Florida Won't Require Printouts of Touch-Screen Votes

[kskiska]

California will require that its touch-screen voting machines provide paper printouts for each ballot cast, but Florida's top elections official says she does not favor a similar standard here.

California Secretary of State Kevin Shelley's recent paper-trail edict is scheduled to take effect by 2006. The action in the nation's largest state -- and America's largest market for new voting hardware -- hands a potentially precedent-setting victory to opponents of paperless electronic voting.

(snip)

As manufacturers develop ballot printers to accompany touch screens, Florida will be "very open-minded" in reviewing any printers submitted to the state for certification, Secretary of State Glenda Hood said this week. If printers are certified, Hood said, counties would have the option of using them.

But Hood said making a paper trail a statewide requirement is not necessary because Florida has multiple safeguards to assure the accuracy and security of touch screens, which are used in Palm Beach County and 14 other counties.

"Florida has led the nation in providing security and certification," Hood said. "At this point in time, with the satisfaction that the supervisors continue to show... and the fact that we haven't had complaints from voters, I have a high confidence level."

more…
http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/content/auto/epaper/editions/saturday/news_f31d85abb14d429c10b0.html

[Timefortruth]

1. I'm shocked, shocked!

To think that they wouldn't want to be sure the vote is right in Florida. Why would that be, hard to guess?

[cthrumatrix]

13. no truth in voting ...as deemed by shrubs brother...maybe katherine harris

will help out again....let's see how many people that have been accidentally purged from the voting roles have returned?

It's all BS and they know it

[TolstoyAndy]

27. Greg Palast reported

that none of the purged from 2000 were reinstated for '02.

Why should they be reinstated for 2004?

After all, many of theose felons have committed crimes - the FL list says so - in 2007.

[cthrumatrix]

37. do your homework....10-15% (minimum) were errors....gore won

conservatively, these numbers would have put Gore over the top without a need for a recount.

maybe you should look at the Pallast tape again. Your error is in saying most were fellons is a non-starter to those who were wronged and cannot vote.

[truth2power]

41. Uh. . .committed crimes in 2007??

I think Tolstoy was engaging in sarcasm.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

40. Knock-knock!! Anyone home???...

Now why do you seriously think that none of the purged voters were reinstated for 2002?

You do understand that Katherine Harris directed that the original list be expanded to include names similar to those that were actually known to be felons, don't you? Do you also understand that nearly 80,000 Florida voters were disenfranchised and remain so to this day?

[DoYouEverWonder]

48. I think

TolstoyAndy was being sarcastic.

[cthrumatrix]

49. the media should approach Jeb Bush and get him on tape sharing how

he feels about securing a verified vote for his state.

I dare the media to bring this up to the florida gov.!

Where in the hell are they? This is a national crime that is taking place in fron of our eyes and nobody is called to task.

[pistoff democrat]

2. ...breaking news...11/04...breaking news

Bush has just won Florida.

(we now return you to your regularly schedule crap)

[acmavm]

17. Breaking news 11-04? Try 11-03 with this decision.

.

[pistoff democrat]

20. It's always something!

:yourock:



:kick:

[Unforgiven]

22. Bingo!

You Got it, Florida votes(sic) for Bush!

[pinto]

3. Sec of State is supposed to assure

openness and accountability in the electoral process. Glenda Hood (Fla) seems to be comfortable with the ass backward approach - if they don't complain, it must be OK....she's got it wrong.

[glitch]

4. This guy makes a really good point

http://www.pbs.org/cringely/pulpit/pulpit20031204.html

...
Now back to those voting machines. If EVERY OTHER kind of machine you make includes an auditable paper trail, wouldn't it seem logical to include such a capability in the voting machines, too? Given that what you are doing is adapting existing technology to a new purpose, wouldn't it be logical to carry over to voting machines this capability that is so important in every other kind of transaction device?

This confuses me. I'd love to know who said to leave the feature out and why?

Next week: the answer.
...

[LittleDannySlowhorse]

5. Well what do you know

"Florida has led the nation in providing security and certification," Hood said.

I am constantly stunned at the ability of these people to just lie. They don't distort the truth or tell half-truths or anything like that. They just simply tell bald-faced lies, while looking you in the eye and smiling.

I know I should certainly have expected this by now, but I am still kind of blown away by it.

[pinto]

9. I'd like to ask Ms Hood

for Florida's record of "security and certification"...especially the latter.

[Vitruvius]

42. Sociopaths do that. And their ability to look you in the eye and

flat out LIE is one of their advantages.

[DoYouEverWonder]

51. Florida has a good certification program

for the machines themselves. Yes, they can prove that the machines will count the votes and come up with the same totals multiple times.

However, what they don't certify is what happens to those votes when they are transmitted electronicly from the polls to the board of elections. And they can't certify whether or not these systems can be hacked during transmission process or if the results can be hacked in the servers where the results are stored and compiled.

So yes, I can look at individual machines and certify whether or not they work properly, but the rest of the process is not certified. That is were these yahoos blow it.

[asjr]

6. No paper trail

needs to be a mantra in Florida. Let every Dem there let everyone know that Fla is going to try to steal another election. We can help also by notifying our friends and relatives who live there.

[Dirty Hippie]

7. And this from the Tallahassee Democrat

...
And after spending almost $6 million to create - and then fix - a database to ensure accuracy in county voter rolls by weeding out ineligible voters, Florida will not meet a federal requirement to establish a central voter-registration database in time for the 2004 presidential election. The state now is seeking a waiver until 2006

Many state lawmakers seem unconcerned. A Division of Elections update on how the state is implementing federal requirements earlier this month before a Senate appropriations subcommittee lasted about five minutes and drew no questions from committee members.

But Rep. Chris Smith, D-Fort Lauderdale, appointed by Gov. Jeb Bush to a task force to fix the state's election problems, called the failure to establish the central registration database "a major concern."

"Why, in four years, they can't get this thing done?" Smith asked. "I would think that this administration, after all the problems in 2000, would make sure that no one could bring up this issue again. You would think this would be a top priority for them."

...


http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/tallahassee/news/special_packages/deja_vote/7376572.htm

Yeah we got it all figured out in Florida (not).

[cthrumatrix]

14. it's clear ...they don't want it done...they can pass bills in days....

and won't "undue the crime committed from 2000"...they should be held accountable...we need somebody more responsible

[saskatoon]

33. What I want to know is WHEN IS THE REVOLUTION GOING TO BEGIN!

[alittlelark]

34. possibly 11-4-04

perhaps sooner

[donsu]

8. Watching Florida Crumble

nt

[Patriot_Spear]

10. Who'd-a-thunk-it...

Florida doesn't want to have a verification process. Go figure...

[reprobate]

11. Well, at least she's not screwing up Orlando anymore.

You should have heard the sigh of relief when she left central florida. Our only wish is that she took the whole crooked bunch of her supporters with her.

[MrPrax]

12. Shameless and Arrogant...

You would think because of the 2000 vote and the embarassment and 'questions', Florida would (in a real world) go out of it's way to dispell any notion of fraud...

Given the level of fraud and potential fraud and the rather shrill opposition by the industry to 'paper' verification, I assume it's supporters are on the right track...in demanding this small concession to 'BBV'

Having read some of the fraud involved in electronic voting provided by Bev and others,I sorta am starting to wonder about ATMs and especially lottery machines...
These lotteries might be the largest conceivable fraud going...but it can't be exposed as it would cost governments literally hundreds of billions overnight...

[JPace]

15. Then someone needs to pass a law that says...

if a state cannot get voting machines to produce
a paper copy of the vote than they must not use
the machines. They can go back to the primitive
but reliable paper ballot done by hand.

I remember when Florida was doing the recount in
2000 there was a recount going on in Canada of
plain paper ballots. Canada did their recount in
hours....while we all know what happened in
Florida.

[FlaGranny]

16. I just sent Ms. Hood an e-mail.

I can't believe no one has complained. But now she has at least one complaint for certain that I know of.

[Zhade]

32. Do you have her email address?

My family (parents and brother) live in Florida, and I will NOT allow their voting rights to be taken away. I will fight this harder than anything I've ever fought.

Those bastards will not get away with this.

[FlaGranny]

35. This should get you there.

http://enight.dos.state.fl.us/newcontacts.shtml

[OneBlueSky]

18. looks like they want Florida to go for Bush no matter what . . .

the voters do . . . so easy to alter the results with no paper trail, and no one will ever know . . . Florida voters might just as well stay home on election day, for all the good their votes will do . . .

[Unforgiven]

24. No................Remember

Absentee ballot, Absentee Ballot, Make copies, Make copies.

[pansypoo53219]

19. i am telling my cousin

he and his wife better use absentee ballots. and so should all Floridians.

[baby_bear]

21. Speaking of absentee ballots

...different states have different requirements for using them. Can anyone for any reason use absentee ballots in Florida? If so, I absolutely agree that the get out the vote effort should be accompanied by applications for absentee ballots.

s_m

[xxqqqzme]

28. there R many reasons 4 absentee ballots.

My daughter teaches 'n she gets one just so she doesn't do the after work line wait. In CA, all U have 2 do is check a box on the voter registration form. No reason required...X the box...it's done!

[0007]

38. ...and that should be standard in the U.S.

[pinto]

29. If possible, simple and guarantees paper trail. n/t

[DoYouEverWonder]

50. Florida now has early voting

We had early voting for the 2002 and it was a big success. It is the same as voting by absentee ballot, except you don't need an excuse.

In Alachua County we have optical scanners. First you fill out a paper ballot that is feed into the scanner and stored in a secure box that is part of the scanner. So at least in Alachua County we do have a paper record of every vote.

Now under W's arguement with the SC about equal protection under the law, I would say that Florida is in violation of voter's equal protection rights since some voters will still be using paper ballots and other will not. I would love to see some lawsuits about this issue before the 2004 election.

[Rex]

23. It amazes me that they are going to cheat again in Florida

I would think that it would be a 'one time use' kinda thingy, but then again I guess if no one complains (or at least if enough people don't) then scum like Ms. Hood can get away with murder.

[NIGHT TRIPPER]

25. And the lawmakers of that state accept this?

And the people of the state accept this...

The press had to capitalize on this and make them look like the slimes they are.

[The Backlash Cometh]

26. Voters complain.

The supervisors of elections just aren't recording those complaints.

[LiberalTexan]

30. We knew this two years ago

when Katherine Harris was the last one to decide which kind of voting machines she wanted to see the state install. She had a choice of three companies and chose the only option where Floridians would get no paper ballot.

The focus has shifted this election and Florida is (luckily) no longer "the" key state.

[Zhade]

31. VOLUSIA COUNTY, MOTHERFUCKERS.

Explain how -16,000 votes for Gore was "secure" and "accurate".

Idiots!

[gristy]

36. It is telling that Hood refers to "certification" when referring

to printers:

As manufacturers develop ballot printers to accompany touch screens, Florida will be "very open-minded" in reviewing any printers submitted to the state for certification, Secretary of State Glenda Hood said this week. If printers are certified, Hood said, counties would have the option of using them.

A printer that prints out a VOTER VERIFIED paper ballot needs to be "certified" about as much as the ball-point pens they used to use to fill out paper ballots before our democracy was hijacked.

I think what Hood has revealed is what she understands the word "certified" to mean: powers up and appears to respond appropriately to input.

[pinto]

44. Go gristy!......Paper's just not

trustworthy?

[goforit]

39. Tell me "print outs will destroy trees" by using paper, eh?

This Pro- environmental administration is just
ready to go hug a tree now.

LOL!!!

[rocketdem]

43. When will the icecaps melt?

And we can finally be rid of the political fiasco that is Florida?

[truthisfreedom]

45. Florida doesn't NEED to recount ever again. Florida already KNOWS who wins

in EVERY election. anyone named bush.

any state that doesn't demand printed ballots is corrupt and has been bought. it's that simple.

[tlcandie]

46. Marks an 'X' next to the state of Florida to have them NOT

included in any more national voting UNTIL they and any other states can PROVE that they have paper trails/paper ballots!

I live in Florida and I don't think that even absentee voting will make a difference. Those always seem to get lost in the shuffle :(

Who would have ever guessed that one day we would miss and actually wish for the days of the 'hanging/dimpled/dropped/missing chads'?

Well, all I can say is if Florida is going to be UnAmerican and forego the consititution on voting and faith based prisons then just kick us loose at the moorings and let us float on down to Castro...how much worse can it be? I mean shouldn't Jebby feel right at home there?

:puke:

[Rainbows]

47. IN THE PERFECT WORLD ....

democrats would be bright enough to organize a nationwide boycott of electronic voting by simply requesting to vote by absentee ballot. Every democrat's ballot would have a paper trail, and it would make one hell of a statement to the evasive cryptic techno weenies and there Republican shills, and our corporate masters.

[The Animator]

52. I have posted this once before... but not in the breaking news forum

The way I see it, as far as this electronic voting booth business is concerned, is that without an independent analysis of the software, the American people as a whole will never know if it is being fairly represented.

I believe, that until the government allows independent software inspectors complete and unfettered access to the voting machine software that all members of the Democratic Party should refuse to pay their Federal Income taxes. Until it can be independently proven otherwise, "taxation without representation" is a legitimate complaint. It is not Diebold's place to assure us that we will be fairly represented in our elections; it is our responsibility to see to that ourselves.

If these voting machines are purchased by our State governments, then they are paid for by our tax dollars. At the point of purchase these computers, and their software cease to be the property of Dieblod (etc.) and become government property. Since it is then government property, and it is being integrated into the most fundamental level of our democracy, any US citizen should be allowed to inspect to software if he or she requests. The software should be public domain.

There should be random and frequent spot checks by independent software analysts before, during and after the elections. Anyone with computer programming experience should be encouraged to walk into any voting location, pick any booth, and be allowed to examine the code, at any time.

These are not unreasonable requests, and if the powers that be deny us this, we can cut their legs out from under them. As it is, with the huge tax cuts Bush&Co have been doling out, it would seem the wealthy in this country expect the poor and middle class to pay for everything. The Democrats, Third Party, and Independents, are left to foot the bill, for a War we didn't want, to pay the salary of a President we didn't elect, and to support a government that doesn't represent us. If we even threaten to pull their funding, they will cave, what else could they possibly do? Ask the rich to pitch in?

The only way, I believe, to get the Republicans to pay attention to us, is to hit them where it hurts... their wallets. Greed is their fundamental motivation, so I suggest we stand between them and our money.

Viva La Resistance

Sincerely

Charles D. Fernandez II