives lip service to ending this war, but voted to extend it and its funding.

[creeksneakers2]

183. That isn't true

Hillary voted against extending funding for the war.

[PurpleChez]

93. I hate the chimp as much as anybody, but....

CheneyBushRove stole the last seven years, not Sheehan, and not any other individual Bush voter. I have a lot of hate for the bushies, but "I will never ever forgive them (bush voters) for the rest of my life" strikes me as a bit much.

[hooraydems06]

144. I don't blame Sheehan for Bush currently being in power...

... especially considering her vote for him being cast in a blue state that went to Gore anyway...

... and although I can't say that I support those who voted for Bush, especially in those states that went red, either because that's what voters wanted or because they just happened to live in Florida, I can forgive those who have since seen the truth about him.

The only ones I blame for Bush still being in power are the pathetically deluded 26% that *STILL* continue to support him and provide just enough of a base for the idiot to do things like pardon... uh, I'm sorry "commute" Scooter Libby.

So they certainly deserve far more of the blame than Sheehan, Pelosi, or even Dianne Feinstein, whom I feel is a far more deserving target of Sheehan's "wrath" than Nancy. Why didn't Sheehan make good on her threat and run as either an Indy, a Green, or a Peace and Freedom against Feinstein in '06, anyway?

[PurpleChez]

177. I wonder about that 26%....

Especially back when the chimp had numbers in the 50s I would think "there is no way that half of the country actually supports this imbicile. Even now at 26% I wonder how many of those people, first and foremost, support *Conservativism* and don't want to face or admit to what their boy has done.

[independentpiney]

145. Yep she voted for Bush- then HER son died and everything changed

she's a selfish narcissistic bitch imo.

[DemSoccerMom]

167. Why must we resort to 2nd grade name-calling tactics? n/t

[Le Taz Hot]

313. Way, way, WAAAAYYYY

over the top.

[proud2BlibKansan]

154. Where the hell did you get that idea?

No she did NOT vote for Bush. What a pile of horse pucky!
:rofl:

[hooraydems06]

201. Actually...

... she did... but it was in 2000, not 2004.

[proud2BlibKansan]

237. Link? Proof?

[hooraydems06]

250. I will give you links...

... but as far as them being "proof" positive, I can't guarantee you that as scientific evidence or proof sufficient for a court of law but if she had not I would see Sheehan denying it, and clearly there is no reporting that she has if you follow the first 20 or so search results on the topic.

As I said, links, but not necessarily proof positive.

There's also the fact that the following 8 or so links turn up 0 search results. You would think conflicting reports would have turned up somewhere.


1.
2.
3.
4.

UPDATE -- here's one person who says she voted for Al Gore, but it's someone who considers that a derogatory thing. And he's gay, but though that's interesting to note, not that relevant to this particular conversation. Perhaps Cindy would care to set the record straight herself, and then snopes.com can take this up either way.

[proud2BlibKansan]

258. Ramblings from blogs are not evidence

:rofl:

[Name removed]

25. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Baclava]

27. Kee-rist......what a circus. This is a joke, right?

What next, juggling bears and dancing dogs?

A stunt like this does nothing but marginalize the election process.

Focus people. Loose cannons do more harm than good.

[paulk]

28. well, I would say that it marginalizes Sheehan

if she already hadn't completely marginalized herself. The last thing the impeachment crowd needs is Cindy on their side...

[w4rma]

31. This does marginalize Sheehan. It doesn't help her cause.

You don't win by fighting a battle you know you'll lose. That only wastes precious resources which are needed to win winnable battles. You win by fighting battles that you can win.

Why doesn't Sheehan run for a seat that she can actually win and then serve in Congress?

[grytpype]

29. Thanks, Crazy Lady!

Now we'll get our impeachment for sure!!!!!

!!!

She's not an attention whore so stop saying that!!!

Goddammit!!!!!!!!

[ohio2007]

30. Bet Cindy pulls at least 3 % in '08..no more than 5% nt

[Luminous Animal]

39. You underestimate San Francisco.

There is a sizable segment of Pelosi voters who are pissed off that Pelosi seems more interested in playing the power broker than representing her constituency. Keep in mind that San Francisco nearly elected a Green Party mayor who waged a campaign with about 1/10th the funding as the Democratic candidate Gavin Newsom

[Tekla West]

179. I live and vote in Nancy's district.

Yes, many of us are mad at her - Big Time. That does not mean a one note platform is going to beat her. Gaven Newsome would have better odds, and he ain't gonna do it.

[hooraydems06]

203. Yeah, because Newsom and Pelosi are definitely made of the same mold...

... they oppose war, support marriage equality, but when it comes to taking on the corrupting influence of corporations in their district and across the country, they'll fold like a cheap suit.

[maximusveritas]

59. The Green candidate got 8 % against her in 2006

So I would anticipate Sheehan getting at least that much of the vote if she carried through with this, but my gut tells me she won't.

[ohio2007]

85. She will siphon some of the Greens vote but the hard core Pelosi minions

will destroy Cindy.
You know, politics as usual.
Only a matter of time til she is labeled a Carl Rove puppet stooge.

[IndianaGreen]

34. Nancy Pelosi is the one that put impeachment "off the table."

Pelosi is an enabler of Bush and Cheney's crimes because she is blocking Dennis Kucinich's HR 333 from getting a hearing on the House. The impeachment of Cheney is paramount!

I hope we get a real San Francisco liberal to challenge Pelosi in the Democratic primary next year, or get Maxine Waters to challenge Pelosi for the Speaker's chair.

[LiberalFighter]

44. Is there enough for the Senate to convict Bush/Cheney in an impeachment proceeding?

Remember, just because the facts may be there does not mean Republicans will consider charges sufficient for conviction. Conviction requires a 2/3 vote of those present. A maximum of 67 votes with at least 17 of those needing to be Republicans. Lieberman probably won't vote to convict.

Democrats need to present a strong case that Republicans can't ignore. But, too many of these Republicans wouldn't care if one of their own was getting a blow job.

IF many of their hard cored supporters were to start demanding impeachment then that would be a different story.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

55. Conviction? How about Right and Wrong?

How about standing up for what is right.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

164. but she's female and has seniority! how can you let right and wrong come in?

sheesh. What a bunk set of arguments. If she fails to do her job, she must be told, and allowed to change, or she must be removed. I suspect the threat of removal will have more of an impact than anything else. We need to use it against 434 others as well.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

194. And the Prize Goes to CINDY

..........not NANCY.

[Virginia Dare]

310. You're comparing apples and oranges..

Cindy is not a politician yet.

[freefall]

65. Impeachment takes place in the House not the Senate and

it doesn't require a two-thirds vote just a majority. Being impeached is like being indicted. After impeachment the issues goes to the Senate for the trial. A two-thirds vote is required for removal from office. Clinton was impeached; he was acquitted at trial in the Senate as was Andrew Johnson after the Civil War. Both were acquitted in the Senate trial. Nixon resigned when he realized he was to be impeached. You can read about the actual process here:

http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/thepresidentandcabinet/a/impeachment.htm

During the impeachment process (lots of hearings to begin with) the hope would be that the light being shone on the President and Vice President's past illegal actions would prevent them from committing more. Also, efforts to bring the troops home need not stop and would likely be strengthened.

Peace,

freefall

[LiberalFighter]

104. Why do you think I included the word convict in my posting?

Only the Senate can convict and it is by 2/3 present.

[BearSquirrel2]

270. Nixon ...

Nixon resigned when he realized he was to be impeached

Nixon knew he was going to be impeached for quite some time. He resigned when Barry Goldwater paid him a visit and told him that the Republicans didn't have his back and he would be the first president in history to be convicted and removed from office.

[datavg]

70. It Could Very Well Be...

...that Pelosi won't spend the political capital necessary for impeachment because she doesn't have the votes in the House and damn well knows she wouldn't have the votes in the United States Senate.

Attempting an impeachment this close to the primaries would hopelessly poison the process and open the door for talk radio and Fox News and the bloggers to dump train loads of shit on top of the organized left. She can't take the risk, and that's why impeachment is off the table.

Is the Democratic party dead?

[IndianaGreen]

97. The Democratic Party is dead if it fails to impeach Cheney and defund the war

Pelosi is expendable!

The Constitution and the Republic must be saved by impeaching Cheney.

[datavg]

100. Well...

...I hate to tell ya, but that's not gonna happen. Pelosi doesn't have the votes in the House for impeachment and sure as hell doesn't have the votes in the Senate to sustain it.

Pelosi is expendable? That explains why she's having a hard time holding her coalition together.

Can you say Speaker Boehner?

[IndianaGreen]

111. Can you say Speaker Maxine Waters or John Conyers?

Either of them would be preferrable to the appeaser Pelosi.

The only reason Democrats took Congress is because the voters thought, wrongly as it turned out, that the Democrats would bring the war to an end. The voters won't be fooled again!

[Big Pappa]

122. John Conyers?

He is a little to paranoid for me. Mrs. Waters would probably be better.

[Le Taz Hot]

314. Speaker Waters . . .

What a nice sound that has . . .

[iamjoy]

336. Nah, Speaker Hoyer

I hope Ms. Sheehan is familiar enough with civics to realize that if she somehow beats Congresswoman Pelosi in the primary and then wins the general election that she does not become speaker. The Democrats will elect a new one, who may well be Steny Hoyer.

Ms. Sheehan's motives are good, but I disagree with her approach. Going after Pelosi is like throwing in jail the person who watches the abuse without intervening while letting the actual abuser go free. This is not to say enablers should get a free pass, but that we should focus our efforts on the ones who actively (not passively) supported the wrong doing.

Why not run after Republican seats and help progressive Democrats in competitive races? Why not form a movement to back progressive Democrats who will run against those who actually voted for the funding? It may not get as much attention as running against Pelosi, but it will do a lot more good.

[IndianaGreen]

373. Hoyer won't fly as speaker. He is prowar and he is indebted to K Street.

Beltway Democrats are increasingly casting themselves as the Mensheviks of the 21st century. Opposed to the Tsar, but unable to neutralize him, and incapable of ending the Tsar's war.

[Drunken Irishman]

274. You're right with this one.

As much as I hate it, there are Democrats that won't vote to impeach because it automatically means they'll probably lose their seat in the house to a Republican. Here in Utah our lone Democrat is Jim Matheson and I know for a fact he wouldn't vote to impeach, because it would doom him to an election loss. He's constantly seen as one of the most vulnerable Democrats and a vote like that would seal his fate. There are a lot more Democrats in the House that face this scenario and they won't vote to impeach.

The problem here is that people don't look at it in this way. Or they do and believe a moral victory of impeachment is worth losing the House. If we force a vote and the Democrats lose, which they probably will, it'll look REALLY bad on our part. You can't force every Democrat to vote because there are just too many districts there that won't support the thought. The only way it could ever happen is if Democrats had 60% or more of the house, where they could survive with those conservative Matheson type Democrats voting "No" to save their butts.

[subsuelo]

117. it's too late

[ohio2007]

107. Voting for impeachment is to vote for a trial. That is a long drawn out

circus side show in itself.
If not enough votes are there to put any clown on trial, guess what?
no circus side show.

If the votes are there to continue the political face time in front of C span then a trial may start.

Again, a circus sideshow that would only increase C-span viewership for a certain legnth of time but by the time a vote to remove one or both from office came to the floor,we most likely will have a new administration already in the oval office.
jmo

[Name removed]

35. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[tinrobot]

40. Run on an 'Impeach Bush' platform the year he leaves office?

Seems rather pointless to me. Even if she does win, Bush will be gone by the time she takes office.

I'd think she'd do better running on a peace platform and taking Pelosi to task for not ending the war.

[ccpup]

42. I'm really, really trying to like

Sheehan, but announcements like this raise doubts about her in my mind. And what else will she offer the constituents in Speaker Pelosi's District? What does Sheehan know about the other challenges that face Speaker Pelosi's Constituents?

Despite Miss Sheehan's obvious pain at the loss of her son, the Election will be more about the war in Iraq and I wonder how Miss Sheehan will do when it comes to answering the Voter's concerns about the more mundane, though important, aspects of representing one's constituents. If it's all about the war with Miss Sheehan, then she'll have a hard time. If she's asked questions in the debate that she's unprepared for and has obviously very little real knowledge about, she'll have a hard time. But if she actually lives in the District, becomes familiar with the constituents and their needs, it could be easier. But saying you'll run against Speaker Pelosi and actually doing it successfully are two totally different kettle-o'-fish.

[Fiendish Thingy]

43. If Cindy runs, I will send her money, if only to hold Pelosi accountable...

for not defending the Constitution.

Having said that, I think the next 60-90 days could get very interesting, and not because of Cindy. There's a whole lot of feces primed to hit the fan...

[0007]

45. Go girl go!!

Please wake up Nancy.

[dsa]

46. I'm glad I don't live in that district

This hypothetical election would be like choosing between two shrill, angry women who couldn't lead her way out of a paper bag.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

69. Yea.........We've Seen What Dean has Done in Regards to That

I supported Dean when he was angry and outspoken on issues that impacted liberals.

Now he's nothing but a putz working to stay in the paper bag of money.

[bitchkitty]

303. Putz yourself

Dean's got his warts, but he's the only reason that when I have it to give, I give my paltry few bucks to the Democrats.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

358. You Said It: Dean has his WARTS

I gave to his last Presidential campaign, because I thought he spoke to, as he said, the "Democratic wing of the Democratic party."

But now that he heads that party, he has become much more of a centrist. If his actions make me a 'putz' because I disagree with his political sellout, so be it.

What's your excuse?

[Name removed]

71. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Big Pappa]

Since you have

been here so long maybe you could use a refresher course in DU rules like, not pointing out post counts or making personnel attacks.

[Divine Discontent]

283. not gonna play blind to the RW mentality

of the dozens of freepers who come on here to stir up trouble, or the ones who are so sick of JR. destroying their party that they are calling themselves independents and coming onto our site to run JR. down b/c freeperville won't let them - so I don't care - really - I'll call a spade a spade anyday.

And YOU calling JOHN CONYERS what you did, when he's worked so hard to get accountability put upon this evil adm. is HORRIBLE!

[Danger Mouse]

347. personal attacks are never okay.

some people (myself included) don't care for cindy sheehan or her actions and feel we have a right to say so. to call all of us freeper trolls just because you don't like what we're saying isn't cool.
contrary to what you seem to want, DUer's are allowed to criticize cindy sheehan, but YOU are not allowed to attack them personally for doing so. those are the DU RULES.

[Big Pappa]

355. First since you have been here longer

than us "newbies", if you think someone is disrupting that is what the alert button is for. Second, I stand behind what I said about Mr. Conyers and his ability to lead Congress. I like the guy, but that is not the job for him.

[hooraydems06]

208. THANK YOU, the martyrd!!!

I love hearing people who are probably closet Rush Limbaugh supporters calling Randi Rhodes "shrill"... and the same goes for people who are probably Ann Coulter supporters talking about Sheehan and Pelosi being one and the same. Honestly, what a joke sometimes.

[Divine Discontent]

282. yw!

I knew it'd get yanked but I'm tired of the Limbaugh/Hannity closet-repubs who JUST/ONLY want B*sh out of office to protect their party that they're coming to the center and getting on our website b/c the nutjob freeper site won't let them talk about B*sh getting impeached - so they come here and then in turn spew their anti-Dem crap like calling Cindy and Nancy BOTH "SHRILL WOMEN" but yet, their post gets LEFT up... sigh..... Glad we could donate to the site to give the RW nuts a forum to run down women!

[dsa]

287. I am a woman...

...and I'm fed up with people like Sheehan who alienate people and drive them away. We need more women in politics like Hillary Clinton, Diane Feinstein and Janet Napolitano who bring people together to solve problems.

[Divine Discontent]

292. Feinstein is the most conservative Senator that's a Democrat

and half the country cannot STAND Hillary, and that # is 60-70% in states that she effectively would give to the Republicans if she's the nom - so I wouldn't use her as an example of bringing people together, sorry. Napolitano is very good at it, Feinstein is also, although it's unfortunate she isn't more liberal, although I respect her.

Sheehan is an ANTIWAR movement speaker - so she's gonna be hated just like Fonda - woopdee doo! I'm glad we have someone throwing a fit about the war - our Congress is failing us - and if you don't think the places where Democratic candidates took over from a Repub aren't ticked off the Dems aren't stopping the war funding - then you're mistaken - we risk losing those seats in 08 and 12 when they come around again.

It's shocking that despite the high crimes they have assaulted upon the American people and against the Constitution, that people like Pelosi aren't listening to her constituents and calling for impeachment - for who knows what reason - because none makes sense I've heard!

Thanks for writing, anyhow. I know we're both on the same side, just with differing opinions. But, when all my moderate friends are telling me Congress sucks, that's not a good sign for 08 or for ending the war - as it means they're not doing the job they were clearly elected to do.

[Geek_Girl]

47. Maybe this will wake up the democratic party and they'll realize

they can't take the base for granted.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

64. E....X...A...C....T....L....Y

E....X...A...C....T....L....Y

[uppityperson]

101. exactly. Anyone can run for anything, hold all their feet to the fire

ok, anyone can't run for anything, only if they are legally able to, but if they are they can. I doubt she has a chance of succeeding but holding Pelosi's feet to the base's fire is good.

[paulk]

125. someone who's going to run against a Democrat

and who's already declared themselves not a member of the party

is not a member of the base.

[IndianaGreen]

134. Lieberman ran against a Democrat, and he was rewarded with a committee chair

Reid made Lieberman the chair for Homeland Security.

Such hypocrisy! If you are against the DLC agenda, such as the war, you are punished if you don't toe the party line. If you are an AIPAC agent and a Bush ass kisser like Lieberman, you get Bill Clinton to campaign for you, and then you get rewarded by being put in charge over the committee that oversees the Homeland Security Department.

[Moochy]

173. But Lieberman might have switched parties

Was he blackmailing Reid?

[paulk]

198. probably

[hooraydems06]

211. What I don't understand is what kind of 'blackmail'...

... made *SO* many voters in Connecticut (not counting the Republicans, who alone wouldn't have been enough) fall for his act just long enough to give him another six years in office. Convenient that so many of them regret it now. Honestly, what the hell did they expect? Why do so many people seem to get fooled by the slimiest, most dishonest, "moderate" politicians?

[Yukari Yakumo]

342. Rewarded isn't the word I'd use.

Bribed is more like it.

Without LIEbermann, Congress would've been even split 50-50 w/ Cheney casting the deciding vote. If that happened, say bye-bye to subpoena power and oversight.

[Geek_Girl]

225. No she is not but the Base for the most part is anti-war

and pro-impeachment. By declaring her candidacy she will be giving the anti-war voters in San Francisco a choice. So Pelosi really should not take her constituents for granted.

[creeksneakers2]

152. They said that when t hey screwed us in 2000 too

The message the Democratic Party gets is not to waste time on the far left because nothing is ever good enough for them.

[nevergiveup]

48. The Republicans love this stuff

Thanks Cindy!

[datavg]

60. If Cindy Follows Through On This...

...and weakens the party's campaign for the House races in 2008 and then Hillary ends up winning the nomination, it could have a net effect of driving Republicans to the polls in southern and western states. That would likely result in not only return the House to Republican control but also in putting the GOP back in the White House for possibly another eight years.

Maybe California should just secede from the Union.

I'm serious!

[fightthegoodfightnow]

67. HOGWASH

What is it with Democrats who worry about what the GOP thinks.

Give me a break.

[nevergiveup]

88. I don't give a crap

what the Republicans think but if the Republicans are cheering on the sidelines you might want to take a second look at the possibly ramifications of someone blackmailing Dennis Slime-ball Hastert's replacement as Speaker of the House. Sometimes we forget.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

210. Cheering on the Sidelines?

Oh give me a f*cking break.

I could care less what Republicans think, but obviously you do.

I am so sick and tired of these mealy mouth Democrats who are always running scared about what the GOP thinks.

We didn't take back control of the House and Senate by pandering to the right despite your claims to the contrary.

[nevergiveup]

243. I didn't say anything

about pandering to the right. If you don't get the difference between a Nancy Pelosi and a Dennis Hastert as Speaker of the House then you hostility has reached a level where your reality index is scrambled. I understand your frustration with the lack of interest in impeachment but Cindy's threat of running against her if she doesn't start the impeachment process is not going to scare or pressure Pelosi into starting the impeachment process and you and everyone else with a brain knows it.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

360. You Think that Cindy Sheehan is Going to Turn the House to GOP: Nonsense

The fact that you don't think Pelosi will feel the pressure speaks volumes about what has to happen: Her removal.

Her removal does not mean the House will change political parties. It means the House will have another opportunity to elect, as it does every two years, a new leader.

[Divine Discontent]

285. you're wasting your breath w/that user - many of us agree w/you n/t

[fightthegoodfightnow]

359. Thank You

Hopefully more and more will join us.

[hooraydems06]

212. If they do...

... it's *NOT* because they know that Sheehan will help one of them win Pelosi's district... a GOPher will never win that particular district, and they know it.

[JerseygirlCT]

49. You know, this sits wrong with me. I don't like blackmail.

I'm frustrated, too. But I don't think this is the way to accomplish anything.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

54. Since When is Accountability in a Free Election Blackmail?

Give me a break.

If Nancy Pelosi's agenda doesn't withstand the approval of voters who elected her, she should be outta there.

[Moochy]

74. Oh but look at them try to reframe an election challenge as blackmail

See... If one challenges the party line, one is actually blackmailing. Representatives are now blackmail-able by the citizens they serve. :eyes:

[fightthegoodfightnow]

78. Yea .........it's Ridiculous

When someone argues it's 'blackmail' to hold an elected representative accountable for policies they support or don't, it's become a sad day in America.

[JerseygirlCT]

148. Absolutely, and Cindy has every right to run. It's the

"do as I say by date X or else" part that really rubbed me the wrong way.

[IndianaGreen]

108. The only reason why Pelosi is Speaker is because voters thought Democrats would end the war, instead

they caved-in to Bush and had the audacity to proclaim that they had Bush on the ropes.

Shame!

[creeksneakers2]

121. No thanks to the Greens

They were telling everybody to turn their backs on the Democrats in 2006 too. Now that Democrats won the Greens call them betrayers. Odd.

[IndianaGreen]

139. Why do you think the Democratic Congress is polling lower than Bush?

Or are you going to insult the voters that gave you the Congress in '06 because they fail to see the wisdom of appeasement and doing a BOHICA dance everytime Bush huffs and puffs?

[creeksneakers2]

156. "Appeasement" Sounds dramatic

They aren't going to bring chains in and attack biker gang style. The Democrats are doing what they can. Its not so easy to get out of Iraq. By the way, see how many Democrats did vote to get out of Iraq. Most of the house members voted against it in the first place.

[hooraydems06]

217. Compared to 2000 and 2002...

... very few Greens ran in most competitive states/districts in 2006, and even 2004. They've learned their lesson from the Nadering of Florida and other states in '00, believe me.

But telling them not to run somewhere where the GOP might actually be able to take advantage of their candidacy is one thing. You should not try to censor the Greens from even speaking out however; one way or another, we need an opposition party. There are a lot of great elected Democrats providing a level of opposition, and I personally consider Pelosi one of them, but they are far too fractured to provide any meaningful opposition to much of the Bush agenda. They seem to constantly undermine the positions of each other and then wonder why people like Lieberman are able to take advantage of their failure to unite behind a progressive course and procure himself another six miserable years for those oh so regretful CT independents and "Democrats"...

[creeksneakers2]

356. I didn't try to censor the Greens

I'm just pointing how hypocritical they are. Greens do everything they can to sabotage Democrats. The Democrats won without the Greens in 2006. Now the Greens sanctimoniously act like they speak for the people who stayed the course and voted Dem and won. How can you turn against your friends, then whine that they aren't loyal enough? If it were up to the Greens, there would be zero Democrats.

The Greens never have and never will attempt to actually work to earn seats in Congress. The one characteristic that defines and unifies the Greens is that they refuse to compromise with anybody. How can they form an organization of people who don't compromise? It would be like trying to create a non-conformists' symphony, or the Tropical Outdoor Hockey League.

Greens don't listen to anybody else, so nobody listens to them,even other Greens. The Green party split in half years ago.

Greens know they can't produce anything positive so they don't even try. Greens concentrate on tearing apart the hard work of others. With destruction as their only weapon, they can only feel important when they are threatening someone.

[kurth]

58. Sheehan is an American citizen and has every right to run for Congress

as any Congresscritter currently in office.

[Malva Zebrina]

61. Pelosi should be brought to account.

Why was the first thing she said "impeachment is off the table" the first thing she said and why did Conyers and all the rest, except for Kuchinich, hang up their hats and coats to follow this spineless woman who delights in posing for pics and being the big shot. Why did she say that right off? Hell talk about a deflating baloon--and it gets worse, day by day, and still, IN SPITE OF ALL THE ABUSE, IMPEACHMENT IS STILL "off the table"? Why? We get weaker instead of stronger under the leadership of Pelosi. What does she hope to gain? The fact that we only have really ONLY TWO CHOICES IN AN ELECTION SO therefore we either vote for Dems or Repubs? So f**k you, you voters. You bet.

[graywarrior]

63. Well, this just makes my brain scream and run around in circles. WTF?

Sometimes I just don't understand nuthin'.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

66. Not to Worry......... We Understand what You Don't

We want out of this war and Cindy is on our team.

[graywarrior]

76. I dig Cindy, and I hate what Pelosi is not doing...but sometimes I just

get so confused with what is the right thing to do. No wonder we're all exhausted.

[beyurslf]

68. This is the DEMOCRATIC underground. If you want to support and INDEPENDENT candidate

get your own website. Cindy didn't say she would challenge her in a primary. Cindy has publicly LEFT the DEM party.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

73. WRONG - Nancy Pelosi Left Us

WRONG - Nancy Pelosi Left Us

[brentspeak]

169. Your "concern" has been noted, believe me.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

191. Your "Sincerity" Suggests I Should Not Believe You

Your "Sincerity" Suggests I Should Not Believe You

[beyurslf]

278. No she didn't. She is the Democratic Congresswoman and the House Leader.

She has not left the party just because you disagree with her.

[thereismore]

81. Hey, I thought this was democratic underground, not Democratic underground. WTH?

[Moochy]

105. Yeah doesnt help that it's in ALL CAPS

so which is it?

[Exiled in America]

109. WRONG. This is not Democratic PARTY Underground.com.

Sorry.

[w4rma]

113. Actually, DU policy is to support the Democrat against the independent in general elections.

That happened with LIEberman and it will be applied to Sheehan, also.

[hooraydems06]

220. Not the same thing...

... not the same thing at all. You can go ahead and try to compare those apples to oranges, but it is part of the reason why the Democratic Party is seeing a gradual drop-off in rank and file party affiliation, not to mention the low approval rating of a now Democratic-run Congress.

I supported Ned Lamont, but comparing Lieberman to Cindy Sheehan? That's really sad. Just sad.

[Warren DeMontague]

186. Why don't you try supporting someone who is running against the Democratic candidate in the next

general election, and see what happens.

Or, better yet, read the rules.

[Le Taz Hot]

316. Sheehan is not a candidate

yet. Until then, it's open season.

[Divine Discontent]

75. way to go CINDY!

God bless her! She's forcing the issue of impeachment - if you're against her for this tough... she's got a lot more influence and respect in that district than any of us - Pelosi is pissing off her constituency, which is VERY liberal.

PELOSI just called B*sh a "LOVELY" human being from a "PATRIOTIC" family! BARF.... warmongering uncaring thief is what he is and his anti-American Nazi sympathizing family - CAPITULATE MUCH MS. PELOSI?


www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable <<--- top '08 items & antib*sh stickers!

[kurth]

83. Yep, Bush is a lovely man from a beautiful, lovely, great patriotic family. And he’s a nice person!

NANCY PELOSI: Just so oblivious. He’s a lovely man. You know, he comes from a beautiful, lovely family, great patriotic family, serves in the highest office of the land, leader of the free world. And he’s a nice person.

http://speaker.gov/newsroom/articles?id=0051

[Divine Discontent]

294. EVERY ONE SHOULD READ THE COMMENT I'M RESPONDING TO!

thank you, kurth!

[Moochy]

328. The Charlie Rose Interview

http://www.charlierose.com/shows/2007/06/27/1/a-conversation-with-nancy-pelosi

This was where she praised the president using those words.

[Bitwit1234]

79. She'll only get enough votes to let the republican win.

Might as well come out and say she supports the republicans. I think stuff like that is stupid stupid stupid. There is no way she would ever take the seat so she'll make sure the republicans win it. They will probably send all kinds of money to her like they did to Nader.

[thereismore]

84. Of course we don't want that to happen, but Nancy should consider that and

put the damn impeachment back on the table!

[Bjorn Against]

112. A Republican winning in San Francisco?

Please. This election will either go to Pelosi or Sheehan, the Republicans are about as popular in that district as the plague. There is no chance whatsoever of a Republican taking the seat.

[w4rma]

114. Yes. If the district is drawn so that a left split would give the Republican a plurality. (nt)

[Bjorn Against]

126. Please, look at the election results from that district.

Pelosi got 80.4% and the Green candidate got 7.4%, that means that 87.8% of voters in that district voted for someone on the left end of the political spectrum. The Republican candidate only got 10.8 percent of the vote. There is no way the Republicans could ever get a plurality in San Francisco.

http://www.sos.ca.gov/elections/sov/2006_general/congress.pdf

[hooraydems06]

226. w4rma, please acknowledge this last posting by MN Against Bush...

You too, Bitwit1234

[Arizona_Liberal]

273. I beg to differ

"There is no way the Republicans could ever get a plurality in San Francisco."? How about this scenario: After the next big earthquake in SF, the government "helps" SF residents they way they helped (largely Democratic) New Orleans residents -- scatter them across the country and do nothing to repair their homes so they can't return and coalesce into a politically-charged angry mob.

I bet Rove has seen "Ocean's 13" a dozen times and has placed calls to see if he can rent one of those Chunnel diggers in hopes of starting a real eight-point-fiver...

[hooraydems06]

224. THANK YOU, MN Against Bush...

THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU!!!

[hooraydems06]

221. I'll repeat this as many times as necessary...

... a Republican will never, NEVER, NEVER win California's Eighth Congressional District. NEVER!

[rainy]

82. we can't keep electing people just because they are dems and then do

nothing when they do not do the right thing. We have to put the fire under them always and if Cindy thinks by running she will put the fire under the Dems who are too corporate controlled to do right by the people well its more than most of us are willing to do. She has just as much right to run as anyone else and if her views are more aligned with ours then we should support her, end of discussion.

[IndianaGreen]

89. Pelosi is blocking H Res 333, the Cheney Impeachment Resolution

Pelosi has done a better job at protecting Cheney from impeachment than she has at defunding the war.

H Res 333, Cheney impeachment resolution and supporting documentation:

http://kucinich.house.gov/Issues/Issue/?IssueID=3750

[subsuelo]

118. could you explain why

or point to a source explaining... sorry I dont have time to waste through all the muck out there

[cureautismnow]

94. Go, Cindy, Go!

Light a fire under the acquiescent deadwood.:applause:

[johncoby2]

95. Yea. Real smart Cindy. Do us a favor and be quiet for a while.

Don't be a media hog. Go after the 5 Senators we need to over ride a veto on the war. do something useful for a change.

[Don1]

99. I think Pelosi likes this.

That way she can introduce the articles of impeachment and say she did it because she had to. Even if not, well, the pressure is good because there is good enough cause for impeachment.

[jgraz]

102. It's called politics, and if Pelosi were a competent politician this would never be a possibility

Stop trashing someone for wanting to run against an ineffective leader. If Cindy runs, Pelosi has only herself to blame.

[19jet54]

115. Blackmail is illegal...

... I guess Cindy has finally shown her true colors? Go ahead, throw your hat in the race & let the people tell you how important you really are; personally, I think your hat size is... I'll just leave it there out of respect for your veteran son, but that is the only slack I will cut you. - Politics is war & I don't think you can cook in the heat! - Besides, after a few comments on DU you turned out to be a quitter? I think you will end up being cannon fodder, but good luck anyway - go for it!

[thereismore]

188. What have YOU personally done to end this war? When did you stick out

your own neck? Do you know what it takes? Do you reach as high as Cindy's ankles?

[19jet54]

329. I and both my son's are veterans...

... plus I lost my government job of over 25 years, fighting for peace - I now live (edited out) because the federal government tried to destroy me personally - what the fuck do you know shit head?

But that still does not address Cindy's ability to play at the big table - with the big girls (which is my original comment)? And no thanks, I don't want to like Cindy's ankles :)

[thereismore]

351. My apologies. I thought you might be a shithead. Between you and me,

there is only one shithead, and it's not you.

:hi:

[19jet54]

352. Don't sweat it...

... I give as good as I get :) And between you and me, I got rid of about 10 of the assholes before they got me & I agree we need to get rid of the top two assholes, but I support the first woman speaker of the house ever; and simply think Cindy's tactic of blackmail & threats is a bit un-realistic. That is like me, with my record challenging my Senator, Harry Reid? Everybody will think I have been smoking opium or something :rofl:

Besides, the tide is turning just like it did during the 70s against the war - The 2008 election already is showing mass GOP defections so they can keep their jobs; the war will stop, but not soon enough!

Thanks for caring; we all care!

[DFW]

116. What about a compromise?

Have Cindy run against Mean Jean Schmidt? I thought Cindy was
originally from Ohio, so she would be running for a seat in her
own state. After the strong challenge to Mean Jean last time,
she might even eventually win in an upset, and then if she wants
to be a thorn in Pelosi's side, she can do it every day for two years
straight.

The blackmail argument does, unfortunately, hold some water: do what
I want or else. That may not be what Cindy wanted to say, but that's
what it sounds like, and despite Pelosi's deference to Bush's office,
she despises his politics. Just read any of her stuff. So she didn't
want impeachment on the table. She thought it would distract from her
agenda. That may or may not have been a miscalculation, but I'm not
yet ready to throw in the towel. Just because an ally doesn't go about
things the way I want doesn't make him or her an enemy. If we had
acted like this with DeGaulle and Churchill in World War II, Hitler
would have won.

The swipe at Howard Dean above was a cheap shot. Listen to ANY of his
speeches. Like Wes Clark, Howard has never minced words. As party chairman,
he has to walk a tightrope as it is, and he doesn't make it easy on
Democrats running tight races in red areas when he speaks out on the
Sunday talk shows when he speaks up, but speak up he does.

[creeksneakers2]

160. I'd be behind Cindy

if she picked a Republican to run against. She's even fine with me as long as she's not trying to split the party.

[The_Casual_Observer]

123. Nancy "Impeachment is off the table" Pelosi?

I'm jolly well tired of that woman & her pastel wool suits ducking every god damn opportunity to stick it to jr. Good for Cindy!

[NotGivingUp]

367. Pelosi disgusts me...thoroughly. GO GET 'EM CINDY!!!! nt

[Tarc]

127. This drama queen's 15 minutes is long since past

She won't even crack 20% in a primary, and that is generous.

[thereismore]

190. Welcome to my ignore list. nt

[Tarc]

340. Boo-hoo

[DutchLiberal]

128. She has my support

Yes, I know maybe I'm on thin ice, considering I'm only a registered member for a day or three (although I've been following DU for more than a year) and the rules say you have to be supportive of Democrats and I don't even live in the US...

BUT...

I think more independents should be elected so the two party system can gradually get the axe. More parties, more candidates, more difference, more to choose from, right? Moreover, I strongly support impeachment of both Bush and Cheney and let's not stop there! The biggest mistake Pelosi has made, imo, is to say that "impeachment is off the table". Come on, the highly popular President Clinton got impeached for lying under oath about private affairs, but the incredible unpopular, detested pResident Bush can't be impeached for... well, everything that Cindy Sheehan so eloquently summed up???

Sheehan, who will turn 50 on Tuesday, said Bush should be impeached because she believes he misled the public about the reasons for going to war, violated the Geneva Convention by torturing detainees, and crossed the line by commuting the prison sentence of former vice presidential aide I. Lewis "Scooter" Libby. She said other grounds for impeachment are the domestic spying program and the "inadequate and tragic" response to Hurricane Katrina.

Right on the money.

[BrotherBuzz]

129. I could support Cindy if she set her sights on defeating Doolittle (R) in CA04, or

Lungren (R) in CA03, both districts are close to her undisclosed Sacramento abode.

[diamidue]

143. Cindy has a ZERO chance in Doolittle country.

War, torture, and greed seem to be a-ok with too many people in Placer Co.

[madrchsod]

131. if cindy splits the ticket then

is there any chance a republican would take that seat? if cindy wins who is the next speaker? are the democrats in her district willing to vote her out and if she did win she would have 0 power to do anything for her district...
pelosi is`t going to pay any attention to cindy`s demand.

[Tekla West]

180. no republican is going to take that seat

its one of the most overwhelming liberal and democratic districts in the USA.

[hooraydems06]

233. THANK YOU, Tekla West...

... keep explaining it to these people deriding Cindy for already painting that district red "forever" :sarcasm: a full 16 months before the election... :tinfoilhat:

[hooraydems06]

231. NO...

... NO chance a Republican could take advantage of a split vote in that district.

Here, let me spell it out for you, adding some thresholds for minimum to maximum vote total received for both ladies running, and let's add a Green and Peace and Freedom candidate to the mix as well, just to make things fun --

2008 General Election

Eighth Congressional District - all precincts reporting

(D) Nancy Pelosi - minimum vote received 38% - maximum 70%
(I) Cindy Sheehan - minimum vote received 10% - maximum 42%
(G) Whoever - minimum vote received 1% - maximum 8%
(P&F) Whoever - minimum vote received 0.5% - maximum 4%
(R) Whoever - minimum vote received 10% - maximum 20%
(L) Whoever - minimum vote received 0.1% - maximum 0.5%

Pelosi the most likely winner, if not her Sheehan (quite a long shot). The Republican does not win, under any circumstances, as (s)he falls at least 18% short of Pelosi's minimum vote total, even under the most optimal circumstances, which would mean Sheehan would win that race. But most likely outcome is Sheehan and Republican vote total combined is barely able to keep Pelosi down to 60% and probably not even that little.

[ckramer]

135. I will send money if she runs

She should be a law maker.

[Zorro]

137. Here's a solution for Cindy

Run for the Republican nomination in Pelosi's district.

She's going to have to get significant Republican support as an independent if she thinks she can defeat Pelosi in the general election, so perhaps that should be where her focus should be.

[Quixote1818]

153. You are exactly right and at least she could be taking away Republican money. nt

[karlrschneider]

141. I wonder if she thinks she would be Speaker if she were to win.

She seems to be a little unhinged lately...

[Divine Discontent]

286. nice BS statement

wtf are you doing saying that crap? like she would even think she would get the speakership...

"unhinged lately" more misogynistic crap imo.

there's a lot of men on this site who I believe are very negative in view of women, gays, people of color and I'm tired of DU letting them get away with saying crap like this - calling Nancy and Speaker Pelosi "SHRILL" and now this guy making an absurd comment about her maybe wanting the speaker position and being "unhinged"!

so rude.

[bluestateguy]

146. Guess that "retirement" didn't last very long.

nt

[Quixote1818]

151. Come September none of this will matter. Republicans are starting to jump ship

and the occupation is losing support. By September we will have the votes we need to start getting out.

[salib]

163. Again, Cindy puts most others to shame!

She is one of the few with real courage: courage of spirit, courage of intellect, courage of action.

This is such an easy way to become a target, and is an incredibly inspiring move.

[Cant trust em]

168. She won't win

Most of San Francisco loves the Democratic establishment. Sheehan will pick up more support than any other anti-war candidate that we've seen, but Pelosi's a lock.

[jgraz]

182. Of course she won't win

That's not the point, is it? Running true progressives against establishment Dems is just one more tool to make them wake up and pay attention to the true majority in the country.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

219. Not Unlike Impeachment Trials

Same thing.

We should not avoid what is so dearly required by the facts.

[Lost-in-FL]

170. Another Nader in the making n/t

[against all enemies]

171. Bullshit, Sheehan walks the walk. Nader strolls out every 4 years.

[hooraydems06]

235. Yes, and unlike Nader...

... Sheehan doesn't believe in the bullshit "crisis :nuke: triggers revolution" theory that he does... she's already experienced said "crisis" firsthand. Her little boy will never come back to her ever... she realizes that "crisis" has real consequences to people's lives. Nader treats the last seven or so years as a "necessary sacrifice" to make people wake up. :puke: Cold-hearted, smug bastard... :thumbsdown: what has he personally sacrificed to bring Bush down, since he is, in large part, responsible for Bush being here? He just starts yelling at the Democratic leadership to take all the responsibility for a situation that he shares the blame for, and then continues to be as much of a spoiler as he possibly can be. :mad:

[UrbScotty]

213. Agreed (nt)

[nichomachus]

181. I'm not voting for anyone who won't try to impeach

Period.

I may end up voting only for dogcatcher or something.

I don't care what letter is after a person's name. I care about what they do. If all they do is make tough noises and then cave at the last minute, who cares what party they sign up for?

Maybe what we need is an independent candidate in every district in the country. Some will get in.

You could have a really interesting Congress with it evenly split between Republicans and Democrats and then 20 to 30 independents. Then, we'd see real politics instead of just corporate whoring.

Both Republicans and Democrats would be dancing jigs to try to get the independents' votes. Then, we'd see some responsiveness to what the people want.

[NotGivingUp]

368. Corporate whoring is exactly what's going on. They are killing and destroying

around the world. It's time we put a stop to it and throw them out on their frigging asses!!!

[Warren DeMontague]

184. *Yawn*. Here's a hint, Cindy- don't call it "Frisco".

The people who actually live there hate that.

[ronnykmarshall]

320. Best Post of The Day

:spray:

[iamthebandfanman]

185. haha so NOW we know

why she 'retired' from activity in the 'movement'.

oh well, hope she doesnt mind crushing defeat.

[Raine]

193. Cindi, promoting herself

x( and Nancy will whip her ass. :-)

[martymar64]

244. True, so then Nancy can go on enabling Bussh

Nancy is a cowardly capitulator in the vein of Neville Chamberalin. She's now in thrall of the Bush machine, her fawning over the Chimperor is pathetic
She needs to resign as Speaker so someone with some courage can take over the fight, she's been utterly and completely useless.

[Quixote1818]

196. I am OK with this if it's just a way to bring media attention to the Dems inaction

nt

[jarnocan]

206. I was glad to see the write up- including making the caravan news.

http://www.rr.com/flash/index.cfm?rev=10238 So often demonstrations are ignored and/or donwplayed- it appears to be making it more newsworthy- to the MSM, mentioned some of the issues too.

[FreeStateDemocrat]

207. True that, I'm a Democrat & American & I feel betrayed by the Democratic leadership.

This may create more sparks than a carnival cat fight. I'm for anything that might make our leadership fight the tyranny occupying the White House.

[UrbScotty]

209. She will lose. And well she should. By a landslide.

"Democrats and Americans feel betrayed by the Democratic leadership." One, she is acting as if "Democrats" and "Americans" are two separate groups. Rudy Giuliani said virtually the same thing.

Second, Sheehan is ignorant of the fact that Congress has tried to end the war. It was vetoed. We need COMPETENT leadership in Congress - and Cindy Sheehan is no longer showing the competence she showed a couple years ago at Camp Casey.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

214. Congress Has "TRIED" to End War and You Think They are "COMPETENT"

Give me a break.

The competency comes with credibility and Cindy Sheehan has more than any son of a b*tch who has not lost a son or daughter serving right now in Congress.

Tried to end the war?

Great..........Dems are no better than the GOP.

[still_one]

228. If you believe that the Democrats are no better than the republicans than what are you doing here?

Are you telling me that the Democratic platform is against a woman's right to choose?
Are you telling me that the Democratic platform is for privitizing social security and medicare?
Are you telling me that the Democratic platform is against the environment?
Are you telling me that the Democratic platform isn't for equal rights, or women's rights?
I could go on, but I suggest you examine the republican platform, and if you cannot still see the difference, than maybe you should go start your own party.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

362. Good Grief

I was talking about the war.

If the Dems "TRIED" to end the war, but were unsuccessful, the results they gave us are no better than the GOP.

Under this so called 'friendly' Democratic Congress, we have INCREASED funding for this war and extended it unnecessarily.

But since you brought it up, notice how the Dems have NOT passed any significant legislation to further ANY of the issues you raised!!!!!

[fightthegoodfightnow]

363. Good Grief

I was talking about the war.

If the Dems "TRIED" to end the war, but were unsuccessful, the results they gave us are no better than the GOP.

Under this so called 'friendly' Democratic Congress, we have INCREASED funding for this war and extended it unnecessarily.

But since you brought it up, notice how the Dems have NOT passed any significant legislation to further ANY of the issues you raised!!!!!

[Danger Mouse]

346. uh...really?

i think, despite their flaws, the Dems are a HELL of a lot better than the GOP.
if you really feel that way, then feel free to support a republican cantidate in '08. after all, what's the difference?

[fightthegoodfightnow]

361. Balancing the Scales

You write: 'i think, despite their flaws, the Dems are a HELL of a lot better than the GOP.'

Not if they don't get us out of this war!!!!!!!

Look, I prefer the Dems, which is why I support and participate on this board, but I am tired of the GOP deciding WHAT the agenda will be.

It's time for the Democrats to stand up tall and take a position to the left as extreme as the GOP has taken on the right. Otherwise, we lose if we don't balance the scales.

[Danger Mouse]

371. Well...in regards to the war, no, by and large the Dems haven't walked the walk.

And it's about damn time they did.
So I'll agree with you as far as that's concerned.

[still_one]

216. Cindy Sheehan is NOT an elected official. She is also accountable to no one

You are right, she will run, and she will lose by a landslide, and not from a group right wing extremists either. Pelosi's district is liberal, and by a wide majority they will go to the polls, and vote Pelosi in again.

What message will be extracted from that?

[fightthegoodfightnow]

218. May the Candidate Who Will Fight to End this War Win

........and it's not Pelosi.

[still_one]

230. That may be your wish, but it will happen only after the Democrats win in 2008

Momentum is already turning, and the republicans can see the writing on the wall

Everyone finds it so easy to blame the Democrats for their ills, and they are deserving of some blame, but so are the people. Voting turnout in 2000 and 2004 was pathetic. Sure it was fixed, but the turnout still spoke volumes that people didn't really think it mattered who won. Too bad, because the supreme court is mostly gone now.

[fightthegoodfightnow]

364. Momentum is Turning Not Because of Pelosi's Leadership

........but because, ironically, many GOP candidates up for re-election are turning against this war.

If Dems don't start to take positions as extreme and radical as those of the GOP, then the GOP will win regardless of who is in office.

[Danger Mouse]

345. What does Sheehan have to offer other than a single issue platform?

Maybe Nancy's constituents want something more than someone who's against the Iraq war but doesn't have much else to offer?
Just my h.o.

[DemKR]

232. GO NANCY!!!!!

[still_one]

234. LOL. There isn't even a doubt. She is still quite popular in San Francisco

Why doesn't Cindy Sheehan run in the district she lives. I think she is from Antioche?

[knight_of_the_star]

253. Nancy's safe

On a practical level having the Speaker as your rep is the best thing any district can get and I doubt Sheehan will get enough votes to come within a decent distance of winning, but she will get enough votes to invalidate herself.

[everydayis911]

240. Go Cindy

And what will Nancy lose if Cindy beats her? Only her job. Cindy lost Casey in this BS war and knows the impact of war. Neither Nancy or Joe have any relative in this war. I swear if this planet were run by women in the first place war would be out of the question. I've thought sometimes maybe if they tap the water with estrogen maybe it would help. "Football what's that"

[bvar22]

245. Win, lose, or draw...makes NO difference.

As a result of Cindy's actions TODAY, more people will be demanding IMPEACHMENT TOMORROW.

Thats a GOOD thing!


Go Cindy.
:patriot:

[ooglymoogly]

247. In my umble opinion...I believe most of us here really want to support

Pelosi...but these are dangerous and perilous times. I believe the jerk is waiting for an opportunity to declare with a stroke of the pen, marshal law and that would be the end of democracy...I have an admittedly uneducated understanding of whether the jerk can do this if he is being investigated for treason under the articles of impeachment however public outrage alone would make it near impossible for the jerk to declare ML under the cloud of a charge of treason. For this alone I think that impeachment is imperative at all cost and Pelosi has jaw droppingly taken it off the table and those are fighting words to many of us here. If Cindy can light a fire with our help under a reluctant Pelosi and hold her feet to the fire then I say more power to her. Pelosi's statement taking "I" of the table has very little support by many of us here nor I suspect the nearly half of voters who support impeachment with nearly a blackout on the news about the jerks treason. Imagine what would happen if that treason exploded all over the reluctant msm and they had no choice but to cover it.

[Danger Mouse]

249. Psh. You kiddin me?

I don't see what good this will do, to be honest. She won't win, it won't get Pelosi to listen, and it won't change anything. I don't like Pelosi either, but I don't particularly care for Sheehan.

[emilyg]

264. I never cared for Sheehan. Have outmost sympathy for her

but don't care for her.

[Danger Mouse]

271. I sympathize with her lost...

and think she has done a lot of good. But lately...I just have no idea what she's thinking.

[defendandprotect]

254. Will Democrats throw Pelosi and Speakership away--?

Yeah, we need impeachment, but we won't get there by weakening the Democrats further.

Notice that what we hear about Democratic legislation failing is that the "Republicans blocked it" --

Well, where was all that blocking when the Democrats were the minority?

I don't think that the lever to change all of this is quite where Cindy Sheehan thinks it is . . .

In fact, Howard Zinn has made a quite realistic arguement you don't need to hold an elected office

to fight effectively and that often elected officials lose their desire to create change.

[kitty1]

256. For someone who just recently made a decision to leave public

life because of her frustrations with both political parties, this is a huge 360 degree turn around for her.
She just gave a big media farewell to her public campaign to bring awareness to the Iraq situation, and then turns around and declares her candidacy for Pelosi's position.
She seems to be all over the map as far as her agenda goes.
Cindy has done a remarkable job of bringing the peace movement to the forefront, but now I think people are viewing her as a bit of a loose cannon, and she can't possibly win against someone with as much presence as Pelosi. (Just keeping it real as they say)
I don't think the issue of impeachment alone is enough to bring Pelosi and the dems down.
I do hope thought that Cindy does find her political niche where her passion and experience can be used in a beneficial way.

[CreekDog]

268. Sheehan congressperson from SF, who is not from SF?

If Sheehan wants to get behind a primary challenge, then there are Democrats who could run against her that are from SF and could represent the 8th District.

I'm not crazy about her latest strategy, but she's not the west coast version of Joe Lieberman --that's laughable and any person who says that just undermined all their other statements with that big stupid one.

Such is life.

ps-who will Sheehan run against next week?

[drm604]

265. If she really wants to run for the office

then she should challenge Pelosi as a Democrat in the primary. Anything else is blackmail that could give the seat to a Republican. "Do what I want or I'll throw the seat to someone even less likely to do what I want". :eyes:

You just know that the Repubs will be laughing at us about this.

[Moochy]

276. Blackmail??

blackmail n. the crime of threatening to reveal embarrassing, disgraceful or damaging facts (or rumors) about a person to the public, family, spouse or associates unless paid off to not carry out the threat. It is one form of extortion (which may include other threats such as physical harm or damage to property). (See: extortion)

So what part of this proposed process is blackmail?

And to your point about republicans winning that district.. :rofl:

http://www.sfgov.org/site/election_index.asp?id=47578

City and County of San Francisco
Consolidated General Election
November 7, 2006

Official Election Results

NANCY PELOSI (DEM) . . . . . . . 148,435 80.27
MIKE DENUNZIO (REP) . . . . . . . 19,800 10.71
KRISSY KEEFER (GRN) . . . . . . . 13,653 7.38
PHILIP ZIMT BERG (LIB) . . . . . . 2,751 1.49
WRITE-IN. . . . . . . . . . . 283 .15

[drm604]

279. Oh for God's sake...

You know very well what I meant by the word even if it doesn't meet your dictionary's exact definition.

But hey, if you want to play dueling definitions, we can do that.

black·mail /ˈblækˌmeɪl/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. any payment extorted by intimidation, as by threats of injurious revelations or accusations.
2. the extortion of such payment: He confessed rather than suffer the dishonor of blackmail.
3. a tribute formerly exacted in the north of England and in Scotland by freebooting chiefs for protection from pillage.
–verb (used with object)
4. to extort money from (a person) by the use of threats.
5. to force or coerce into a particular action, statement, etc.: The strikers claimed they were blackmailed into signing the new contract.

I appreciate the information about Pelosi's district. That eases my mind somewhat. What I don't appreciate is that you find it so freakin hilarious that I wasn't aware of the statistics for one voting district that is on the opposite side of the country from me. You can inform people of the facts without mocking them.

That still doesn't change her intentions. Cindy Sheehan apparently believes, rightly or wrongly, that she could be a threat to Pelosi's electoral chances, otherwise why would she make such a threat? My point is that I don't like that kind of politics, even when it's done in an amateurish manner that isn't likely to work.

For the record, I do admire Ms Sheehan for the things she's done, I just disagree with this particular tactic. Just like I greatly admire Michael Moore, but will always feel some anger toward his support of Nader.

[Moochy]

327. Cindy is no real threat, just a PR issue

Ms Sheehan believes that Nancy Pelosi has not done enough to stop the war. Many here share that view.

Sheehan *knows* that she would not win, see her quote about giving it a good run for the money.
I just want everyone to stop following this to illogical conclusions.

Regarding the definition I was only trying to suss out what "injurious revelations or accusations" (my original definition) Ms Sheehan had to bring to Pelosi's campaign. Thanks for the expanded definition, I appreciate it, but maybe I'm the only one?

Thanks for the civil reply, I don't mean to add heat to the debate, just light. :)

[SharonRB]

324. I absolutely agree with you.

I posted below before I read the thread, and I think it's blackmail, too. If she's serious, she should challenge Nancy as a Dem. Running as an Independent will just give the seat to the Repubs.

[kerstin]

349. Good point. n/t

[philosophie_en_rose]

266. Yeah. That worked for Nader.

:eyes:

Cindy Sheehan is like the homeless guy in the Van Halen video that promises to "Wrestle for Food." Good intentions, but no clue whatsoever.

Just like Ralph Nader, she can run for whatever she likes. But she, like Ralph Nader, is a tool if he thinks attacking Democrats is going to make Republicans act differently.

[Vidar]

267. I love you Cindy. I know she can't win, but this is a great response

to Pelosi's cowardice & collaboration.

[KingFlorez]

269. She is delusional

No one would vote for her over Nancy Pelosi, she'd probably even rank below the token GOP opposition Pelosi gets. Cindy Sheehan is one of number of people who don't get how the government works. Most of these people think that the Congress has executive authority and can just order he troops out.

[MilesColtrane]

275. Apparently Cindy would rather see Stony Hoyer, or Rahm Emanuel as House Speaker.

That could be the outcome if she, improbably, wins.
I'm pretty sure neither one of them will jump to act if Representative Sheehan proposes an impeachment bill.

I guess punishing Pelosi trumps all other considerations in her mind.

[progressoid]

277. Oh Jeez

:eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes::eyes:

[Divine Discontent]

284. I love how so many are capitulating

and speaking just like Speaker Pelosi - playing cautious - many people on here are still in a '04 mindset - you think by playing it safe we'll win in 08, yeah, just like '04 - you can't trust the republicans - they have shat upon the Constitution of our country hundreds of times in the past 7 years - ENOUGH!

If sticking a couple logs under Pelosi's arse is what it takes - great! She should be backing impeachment - because her CONSTITUENTS want it - my goodness - if 45% of Americans polled want JR impeached - that number is 2/3 in her District!

www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable <<--- top '08 items & antib*sh stickers!

[yurbud]

290. Democrats won IN SPITE of caution not because of it

[Divine Discontent]

293. interesting! thank you bud! n/t

[Divine Discontent]

288. let the oddball statements come out!

I'm not going to reply this to anyone's specific comment - but I've read about 50 users comments that are either treating Speaker Pelosi like a perfect QUEEN that must be obeyed and others that call either one of them names or insinuate their basically hysterical.

What is going on at DU - I thought we were LIBERALS here? This anti-female bashing in "code" words is rather distasteful.

Progressive thought should tell us ALL that ending this war is the #1 priority - if you don't like what SHE'S doing to try and end it - what are YOU doing to trump her actions and end it?

I respect Speaker Pelosi, but she's also being far too much of a politician the past few months, and she's NOT listening to the American people, esp. her district which is very liberal, and pushing for impeachment hearings.

I feel she has failed her position she was given, at this moment - I hope she has something up her sleeve - otherwise - if she doesn't and she just keeps on walking a political fine-line and calling B*sh a nice man from a patriotic family, then I'll be sending Sheehan money to run or WHOEVER to run against her. MURTHA should have been speaker. I'd take him or Conyers or Waters at this point.

[yurbud]

289. Thank you, Cindy! The Democrats need to shit or get off the pot

and I'm not sure why they are holding in the turds Bush & Cheney

[Divine Discontent]

295. yep, it's now or never -

I'm sicking of seeing another soldier's funeral get announced on our local news - FOR WHAT??? Why did this newest kid have to DIE? B*sh has a lot to answer for in the afterlife - these brave soldiers should only be sent (as I've heard Sen. Kerry, Gen. Clark & Mike Moore say so wisely) into harms way when it's ABSOLUTELY necessary and if they're not - our country may be hurt strongly by inaction - for some reason -----

I don't believe there's evidence to persuade anyone that an Iraqi invasion has made ANY sense.

night, yurbud - thanks for your continued good posts.

[yurbud]

299. it made a great deal of sense to oil companies--we paid the price, they collect the profits

[Divine Discontent]

366. you're quite good with the one line wisdom filled lines! keep on! :) n/t

[davidthegnome]

296. Nancy is just being careful

While I'm disappointed, I don't think all things are as they seem. I believe Pelosi is simply waiting for the right moment. I could be wrong, but I think she's waiting for the outcry to become even louder and more outrageous. Give her time, Rome wasn't built in a day, and unless you're willing to physically remove them, it's not easy getting rid of a Dictator and his cronies. The Dictator, of course, being Cheney, while Bush and the rest are cronies.

I think there's a lot more to this than meets the eye. I think that people are working behind the scenes, to get more support for an impeachment. In the end, Bush will lose all but his most fanatical supporters, even within his own party - as is obvious from the dramatically low approval rating. Defeat by a slight margin... it's good, but it's not great. The possibility of pulling it off is fairly slim. But I (like many others, I believe) am thinking that as certain situations continue to worsen, the Republicans are going to continue to fall. What I'm hoping for, is a defeat so crushing, that it will be years before the so called "conservatives" can regain any real strength.

Sooner or later, the sleeping giant is going to wake up. Someone is going to light a match that will set the Country on fire. We're going to see change and revolution - but it will take time. Patience..
we've been waiting for years, and I honestly believe that what we've been waiting for is right around the corner. Bush has just made one of his final mistakes. We just need the final nail in the coffin. I get the feeling that he's so hopelessly incompetent and stupid, that he can't help but give it to us pretty soon.

I admit that earlier I was just as angry as some of you are. Now that I've had time to think though, I've decided to be patient and see what happens. This is far from over, it's just beginning.

[Malikshah]

297. This is what Needs to be done.

Had folks challenged Delay, Bush, etc. the way Sheehan may challenge Pelosi, it will draw the needed attention to the fact that being an elected official means responding to the people that elected you. It is not a protected position. Pelosi's tin ear is becoming more and more apparent, as are those of the others in the Dem leadership.

If there is any hope in this abyss of darkness, it is that folks will actually stand up and challenge those who willfully continue us on that path over the brink.

Will Sheehan win? Most likely not. Will it embarass Pelosi? Maybe. Should it? Definitely.

It is called the courage of one's convictions. Not testing the wind and playing Beltway Chess games.

The people are speaking and the leadership from both sides of the aisle are ignoring it.

[IndianaGreen]

298. An Open Letter to Nancy Pelosi

Published on Sunday, July 8, 2007 by CommonDreams.org

An Open Letter to Nancy Pelosi

by John Atcheson

Madam Speaker:

It is time to impeach George Bush and Dick Cheney.

We all know the case for doing so: the litany of this administration’s offenses is long and tragic, the damage they have wrought to our nation and the principles it was founded upon profound.

And yet many of us understood - even if we did not agree - when you said “impeachment is off the table.” Your case was credible, if not persuasive. The proceedings would have been disruptive, making progress in other areas difficult, and the fact that three of the last six presidents would have been impeached by the opposition party could have damaged the presidency and sank this nation into a permanent partisan war. It could have fed the notion that impeachment proceedings were simply another political maneuver to be used by partisans to cripple their opponents, much as partisan Republicans did with Clinton. And with two years remaining, this did seem a high price to pay for getting rid of George Bush and his partners in crime. Taking the high road had a certain nobility, even if it didn’t satisfy a hunger for justice many of us felt.

But now - with scarcely eighteen months left - you have no choice but to impeach Bush and Cheney regardless of the cost, because it has become increasingly clear that the very foundations of this nation have been assaulted as never before in our history, and to let that record stand would be an act of cowardice on your part and a dangerous precedent to future presidents.

Others have laid out the specific charges, and they are legion. But it is the nature and character of the offenses which leave you no choice. This administration has not simply broken specific provisions of arcane laws, or committed “misdemeanors.” They have sought to fundamentally rewrite the Constitution in a manner that is more to their liking. They have systematically put the interest of a political party over the interests of the nation, committing serious crimes in the process.

The commitment to basic civil rights inherent in Bill of Rights has been violated with a cavalier arrogance unprecedented in our Nation’s history. Both the First Amendment and the Fourth Amendment have been compromised. Indeed, had it not been for the Supreme Court, these cherished provisions would have been all but consigned to history’s trash heap. But we can no longer rely on them to safeguard our rights. The new Court has exhibited a reckless disregard for precedent, and a certain randomness in their interpretation of the Constitution in general and the Bill of Rights in particular.

http://www.commondreams.org/archive/2007/07/08/2381/

[geiger]

300. If she dropped out of the peace movement, she won't have the stomach for Congress, even to run

and it just won't happen.

[4dsc]

304. We should have more Sheehan's out there

willing to run against democrat's that don't support the majority position of impeachment!! What is it going to take to get MOST of the weaked knee'd democratic party members in Congress to quit being afraid of republicans?? We perhaps this os the direction we need to take!!

[rodeodance]

305. MSNBC crawl; every 2-3 minutes,

Forum Name General Discussion
Topic subject MSNBC crawl; every 2-3 minutes, for however long it's left up,
Topic URL http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1280508#1280508
1280508, MSNBC crawl; every 2-3 minutes, for however long it's left up,
Posted by babylonsister on Mon Jul-09-07 05:53 AM

MSNBC is sharing the news that Sheehan will challenge Pelosi if she doesn't file ARTICLES OF IMPEACHMENT. So, there you have it. Cindy has already done a great service by getting that meme out there for all who watch MSNBC to see.
I think it's a good thing. :)

[Vinnie From Indy]

311. Sheehan publicly left the Democratic party

after the brief period she even identified with it. I was under the impression she was a life long Republican up until the war and her son's death. That would mean that she supported candidates for years that were against a woman's right to choose, racial equality, sane foreign policy etc etc etc.

Her very recent retirement announcement followed by this announcement makes me wonder about her mental health. In any event, she will get crushed by Pelosi if she chooses to run.

Lastly, if she does decide to run, I would strongly urge her NOT to use the avatar of her squatting that many on DU use to show support for her. It looks like she is relievinig herself outdoors. Is there no decent picture of Cindy that you "Cindinistas" could use to honor her and show support?

[Steerpike]

312. This is interesting.

But why can't she run as a Democrat?

[Javaman]

315. Go for it Cindy, perhaps that will force pelosi's hand into actually doing

her fucking job.

[BigDDem]

318. Oh, and p.s....

if you don't stop the war in the next week and a half I'm going to
set up camp in your driveway.

Honey, your 15 minutes is up, buh bye.

[yurbud]

322. nice try, but obviously not true

[SharonRB]

323. This is a bad idea

A surefire way to split the vote and get a Republican into the House. I don't think Nancy will take kindly to blackmail, which is essentially what this is.

[marshall]

330. Twist those arms til it hurts!

I say good for Cindy. She is loyal to her IDEALS, and when she feels "her" party isn't living up to those ideals she isn't afraid to speak out.

Give 'em hell, Cindy!

[bushesass]

331. Way To Go Cindy!

Pelosi kisses Bushesass(see my screen name)and at the same time and talks out the side of her mouth to us about stopping this war. She's full of it and has did nothing but protect Busch and Cheney. Impeachment proceedings could have been started easily and as low as Busch poll numbers are this would be a cakewalk. She talked tough about the war and does nothing. Just like Hillary does. Hillary and Nancy supporters can try to defend them but their ACTIONS do not lie. Thats the truth!!!
At least Cindy motives would be genuine.

[Handsome Pete]

335. Hayell, YAS!

Run, Cindy, run!!! That'll teach little Miss "roll-over-and-play-dead" Pelosi the cost of caving in to Bush's veto threats.

Gawd, I love Cindy <sighs dreamily>

[Katherine Brengle]

343. Good for her - that's the point of a democracy, right? Everyone has

the right to run and we let the people decide.

If she has something to say, and wants to be a public servant, more power to her.

[BigDDem]

344. Run Cindy Run!

I can use a good laugh.
Code Pink should be a great source of campaign funds.
Go for it, I'm sure Nancy is shaking in her heels.

[philly_bob]

348. Please don't Cindy. /nt

[knowledgeispwr]

353. Can't support her...

She's left the Democratic arty, she has made statements calling the federal income tax unconstitutional and the Democrats "the party of slavery." She comes across as libertarian and has used right-wing talking points with regards to the Democratic party.

For more, see here: http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1284850

[John Kerry VonErich]

354. Wonder what would happen if she joins the green party.

nt

[MiserableFailure]

370. Sad that this is even happening

Pelosi is a good woman at heart but if she listened to the people and what they want(they want out of this war), she wouldn't have Cindy Sheehan running against her and Cindy Sheehan would be gaining no traction. It's the fact that Pelosi left her spine back in San Francisco last year that is the problem.

[ContraBass Black]

374. What will the rest of her policy be?

[BigDDem]

376. Maybe she'll use her expereince running against

Diane Feinstein, oh wait...that didnt happen, then she retired...