Officer Accused of Choking Skateboarder

[Hissyspit]

Source: Associated Press

Officer accused of choking skateboarder
By JON GAMBRELL, Associated Press Writer
12 minutes ago

LITTLE ROCK, Ark. - A police officer who appears to choke a skateboarder and put two others in a headlock in a video posted online has been put on administrative leave while police investigate, officials said.

Hot Springs Mayor Mike Bush said Tuesday that investigators have talked with witnesses who saw the officer, Joey Williams, stop the skateboarders on a downtown city sidewalk last Thursday. Skateboarding is banned in the area.

The video shows Williams apparently choking one of the skateboarders after forcing him to the ground, then later chasing and wrestling two others while holding them in a headlock.

"Unfortunately, the video shows it pretty good," Bush said.

Bush said he won't be sure of the city's next step until the investigation is complete. The video, taken by Matthew Jon McCormack and another unidentified skater, was posted Monday on YouTube, a popular Internet site.

Williams can be heard threatening one person with pepper spray if he moved, and several voices are heard asking why they were being arrested. One person can be seen running from Williams, and Williams later tells them they are fleeing and acting disorderly.


Read more: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070627/ap_on_re_us/skateboarders_police_video

[ixion]

1. "Unfortunately, the video shows it pretty good," Bush said.

yeah, gee golly whiz... it's too bad it wasn't grainy so you could deny it. :grr:

[Ian David]

28. That's what I was thinking when I read that. What an asshole. n/t

[conspirator]

94. you should read "Unfortunately my fascist police has to be a bit more discreet" nt

[acmavm]

2. Jeeze, I guess they'll let anyone on police forces these days...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1194548

[LifeDuringWartime]

3. here is the unedited video

part 1 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HOKb2PQs4kc

part 2 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dT6z0dQ_-pg&mode=user&search=

[Hissyspit]

6. Hot Springs, Ark.. I recognized the street immediately. n/t

[Warpy]

7. When did the choking occur?

I saw proper police procedure in cuffing kid #1 and some kid's ass. Then I saw one of the three start to run, get caught, and the other one start to mouth off. They were both placed in very brief headlocks, and kid #2 was cuffed while kid #3 (the mouthy one) ran.

Hey, skateboard punks! Those things are dangerous on busy sidewalks, which this one undoubtedly is, no matter how superior a rider you think you are. Did you know that colliding with an elderly person who is none to steady on his/her feet can send them down? Do you know how easy it is for an elderly person to break a hip? Do you know that 50% of people who break a hip are dead within 6 months? Do you even bother to care?

My sympathy is with the cop. He chased two punks down and never lost it and started throwing punches. This looks like proper procedure to me.

[Name removed]

9. Deleted sub-thread

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[BrokenBeyondRepair]

13. they were riding skateboards

i'm betting that more ppl die from police brutality that getting run over by kids on skateboards. this cop is a piece of shit and should lose his job.

[personman]

14. It probably WAS "proper procedure."

Cops aren't Dr. Phil... You do what they say or they beat you with a stick.

Although I disagree with you completely on who was in the right, you are atleast consistent. Hypocritically, some of the people so appauled by this, aren't opposed to police authority in general, as if police operate any other way.

-personman

"The most absurd apology for authority and law is that they serve to diminish crime. Aside from the fact that the State is itself the greatest criminal, breaking every written and natural law, stealing in the form of taxes, killing in the form of war and capital punishment, it has come to an absolute standstill in coping with crime. It has failed utterly to destroy or even minimize the horrible scourge of its own creation." - Emma Goldman

[ProudDad]

56. Any cop that does this

"You do what they say or they beat you with a stick."

Does NOT BELONG on any police force in a democracy.

But then, we don't live in a democracy -- we live in a police state.

So, by the rules of the Police State, this cop did exactly the right things.


Just hope to shit you don't get on the wrong side of our Gestapo in Blue...

[pschoeb]

17. The kids were standing there doing nothing and waiting as their friend was cuffed

at the very beginning. Then the cop runs across the street and grabs on the standing kids, of course their going to freak. By the way skateboarding is not a criminal violation and the officers never told them not to move or that they were under arrest until later, I didn't see any of them really trying to do anything much at all except standing around, until the cops started being crazy. My guess is that if the cops had told them about the ordinance and that they could skate on sidewalks in other parts of town, or on the street if they were using skateboards as proper transportation and following the rules of traffic, and then told them they would be fined up to $500.00 dollars if they continued, they probably would have left. In fact they seemed mostly ready to leave at the very beginning of the video.

I'm sure you think this is proper procedure for littering to, which unlike skateboarding on sidewalks, is a misdemeanor in Hot Springs, I mean really, some old lady could slip on it and break a hip and be dead like that.

Actually 50% of hip fractures don't lead to death in 6 months, but hey what's good are facts. About 24 percent of hip fracture patients over age 50 die within 12 months after injury. This 24% isn't even of all hip fracture but those over 50, the rate is extremely low below that, possibly because as you get over 50 your chances of being dead in a year greatly increase regardless of whether you have had a hip fracture.

[frylock]

25. warpy probably wasn't accepted by the skate kids at school..

probably hates on jocks, or anyone who enjoys sports as well.

[Name removed]

51. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[LostinVA]

29. I was a bit skeptical that the kids were as innocent as you guys were saying

Then, I watched the videos. OMFG.

This is NOT "proper police procedure." And, for the poster who said they were all male (like that makes a difference), you're mistaken: the cop had a petite girl in a headlock -- I watched that part several times, she hadn't done ANYTHING for that. Proof? She takes off, and neither the assaulting cop nor the other bike cop take after her.

The cop lost his temper and appears to not like these type of kids -- many adults don't. They think they're punks. My 16-year-old nephew is such a "punk": long hair, punk clothes, etc. He got kicked out of a mall just because one day. And yeah, it was just abacus -- the security guard told my sister that. Yet, the boy is a progressive and Taoist, in gifted and talented, a lover of history, etc. He stood up in a classroom in OKLAHOMA in a military town and told off the kids and teacher for making anti-gay statements. My point is, these kids only deserved to be told to knock it off and waved away. That's it. I bet you most if not all of these kids are good kids -- they didn't get violent, they were afraid for their friends, they said "sir."

And the cop also threatened the guy making the video, did you notice that?

[TX-RAT]

32. What the video doesnt show.

Was the 21 year old skate boarder assaulting the 67 year old city employee. That's why he was taken to the ground and arrested, the others were interfering with the arrest.

From the link.
Police spokesman McCrary Means identified two of those arrested as McCormack, 21, and Skylar Nalls, 19, both of Hot Springs. McCormack faces a misdemeanor battery charge after allegedly pushing or striking a 67-year-old city employee during the altercation, Means said. Nalls was cited for skateboarding and faces misdemeanor charges of fleeing and obstructing governmental operations.

[redqueen]

39. 'pushing or striking'

yeah, that couldn't be trumped up

not at all

no chance of that

we can take that straight to the bank!

[LostinVA]

42. Read what the "assualter" says

McCormack disputed many of the police allegations, especially his battery charge. He said he pulled on the city employee's arm after the man picked a girl off her feet in a choke-hold.

[redqueen]

43. no no no! cops don't lie!

cops are the GOOD guys!

anyone they mistreat DESERVES it, dammit!

when they say jump, you JUMP! no matter how ridiculous it is! bottom line: DON'T QUESTION AUTHORITY! if you do, any retaliation, no matter HOW unjust, is deserved! so fuck you!

:puke:

[LostinVA]

44. Damn, I forgot!

Especially if you're a bunch of hardened criminals skateboarding and calling the cops "sir."

I'll repeat: I dated a cop for three years. Cops lie. Everyone lies. That badge doesn't make someone a moral exemplar.

[pschoeb]

47. The "assualt" on the 67 year old is either on the other cop or happened later

If you watch the video, the cop never charges the first kid on the ground with assault, something I'm pretty sure would have been at the top of his list. Also this first kid actually gets away later, so the only two charged are the White shirted guys who tries to help the girl, and the cameraman. At the end of the first video a women goes runs into the store as the cameraman backs up as the cop goes for his camera, I'm guessing this was the "assault", as it seems like the cameraman says a little later in answer to something, "I wasn't hitting anyone". I'm not sure what that other guy with the bike helmet was, if he was a cop or what.

[LostinVA]

48. He appeared to be a bike cop -- but maybe he was a "meter maid"

[pschoeb]

54. Yeah, so I think that's the 67 year old or the cop

I think the battery charge is on the white shirted guy who tried to help the girl. actually since McCormack's name is Matt, in the beginning of the video while the first kid is being cuffed, who ends up getting away much later, the girl says, "where's Matthew" as she looks behind her. So Matt McCormack is the guy in the white shirt and black pants who tries to help the girl when she is put into a headlock. So Skylar Nalls is the cameraman.

[LostinVA]

63. That;'s what I think, too -- I rewatched the videos after I read your post here

If so, McCormack does NOT assault either man.

[pschoeb]

68. I now know that Skylar Nalls is the kid who takes the still picture

of the cop chocking the first kid on the ground, This is the guy who then leaves, is chased by the police and escapes by skateboard. Matt McCormack is the kid who tried to help the girl.

The initial guy on ground, the cameraman, the girl, and the other pudgy kid in the white shirt and hat, seem to me to all be juveniles, I would say about 13-15. So my guess is the cops aren't releasing their names, though I think all their names have been posted with the you tube clip, but not who is who. The initial kid I think tells the cop he's 13.

[LostinVA]

73. Ah -- thanks

Do you have a link for the still photo?

[pschoeb]

74. It's actually at the very begining of the You Tube video

But is obscured by the text, and doesn't stay on very long.

This is the best I could find

[LanternWaste]

76. Don't let a few well-placed...

Don't let a few well-placed facts stand in the way of denigrating law enforcement-- as everyone well knows they're all nazi's, pigs and intent on stealing our first-born...

[LifeDuringWartime]

20. Speaking of the elderly

The cop actually knocked into an elderly person while running after one of them.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Warpy]

26. Straw man

The cop was normal sized. The kids were male. It looked like one ran in the beginning of the film, away from the camera. The other two kids were complaining about the cop enforcing a sensible law (see above).

This has nothing to do with a 400 pound cop, a teenage girl, or choking anybody.

[LostinVA]

30. One of the kids was a petite female who was held in a headlock

Not that the males should have been threated that way either.

The cop grabbed TWO OF THEM at once and put them into headlocks, just because -- I watched that part several times. I can tell you that THAT is NOT proper police procedure. Notice that the other cop doesn't help with this... nor do either of them chase after the clearly frightened girl when she slips away. I consider that pretty good evidence that she wasn't considered a criminal, don't you? Cops don't just let criminals run away.

[Tyler Durden]

75. NO you are WRONG.

YOU ARE JAYWALKING!!! (The equivalent infraction in that city) YOU ARE UNDER ARREST!!!

Sorry, but if a 16 year old riding a fucking SKATEBOARD is put face down on the concrete like a felon, THAT IS POLICE OVERREATION, and I hope the sonofbitch loses his job and gets sued.

We have a no Skateboard on the sidewalk ordinance, and the cops just tell the kids to stop, and THAT'S IT. The worst that has happened is a call to the parents.

[LostinVA]

77. Excellent example, Tyler

[TX-RAT]

78. McCormack is 21, Nalls is 19

Neither was arrested for riding skate boards. MacCormack was arrested for a battery charge. Nalls was arrested for fleeing to allude and obstructing governmental operations. I believe all were given citations for skate boarding.

[Tyler Durden]

89. Let's see:

A big fat cop grinds my friends' face into the pavement. Hmm. As a 16 year old with a mild sense of self-preservation, I think I'll beat feet.

The FIRST kid was perp slapped to the ground for SKATEBOARDING. It's on the tape.

[pschoeb]

31. The choking occured before this video

One of the other skateboarders had a camera and photographed or videotaped it before the guy with the video camera came over. When the kid told the other kid who made the videotape we have, he had a picture of the cop choking the kid on the ground, he starts to move away, but as far as I can tell the rest of these kids were not under arrest, the cop tells him to come over here, and then he leaves. The cop chases him, but doesn't catch him.

[natrat]

50. dude you probably shouldn't comment on things if you are that clueless

video #1 2:01 in-yes it's a 16 year old female apx. 100 pounds and he looks like an overweight idiot of at least 240 pounds. You do the math if your capable

[Donnachaidh]

4. You'd act disorderly too if a cop was trying to put you in a headlock

Jesus! These cops are out of control.

[B3Nut]

5. It's way past time for We The People

to use every legal means necessary to crack down on the misbehavior of our employees. Yes, that's right. Our employees. We really need to fire some of them.

Todd in Cheesecurdistan

[personman]

16. "Yes, that's right. Our employees."

I think that is the liberal statist kool-aid version. Here is how it really works: you do what they say, or they beat you with a stick.

Don't like it? Do something about it...They DARE you.

-personman

[TX-RAT]

22. Some people really need to read the links provided.

From the link.


Police spokesman McCrary Means identified two of those arrested as McCormack, 21, and Skylar Nalls, 19, both of Hot Springs. McCormack faces a misdemeanor battery charge after allegedly pushing or striking a 67-year-old city employee during the altercation, Means said. Nalls was cited for skateboarding and faces misdemeanor charges of fleeing and obstructing governmental operations.


Four juveniles involved in the incident also face skateboarding citations and resisting arrest charges, Means said.

[LostinVA]

33. I did read the links and watched the videos -- the cop was wrong

He did NOT handle this how it should have been handled.

I dated a police officer for three years, and as sleazy as some of her colleagues could be, they would never have done something like this. They would have scared the kids with a fine and kicked them off the main street. Cops are taught to NEVER escalate the situation if at all possible. This cop did. And, the kids' behavior during all of this shows that they are decent kids. This wasn't a cop foiling an attempted murder. His posturing and threats are a bit much, I think.

Teenagers are citizens, too.

[TX-RAT]

38. How would you have handled it?

First you have to arrest the 21 year old for assaulting a 67 year old, then you have to arrest the 19 year old for interfering with a peace officer, and the whole time you have to deal with a bunch of juveniles. Now you tell me how you think it should have been done, since your the (I dated a police officer for three years) expert.

[LostinVA]

41. How do you know he assaulted him???

It wasn't even what caused the incident to occur. Saying that doesn't make it so. McCormack says, " McCormack disputed many of the police allegations, especially his battery charge. He said he pulled on the city employee's arm after the man picked a girl off her feet in a choke-hold." So, there is currently no proof he assaulted anyone.

I stated several times in this thread how I would have handled it: telling them to move along or they would be fined. This isn't even a criminal violation. The cop had no right to arrest them for skateboarding. Fined, yes, Being told to move to the streets where they could skateboard, yes. Being told if they didn't they could get cited for disorderedly conduct or loitering, yes.

Cops aren't supposed to "go for the kill" in these situations. They are taught not to.

You can spin this all you want, but all you're gonna get is dizzy.

[TX-RAT]

45. So all a suspect has to do is say " I didn't do it"

And your OK with that? I was a peace officer for 22 years and a county judge for 8. One thing i learned over all those years, was they all say they didn't do it. That's why we have prosecuting attorney's, defence attorney's, judges and jury's. He'll get his chance in court, and we'll see how this comes out. The video will be part of the evidence. I'm just going by what i read and what he's being charged with.

[natrat]

52. you sound corrupt-think about it-"they all say they didn'd do it"

You have no place on the bench and should be ashamed

[ProudDad]

57. "He'll get his chance in court"

Yeah, right... :sarcasm:

"we have prosecuting attorney's, defence attorney's, judges" (what makes you think he'll get a jury of his peers?)

All of these COLLUDE with the cops in their silly, fucking little game that has NOTHING to do with truth or justice.

Cops lie. Lawyers lie. Judges pretend that neither lie. And juries don't know shit...


And yes, I DO HAVE PERSONAL knowledge of how the fucking criminal-injustice "system" works for real.

[LostinVA]

64. I have personal knowledge, too

As I said, I dated a cop for three years. Before court, they would decide what they were going to say. Notice I didn't say they thought how to answer questions, etc., like you do when you practice for a job interview. I mean, THEY DECIDED WHAT THEY NEEDED TO SAY.

Do all cops lie? Of course not. But, DO cops lie? Hell yes.

[TX-RAT]

69. I DO HAVE PERSONAL knowledge of how the fucking criminal-injustice "system"

That i have no doubt about.

[ProudDad]

91. Oooooooooooh

big mean cop... I'm shaking in my boots...


Your attitude proves my case....

[TX-RAT]

95. And your attitude proves what i've suspected.

[tularetom]

8. The kids were pretty cool - the cop was an asshole

I think he watches walker texass ranger on TV too much.

[Name removed]

10. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Miss Chybil]

11. I've had my truck broken into and the stereo stolen out of it twice - right in my own driveway.

When I called the cops they wanted to take the report over the phone. I said, "Don't you need to take fingerprints, or anything?" The reply, "We're too busy for that."

My brother was out in his aluminum boat fishing one night, just off the shore, when a bunch of kids came up and started yelling at him, throwing rocks at him and threatening to shoot him. My brother called the sheriff's department asking for help. They asked him, if he could identify the kids. "No, it's too dark," he said. "But, they say they're going to blow me out of the water. I need help, please!" Their reply: "Well, sir. I'm sure they'll be gone by the time we get there and if you can't identify them, there's nothing we can do."

Two weeks before, my brother's house had been burglarized. My sister-in-law walked in on three men with guns. Luckily she was able to run away and call the police from the neighbor's house. The burglars left before the cops got there. They haven't found them, yet.

Now, I see what the cops are so busy doing. I feel much safer now.

[KansDem]

53. Several years ago I found a license plate in the parking lot of a shopping mall...

Many thoughts crossed my mind:
1) Car owner lost it and would like to have it back to avoid paying for a new one;
2) Car stolen and bogus plate put on car--real plate thrown on the ground (which I found)
3) Car was used in a crime and plate thrown away to avoid I.D.

Anyway, I thought I'd be a "good citizen" and call the police. I thought they would send a car out to pick up the plate to either turn it over to the owner or pass it on to a detective for investigation. I thought they would want to make sure everything was kosher about this plate.

No way...

I was told that I could drop it by the nearest police station, which wasn't very close to me. The person with whom I spoke didn't even ask me for the plate number (???). The impression I got was they didn't want to be bothered with it and I could play "good citizen" by dropping it by a station house, if I wanted to. I was flabbergasted.

I just threw it away and went about my business...

[xchrom]

12. oh yes those dangerous teens!?!?! whatever was that cop to do --

except choke the shit out of at least one of them?

:eyes:

[pschoeb]

15. Pretty crazy cops, just waiting for them to start jumping physically on you

for littering or smoking a cigarette in a municipal building. Actually just to point out the ordinance on skateboarding, roller blading or biking is only banned on sidewalks, parks and plaza which are in certain areas in Hot Springs. It's totally OK to skateboard on the street as long as one isn't violating rules of traffic.

Whats funny is unlike littering, which in Hot Springs is classified as a misdeamenor, skateboarding is not classified as a criminal violation, and the only penalty allowed is a fine.

http://www.ci.hot-springs.ar.us/services-doc-center-code.html

[LostinVA]

34. So, they shouldn't have even been arrested for skateboarding, eh?

UNLAWFUL ARREST.

Jesus, I can't wait to see how some posters spin this.

[Kingshakabobo]

40. There's no such thing as Unlawful Arrest.....not in the real world of 'testilying' anyway.

They always pile on with "disorderly conduct."

The catchall when kids don't:

[whistle]

18. Police state Amerika and another strong indication the country is becoming

...more and more fascist:

<snip>
The 14 Characteristics of Fascism
by Lawrence Britt
Spring 2003


Political scientist Dr. Lawrence Britt recently wrote an article about fascism ("Fascism Anyone?," Free Inquiry, Spring 2003, page 20). Studying the fascist regimes of Hitler (Germany), Mussolini (Italy), Franco (Spain), Suharto (Indonesia), and Pinochet (Chile), Dr. Britt found they all had 14 elements in common. He calls these the identifying characteristics of fascism. The excerpt is in accordance with the magazine's policy.

The 14 characteristics are:

1. Powerful and Continuing Nationalism
Fascist regimes tend to make constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. Flags are seen everywhere, as are flag symbols on clothing and in public displays.


2. Disdain for the Recognition of Human Rights
Because of fear of enemies and the need for security, the people in fascist regimes are persuaded that human rights can be ignored in certain cases because of "need." The people tend to look the other way or even approve of torture, summary executions, assassinations, long incarcerations of prisoners, etc.


3. Identification of Enemies/Scapegoats as a Unifying Cause
The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial , ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.


4. Supremacy of the Military
Even when there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Soldiers and military service are glamorized.


5. Rampant Sexism
The governments of fascist nations tend to be almost exclusively male-dominated. Under fascist regimes, traditional gender roles are made more rigid. Opposition to abortion is high, as is homophobia and anti-gay legislation and national policy.


6. Controlled Mass Media
Sometimes to media is directly controlled by the government, but in other cases, the media is indirectly controlled by government regulation, or sympathetic media spokespeople and executives. Censorship, especially in war time, is very common.


7. Obsession with National Security
Fear is used as a motivational tool by the government over the masses.


8. Religion and Government are Intertwined
Governments in fascist nations tend to use the most common religion in the nation as a tool to manipulate public opinion. Religious rhetoric and terminology is common from government leaders, even when the major tenets of the religion are diametrically opposed to the government's policies or actions.


9. Corporate Power is Protected
The industrial and business aristocracy of a fascist nation often are the ones who put the government leaders into power, creating a mutually beneficial business/government relationship and power elite.


10. Labor Power is Suppressed
Because the organizing power of labor is the only real threat to a fascist government, labor unions are either eliminated entirely, or are severely suppressed .


11. Disdain for Intellectuals and the Arts
Fascist nations tend to promote and tolerate open hostility to higher education, and academia. It is not uncommon for professors and other academics to be censored or even arrested. Free expression in the arts is openly attacked, and governments often refuse to fund the arts.


12. Obsession with Crime and Punishment
Under fascist regimes, the police are given almost limitless power to enforce laws. The people are often willing to overlook police abuses and even forego civil liberties in the name of patriotism. There is often a national police force with virtually unlimited power in fascist nations.


13. Rampant Cronyism and Corruption
Fascist regimes almost always are governed by groups of friends and associates who appoint each other to government positions and use governmental power and authority to protect their friends from accountability. It is not uncommon in fascist regimes for national resources and even treasures to be appropriated or even outright stolen by government leaders.


14. Fraudulent Elections
Sometimes elections in fascist nations are a complete sham. Other times elections are manipulated by smear campaigns against or even assassination of opposition candidates, use of legislation to control voting numbers or political district boundaries, and manipulation of the media. Fascist nations also typically use their judiciaries to manipulate or control elections.

http://www.ratical.org/ratville/CAH/fasci14chars.html

[rocktivity]

19. There was a skate kid on MTV's Pimp My Ride show

who bought a used police car at an auction, but didn't get a new paint job. He complained that the cops would pull him over to make sure he'd hadn't stolen it, and that the other skate kids gave him the cold shoulder because they thought he was a cop!

:rofl:
rocknation

[laconicsax]

21. Maybe excessive, but not police brutality.

The video does show it pretty good. The kids were skateboarding in an area that was apparently off limits. According to the Title 4, Chapter 7 of Hot Springs City Ordinances (link), skateboarding isn't allowed in certain areas. Someone from the area who can identify the street they were on could verify if this was one of those streets.

There was one kid being a smart-ass trying to play down what they were doing, but the fact remains that if this was one of the streets where skateboarding is illegal, then they broke the law and others further broke the law when they tried to run and resist arrest.

The biggest issue I saw is that, while we don't see or hear the rest of the incident, none of them were read their rights.

Did the cop use excessive force? Choking: yes. Headlocks to take them down: probably. Threats of pepper spray: no.

[TX-RAT]

23. What the video didn't show.

Was the young man who apparently struck a 67 year old city employee and started this whole mess.

[LostinVA]

36. Struck how? Do you mean bumped into?

"Struck" has an assaultive connotation.

[TX-RAT]

46. Interestingly since he was charged with battery.

Among other charges.

[ProudDad]

58. Fucking Cops

ALWAYS overcharge anyone.

Especially after they assault their chosen perpetrator...

The "charge" don't mean shit and is usually wrong...

[LostinVA]

65. And is often dropped

I think the shot of this jerk headlocking and lifting TWO kids -- one a petite female -- who did nothing threatening or criminal is a disgrace, and he should lose his badge for it. Forget for a moment if it's harassment, etc. -- it is definitely unsafe, unofficial procedure and shows an officer who lost his temper and went bonkers. And, that's with with a bunch of white, middle class kids, surrounded by a crowd and on camera.

He's a liability to all of the decent cops out there.

[LostinVA]

82. Again, there is zero proof he assaulted anyone

And, videoed proof that at least two of the skateboarders, at least a female minor, WERE assaulted.

[LostinVA]

37. Not what McCormack says

McCormack disputed many of the police allegations, especially his battery charge. He said he pulled on the city employee's arm after the man picked a girl off her feet in a choke-hold.

[LostinVA]

35. They wee threatened with pepper spray -- WHILE THEY WERE FACE DOWN AND CUFFED

Including minors.

Plus, they were told they were being arrested for skateboarding. But guess what? They CAN'T be arrested for skateboarding, because it's not a crime.

I bet the Hot Springs City Attorney is popping Pepcid as we speak.

[redqueen]

27. why do they always get 'administrative leave'?

i don't get that.

[derby378]

49. Is citizen's arrest legal in Hot Springs?

How hard would it be for a dozen skateboarders to tackle those two cops, disarm them, handcuff them, and inform them of their rights until the proper authorities showed up?

Ponder that one for a while.

[pointblank]

61. That would be great to see

but I guarantee you it would end up some serious ass beatings and upheld charges...upon the skateboarders once the rest of the cop's buddies showed up.

Listen, I completely agree that cops have WAY too much power in comparison to the low standards and training they have to adhere to and endure to get that power, but make no mistake, they will ALWAYS take the side of one of their own (except in extreme circumstances) and so will the rest of the dumbass public.

[pointblank]

55. It looked like VERY excessive force to me...

The only thing that I see, and I am no lawyer, that looked illegal is the cop grabbing the two kids and putting them in a headlock for no apparent reason (one was an 80 lb teenage girl which tells me this POS is a control freak with an un-even temper and should NOT be a cop, but that is another epidemic in itself.)If you look at the video and see the events leading up to it it really was un-warranted.

I am sure that skateboarding is an offense much like speeding or other traffic violations there...but as any cop will tell you, they can arrest someone and take them to jail for a traffic violation if they really want to...so him simply witnessing someone skateboarding allows him to arrest that person. Undoubtedly this creep will end up keeping his shitty job and later on shoot someone for shoplifting.


(edited for spelling and grammar)

[pschoeb]

59. Actually no they can't jail you for speeding or most traffic violations

It's not a crime, and is only punishable by fine, no jail time or handcuffing allowed, at least in all the jurisdictions I know off, it would be a severe violation of your rights to arrest you and take you into custody for speeding or minor traffic violation, with no other reason. Though if you were driving without proof of insurance or proper license they could take you in, because if you do not have these then it becomes a crime. You also can't arrest, handcuff, and take into jail, a business owner for putting out too big a sign on the sidewalk, though you can cite him with a violation, it's the same class of violation.

[pointblank]

60. It may be different in

each jurisdiction, but I have a few good friends who used to be cops and they have told me that they could arrest you and take you to jail for a traffic violation...although they better have a good damn reason for it or they would be reprimanded and embarassed...

Think about it...speeding COULD, and I stress COULD, be construed as attempted assault (or whatever the hell they call it) the same way skateboarding down a crowded sidewalk could be...

I would love it if a cop or ex-cop commented on this.

[pschoeb]

62. They would have to have a reason, other than the minor traffic violation

or they would have to make up a reason, like you said, which would not be unheard of in police circles. But of course this really is not different than saying that cops can arrest you anytime they want for no reason, by just making up charges, though they can do so only by seriously violating the law themselves.

We actually don't know if the original arrested kid was on the sidewalk while skateboarding, it's actually legal in Hot Springs to skateboard on all the streets, just like it is to ride a bike on the street, but not on the sidewalks in certain areas(I looked up the ordinances).

[LostinVA]

67. They cannot arrest someone here for skateboarding

It's like a parking ticket, not a traffic violation.

It would be like you took too long in a store and came out and saw your meter was expired. They could ticket you, but the "meter maid"/cop couldn't come and cuff and arrest you for that. It's not a crime.

[TX-RAT]

70. How about a retired one.

In some states, Texas being one of them, speeds above 100mph is an arrestable offence. Depending on the nature of the violation, some can turn into reckless endangerment charges.

[MindPilot]

79. I know that's true in Cali -- three digits and it's no longer speeding

it's reckless driving.

Maybe you can answer this. I see frequently on Cops someone gets cuffed, and the cop says, "you are not under arrest, I'm just detaining you." Oookay...I'm cuffed sitting in the back of a black & white, how am I not under arrest?

I used to teach traffic school; I've had more than one CHP officer tell me that a person is considered to be under arrest the instant the lights go on. Accurate?

[TX-RAT]

86. Being detained and being arrested is 2 different things.

It may not feel like it if your the one wearing the cuffs, but it is. People are detained for different reasons, but the main reason is for safety. Nobody wants to lose their freedom and some will get down right dangerous. To reduce these danger and also try to prevent suspects from destroying evidence or fleeing, they will be detained in that manner. The officer may later release you, or he may inform you that you are under arrest and proceed to read you your rights.

The last question is not accurate

[plasticsundance]

80. Yeah ... well ... skateboards don't go 100mph

[TX-RAT]

83. Nobody was arrested for riding skate boards.

Damn! i wish people would read the links provided.

[plasticsundance]

85. It was a joke.

I believe it was you that posted sitting on the bench for 8-years. I know something about the law, so to say, and I know what ProudDad says is true about the collusion part. Your postings on this topic appears to underscore the point.

[LostinVA]

66. Skateboarding isn't a crime, it's like a parking ticket

You can't arrest someone for a parking ticket, and in Hot Springs, you can't arrest someone for skateboarding on streets where it's not allowed. It's not a CRIMINAL offense. It's only a fined violation.

[TX-RAT]

72. What was he charged with and arrested for?

[LostinVA]

81. Did you watch the videos?

Several of them were told they were being arrested for skateboarding.

[TX-RAT]

84. They were given citations for skate boarding.

The arrests were for other charges.

[Kingshakabobo]

87. No, the kids keep saying they were arrested for riding a skateboard.

The cop never said they were "arrested" for riding a skateboard.

The first kid on the ground was told he was being arrested for fleeing. The girl was told she was in violation of city ordinance. When she refused to sit down and started to flee she was placed under arrest. The third kid jumped in to the fracas while Officer Cartman was arresting the girl - bad move.

[LostinVA]

88. No

[Imagevision]

71. " officer in question is on administrative leave" - the lardass should be booted off the force!!

[Name removed]

90. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ProudDad]

92. I believe the People over the cop's flak...

I believe the People over the rogue cop:

"Police spokesman McCrary Means identified two of those arrested as McCormack, 21, and Skylar Nalls, 19, both of Hot Springs. McCormack faces a misdemeanor battery charge after allegedly pushing or striking a 67-year-old city employee during the altercation, Means said. Nalls was cited for skateboarding and faces misdemeanor charges of fleeing and obstructing governmental operations.

Four juveniles involved in the incident also face skateboarding citations and resisting arrest charges, Means said.

McCormack disputed many of the police allegations, especially his battery charge. He said he pulled on the city employee's arm after the man picked a girl off her feet in a choke-hold."


On Edit: THANK DOG there was someone with a camera ready.

Hey, Pigs, watch out -- you too could be on Candid Camera!!!

[bling bling]

93. Some of you cop haters really ought to seek therapy.

It must suck to be so angry. And yet ironically, the seething anger you harbor gives even MORE power to the object of your hatred and makes you even MORE powerless. It's kind of pathetic. I'm sure I'm reading posts about this being further "proof" that America is a police state. Oh the drama.

"Resentment is like taking poison and waiting for the other person to die."