Carters book prompts more resignations.

[k_jerome]

http://www.abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=2787792

Fourteen members of an advisory board to Jimmy Carter's human rights organization resigned on Thursday to protest his new book, which criticizes Israeli policy in the Palestinian territories.

snip

"You have clearly abandoned your historic role of broker in favor of becoming an advocate for one side," the departing members of the Center's Board of Councilors told Carter in their letter of resignation.

snip

[no_hypocrisy]

1. I think that symbolic gesture in itself should earn a nomination for

the next "Profiles in Courage" award. Carter did his research, he reached his own conclusions, and he's taking the criticism that he anticipated the book would generate. He didn't write it to polish his legacy.

[damntexdem]

37. Well, there's a saying about such resignations: "good riddance!"

Is he also supposed to be an 'honest broker' between truth and lies?

[The Backlash Cometh]

47. He is definitely a beacon of truth.

We need to face our demons, and once we do we will be free to make objective decisions and the world will be better off for it.

[Megahurtz]

2. Too Bad he signed into law

back then, agreeing to give them billions
and billions of our dollars every year.

[lovuian]

3. When you stand in front of your friends coffin you think of the

past and what you may have done wrong... Carter is trying to redeem himself

at least he is TRYING

while others haven't a clue

[question everything]

6. Carter is the one who brought evanglical Christianity to the

White House.

The religious wrong may not have latched unto Reagan had it not realized that Carter got away with it.

[tigereye]

10. Carter was extrememly moderate to liberal for an evangelical

he bore little or no resemblance to Reagan's fundie pals, Ralph Reed, or anything that followed them.

[femrap]

50. Some of those crazy rightwingers

saw how the Baptists got into politics because of Carter and then :think: got the idea of using and manipulating these people to the Right's advantage.

I read an article about this not too long ago....I think it was the Direct Mail Guru...Viguerie (sp?) and someone else who saw what Bible Thumpers could do for them.

I believe that this 'movement' has played itself out....people have seen how they have been used by the Right. They were played...big time.

[Benhurst]

15. Wrong. Reagan had Billy Graham and other fundies preaching in

the East Room. Carter did not start that foolishness. Clinton finally put a stop to it.

Whatever his personal convictions, Carter upheld the separation of church and state.

Our most recent Nobel Peace Prize Laurette is a Christian, in deed as well as word. And that is what the so-called born-agains and proud members of The World's Only Superpower find so threatening.

:spank: edited to correct brain fart

[Trillo]

17. I was unaware of that evangelism

Got any specific examples?

[Tom Joad]

23. Clinton used religion too.

[Le Taz Hot]

43. Incorrect.

Reagan and the reich wing brought in the fundamentalists -- not Carter. They believed, and correctly so, that they needed them to win the presidency. They STILL need them. Tragically, there are now leading Democrats courting them.

[Canuckistanian]

44. No, he did not

Did Jimmy Carter bring Jimmy Swaggart or Jim Baker on as advisors? Not bloody likely.

Carter knew the difference between religious people and extremist nutjobs.

[Pacifist Patriot]

49. Evangelical Christianity and Fundamentalist Christianity are not synonymous

It's an important distinction to grasp in order to understand the Christian Right and be prepared to counter their ridiculous beliefs and insidious tactics. Jimmy Carter was one of the fundamentalists first political victims. Back to the history books with you. :)

[lumpy]

56. B...S... Carter is not an evanglical Christian.

x

[Megahurtz]

8. You're right. At least he's trying. n/t

[question everything]

4. Most of these "billions" that go in foreign aid

has strings attached. It has to be used to purchase goods back in this country.

It also established military cooperation between Israel and the U.S.

You may not like anything military - though you enjoy the safety that the military provides you - but Israel was, still is, an important testing field for US made military equipment.

You can be certain that if the US decides to attack Iran, the lessons learned from the Israeli Lebanese war will be carefully studied.

It is quite possible that "them" have saved your life, or will, in the future.

[Megahurtz]

12. I just don't like all these billions and billions of dollars

of Foreign Aid pouring out of this Country when we need it here. The U.S. needs to take care of their own first. Then, and only then will this Country be strong enough to take care of others. Does any other Country do this? No. Military or not, it's all about the money.

[Benhurst]

18. American taxpayers should not be asked to give foreign aid to

any country with a national health program until this benighted country gets one for itself.

[Megahurtz]

21. Exactly.

That's one of the reasons that makes it so ridiculous.

[pampango]

35. While we certainly need universal health care, most of our foreign aid, other

than that which goes to Israel, goes to countries without much health care of any kind. I hope that we are not sending much aid to Europe, Australia or Japan. Health care in the Third World is not usually very good.

[Benhurst]

46. Fine, then cut off all aid to all but POOR, DEMOCRATIC

countries.

[Kolesar]

26. How many $billions are we talking about?

How about putting a price tag on your ire? Note that 33 cents/American gets you your first $billion. Tell me if you think each American is paying too much.

[Megahurtz]

30. Yes, Too Much. Way Too Much.

When this Country is going down the tubes itself we are paying too much.
That money could be used here towards our own Country
and there are many people here that need it.

[Kolesar]

39. That is a message that I am--how shall I say--"Not comfortable with"

There has long been this trumpet that we are supporting the rest of the world and that is hardly the case. We are exploiting the rest of the world.

[Megahurtz]

40. But you are avoiding one fact

The U.S. is sending billions and billions to Isreal and to Egypt too, I take it?
(which was signed into by Carter)
while ignoring their own at home.
One billion is too much. Even less than that is too much.

You may not be comfortable as you say with the message, but I would guess that you yourself are monetarily $comfortable$ or else you would be uncomfortable enough for this to bother you.

Many, many people in the U.S. are not monitarily comfortable.

And on that note I say the U.S. should stop supporting, and exploiting the rest of the World!

[Kolesar]

42. How many $billions are we talking about?

[femrap]

52. Doesn't Israel receive more financial aid (esp. military)

from the US than any country or combination of countries? I remember seeing numbers that were astronomical....way beyond the bonds of thoughtful.

I believe that AIPAC (The Lobby) has much too much power and financial influence over our Representatives. And my saying this doesn't mean that I dislike Judaism anymore than I dislike any other organized religion.

Looking back at history, all I see are wars started by organized religions. What a waste.

The Palestinian people need a home, too. Those that deny them that are either full of greed or hatred....something, I thought, a religion would oppose.

Are human beings so flawed and innately hateful? Or is it just an elite few that have such greed and hate? I guess that question has been discussed for centuries. But now that we have bombs that can destroy the planet (never mind the environmental damage from our industrious lifestyle), this question is facing us head-on. Can we stop the greed and hate? Can we let all people have a home and live in some sort of dignity? War is the easy way out. Peace takes courage.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[leesa]

48. Too funny. There's a curly rationalization for our Israeli Welfare State

Did you know that since Olmert and Gates have finally admitted Israel has nukes, it is illegal for us to give them aide according to US law?

[Seldona]

55. Oh please!

There hasn't been a war in my lifetime fought in DEFENSE of this country. Hell, alot longer than that.

I am so sick of this false glorification of our military industrial complex it makes me want to puke.

[ChairmanAgnostic]

5. fools. WHen he speaks, it is from truth and experience.

You go, Jimmy. We support you.

[shance]

7. More often than not, there is one side who is creating more abuse than another.

This is so sad.

Another example of a good leader being honest, being unfairly demonized for telling the truth of what is being done to the Palestinians.

We can't let the good leaders be harmed any more.

There have been too many.

That is why we have so few good leaders willing to tell the truth today.

[question everything]

9. And how do you know that he is telling the truth?

Have you searched the issue? What do you know about the evens and people in the region? Why, because this is Carter who earned his wings by criticizing Bush?

[The Stranger]

19. Have you read the book?

[tsuki]

64. Yes. And I enjoyed it. It gave me much to think about. n/t

[shance]

20. What does he have to gain but more bullying threats, and intimidation from Zionists

Do you this has been easy for Carter when there is so much money and power behind those who want to intimidate anyone and everyone who speaks up for the people of Palestine?

[LanternWaste]

32. Seems to me that when a person's reputation is on the line

Seems to me that when a person's reputation is on the line AND that they're losing more than they gain, chances are they're telling the truth.

Have you some additional info that he is indeed *not* telling the truth? I ask because in Critical Thought, I learned that the burden of proof lies with the critic.

Edited for spelling

[Norquist Nemesis]

11. Sounds to me that the departing members picked sides first

I don't see Carter's position as being one-sided or picking a side. I post very little about I/P stuff because I'm just not one of the everything/anything Israel does is justified crowd.

[ReadTomPaine]

13. Bingo. I'm sure there won't be any problems replacing them. n/t

[Wiley50]

14. Good Ridance To Neocons, Lobbyists and Neocon lobbyists n/t

[goforit]

53. Yes.....All neocons! Or should we say Anti-peace activists.

[xchrom]

16. carter has done what is right.

and he has pointed out the Big Obstacle.

carter has not picked sides{their words} only looked honestly at what NEEDS to be looked at honestly.

[Tom Joad]

22. Sadly, some are downright cowardly when it comes to controversy.

To the 186 members who stayed with the Carter Center, we salute you.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

27. Since you can quote up to 4 paragraphs, I wonder why the OP didn't include this one:

"The 200-member board is responsible for building public support for the Carter Center. It is not the organization's governing board."

Read alone, the OP suggest people are running away from Carter like the plague.

[oblivious]

31. "93% of Carter's Advisory Board support his book"

[Tom Joad]

25. Remember what happened to Howard Dean when he said he was going to be "even-handed"

The israel-rightwing-nuts cut him to pieces for saying such a thing. dean then said he didn't mean it, and they forgave him.

Imagine... an even-handed foreign policy? It might bring...

Peace.

[catgirl]

28. Go Jimmy!

He dares to speak the truth! Funny how some people react
when their skewed "reality" is exposed. Remember how
the Dixie Chicks were attacked for critcizing Bush? They
received death threats. Are these people now apologizing?

[catgirl]

29. In fact... I'm going to get the book ASAP

[november3rd]

36. I'm going to, too

there are 150+ holds on my libraries 42 copies, so I guess I have to get my own.

[donkeyotay]

33. Thanks President Carter for serving your country again

That reminds me, I've got to read the book. Truth is that people get trashed for even mentioning that there's more than one side to this story...another false choice - you're either with us or against us mentality. Carter's right and so is the Iraqi Study Group. Bush's hands off, drive-with-your-eyes-closed road map hasn't made America or Israel safer.

[Divine Discontent]

34. all I have to say to those 14 is

STFU...

if they truly believe and love Carter as they supposedly SAY they did, then they would not leave the 200 member board. wah wah wah... the man is telling it like it is.



www.cafepress.com/warisprofitable <<-- antibush prodem stickers/shirts

[w4rma]

38. 200 member board? That's large. These 14 are just a drop in a bucket, then. (nt)

[spooky3]

51. the article says this was not the governing board, either

it sounds as though they were fundraisers

[Ouabache]

41. hey that's 14 Job Openings in this suckass Bu$h economy

where do we send our resumes ???

[jonnyblitz]

45. how ironic that the organization is a human rights organization

and they are resigning because of a book that criticizes a country that is a MAJOR human rights violater. fucking loons. :crazy:

Maybe they can get jobs at Heritage Foundation or become advisors to David Horowitz.

[Name removed]

54. Deleted sub-thread

Sub-thread removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Lurking Dem]

57. Has anyone here actually read the letters

and addressed or debunked their complaints?

[izzybeans]

61. Where are the letters?

After having read the book I find this b.s. about him being one-sided at best irrational.

[izzybeans]

58. When they whine that it is one-sided they mean, "I haven't read the book yet, but am gonna piss and

moan anyway."

At least they aren't locking him up like Mandela. I'm putting in my application to the Carter Center now.

[Lurking Dem]

59. Since they address specifics in the book

what leads you to say they haven't read it?

[izzybeans]

60. Where do they address specifics?

Most of the people I see arguing this have clearly not read the book, in fact they all use the same small set of quotations in their argument. "Tell Jimmy to explain 'X'". The odds of a group of people all coming away with the same three or four quotations stuck in their head by chance is very small. I'd say I'm making a pretty astute inference. Just hang around the Carter book threads long enough you'll see those same quotations pop up. You can google them even and find them like a virus all over right-wing agit-prop sites.

The man is being "swift boated" for pointing out the obvious, and in his book he does this with great care for giving a fair shake to both sides.

[Lurking Dem]

65. Start here

Dr. Melvin Konner, Emory Professor

http://blog.camera.org/archives/2007/01/emory_professors_letter_to_car.html

http://www.emorywheel.com/media/storage/paper919/news/2006/12/12/News/Professor.Describes.Carter.inaccuracies-2532452.shtml?norewrite200701121505&sourcedomain=www.emorywheel.com




Denis Ross, Envoy to the Middle East (Clinton)

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/09/opinion/09ross.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin





Letters from the Carter Center resignations

http://camera.org/index.asp?x_context=2&x_outlet=118&x_article=1266





Kenneth Stein

http://www.emorywheel.com/media/storage/paper919/news/2006/12/12/News/Professor.Describes.Carter.inaccuracies-2532452.shtml?norewrite200701121450&sourcedomain=www.emorywheel.com





The ever dreaded Dershowitz

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?apage=4&cid=1164881943132&pagename=JPost%2FJPArticle%2FShowFull


http://www.gather.com/viewArticlePF.jsp?articleId=281474976879837




The ADL

http://www.adl.org/PresRele/IslME_62/4947_62.htm

[izzybeans]

66. One person's opinion is another person's refugee camp.

So some Clinton guy is trying to save his legacy and a few others have trouble with hearing the details of the Camp David accords.

particularly interesting is the "letters" link uses a quotation referring to Arrafat's comment that his PLO has never subscribed to eliminating Isreal it came around the moment in the book that he explicitly made clear that he was presenting one side, and then in turn, would be presenting the other. The rest of the quote from Arrafat included the information that they desired one unified state that did not separate ethnic and religious groups. I don't have the book in front of me or I'd reproduce it. The two state solution validates the title of the book.

But that is just one side. he then went on to detail his dealings with Israeli leaders and yes, he did express skepticism with the rightwing powershift that occured within their government during his tenure. It is quite interesting and it is just one man's point-of-view. One man who obviously feels that the roadmap to peace was set in the 70s.

[RubyDuby in GA]

62. I'm ready to take my seat on the board at any given moment

Dumbasses!

[NorthernSpy]

63. our Jimmy Carter is a brave soul...

What he said needed to be said. Bless him for not backing down!

As for those fourteen board members, good riddance.

[ama]

67. a list of those who resigned

"We are deeply troubled by the president's comments and writings and are submitting the following letter of resignation to the Carter Center," the letter said.

The letters were signed by Alan Abrams, Steve Berman, Michael Coles, Jon Golden, Doug Hertz, Barbara Babbit Kaufman, Liane Levetan, Jeff Levy, Leon Novak, Ambassador William B. Schwartz Jr., William B. Schwartz III, Steve Selig, Cathey Steinberg, and Gail Solomon.

http://www.cnn.com/2007/US/01/11/carter.resignations/index.html

[redqueen]

68. THEY are picking sides by their actions.

Sad that they are so devoted to this concept of false balance.

Then again, if they want to join the neo-cons, let them.

[Briar]

69. One way to root out the hypocrites. n/t

[FreeStateDemocrat]

70. Coordinated smear, anytime someone criticize Israel they get battered by

powerful and influential forces.

It takes a real man of strong character just like President Carter to expose the truth about the dark side of Israel’s policy towards the Palestinians.

[Psephos]

71. Lotsa spin goin' on here

Same ol', same ol'...if one's point of view coincides with Carter's, then those board members who left are cowards and hypocrites; if one doesn't agree with Carter, then those who resigned are courageous and principled.

Too bad those words can't be used as they're intended instead of as synonyms for "thinks the same way as me" or "sees things differently from me."

If a bunch of repukes were resigning from, say, Poppy Bush's board, we'd be feasting on it. So who are the hypocrites? (BTW, I don't think Poppy Bush has a board, just sayin'.)

Personally, I think Carter's best contributions are behind him, but that doesn't make me cowardly or brave, just dissenting. My no-spin take is that this is not good for Carter, but not fatal, either.

Peace.