New law could hand out life sentences for Iraq deserters

[One Honest Guy]

http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/politics/article548953...

By Colin Brown, Deputy Political Editor
Published: 20 May 2006

Soldiers who refuse to serve in Iraq could face life imprisonment under controversial plans to reform the existing system of courts martial.

Campaigners for justice in the armed forces claimed yesterday that the Government was clamping down on dissent because of the growing opposition to the war. Flight-Lieutenant Malcolm Kendall-Smith was jailed for eight months by a court martial for refusing to serve in Iraq, but campaigners said the Armed Forces Bill will open so-called "refuseniks" to a life sentence.

Section 8 of the Bill makes it clear that a soldier commits an offence if he deserts by going absent without leave permanently, or to avoid any particular service in the armed forces.

The punishment for some forms of desertion - such as going AWOL for a short time while not trying to avoid service - is currently limited to a maximum of two years' imprisonment. But the Bill specifically states that those going AWOL to avoid serving during a military occupation, as in Iraq, could be jailed for life.

[babylonsister]

1. That'll show 'em.

:eyes: So don't force them to go, or go back, fer cryin' out loud! :banghead:

[saigon68]

19. Don't JOIN IN THE FIRST PLACE

GEEZ

Anyone who joins up and doesn't want to kill Islamics or be forced to Kill Islamics is an idiot.

The first thing they will do is send you to

"KILL ISLAMICS"


QUESTION: "Hey sarge, how do we kill women and children" ?

ANSWER: "Aim a little Lower" !!

[crikkett]

22. 'What's an Islamic' sez the grammar police

Hadn't heard that used as a noun before, only as an adjective. Is the proper term Muslim?

[Delphinus]

2. Didn't they used to have a way out

by claiming to be a conscientious objector? Or perhaps as a Jehovah's Witness?

[rmgarrette64]

3. That is still available

However, you must make clear you are a CO when you sign up. The standards of proof you have to meet if you claim to be a CO while in the service - especially if you convert soon after receiving notice of deployment - is very, very high.

R. Garrett

[maryallen]

6. Unless you're Dubya, who ...

Goes AWOL in time of war, never reports back, and years later, is selected President of the USA after covering up the whole nasty episode (and getting Dan Rather fired, to boot).

This still makes me furious. How can this happen in this country?

[BikeWriter]

35. * "served" at Ellington Field here in Texas. The bastid...

passed out belly up in every country club in the area. I've talked to people who knew and detested him then.

[Journeyman]

4. And what do Historians tell us about our times? . . .

From Evan S. Connell's Points for a Compass Rose. . .

When asked to compare America with a previous nation
Arnold Toynbee replied that it corresponds to Rome
under Cicero during the final days of the Republic
because of the inconceivable power it employs
to the distress and suffering of so many people,
because of a Constitution which once was admirable
but is now invalid, because of disorder at home
and, above all else, because of violence.
Plague creeps down our doors;
a foul odor spreads. . . .


To Edward Gibbon I am indebted for pointing out
that the inhabitants of a declining empire
could be lured into military service only by dread
of punishment or hope of profit, however miserable.
Obvious parallels present themselves. . . .

[jdeetz1019]

5. That'll sure boost the recruitment numbers.

Unfortunately, most kids that age don't pay attention to this stuff.

[habitual]

8. i thought the same

and kids that age will start paying attention when people start going to jail for life for being scared to die to fill cheneys bank account.

[rodeodance]

7. so so mnay lives ruined- for oil? revenge? ... why. I do not know.

[MadMaddie]

9. Well if they think that reenlistment is low now....

they keep attacking the soldiers...if a soldier has served 2 or 3 tours and has been forced to stay in what the hell is he supposed to do?

This is bullshit!!!

[nealmhughes]

10. One big filmed orgy

in the barracks would get them all out safely -- so long as it got out in public... I know, I was in the Navy six years on a sub. There was a "gay scare" that started on the George Bancroft and hit another boomer or two. A couple of guys just decided, "sounds good to me" and got out and proud and loud really fast...the odd thing is that the ones who were relatively senior and would get an honorable discharge after 6 months (Convenience of the Navy was the term then) and probably a very good high paying tech job couldn't be queer enough! It was the lowest echelons who were considered only good for making wakeup calls and helping clean that were kicked out. I can't say that a single one of them were even gay -- it was run by NIS, the most backward conspiracy-theory driven bunch of funny dudes one ever saw in action. Short hair, black ties and shades and those hideous dark Plymouth sedans the Navy used to use in the early 80s. They could not have been more funny than the Man with One Red Shoe! Of course they screwed up some poor young guys lives.

[Vidar]

11. Make it retroactive for AWOL in chief & we'll consider it.

[dbt]

18. AWOL > 30 days = DESERTER = bu$h. n/t

[Scoody Boo]

12. Desertion should never be an easy option, but...

a life sentence? That is way too harsh.

[eppur_se_muova]

13. So now their only option is to change sides ?

"May as well be hanged for a whole flock of sheep, as for a single lamb."

[TechBear_Seattle]

14. This will bring in the voluntary recruits!

Do you feel a draft? Better start planning now...

http://www.serv.net/~techbear/writings/FAQ-CO.html

[IChing]

15. I thought the article was talking about Iraqi soldiers not ours

I really did think it was an Iraqi Government directive.

It brings a whole new meaning to the terms of
"lifer",
"volunteer"
and 'conscription"
doesn't it?

[ridgerunner]

17. Actually

it's about British soldiers

[truthisfreedom]

28. i think a lot of people aren't reading it (bad link). UK soldiers, not US

or Iraqi!

[ridgerunner]

34. yeah, I know

kinda sad in a way ain't it. Glad I wasted my youth watching Brady Bunch reruns, "when you assume you make ass out of you and me"--Mike Brady

[cyr330]

16. Is that so?

That really makes a lot of sense. When are we going to give life sentences to those who lied us into this fiasco in the first place?

[bemildred]

20. It will take more than these futile threats to stanch the flow. nt

[alphafemale]

21. UK article. Is that a British law?

Very harsh in any case.

But remember, the penalty for desertion used to be death.

[noamnety]

26. Yes, British Laws being discussed

pertaining to British soldiers.

"The UK Government, worried that the number of soldiers absconding from the Army has trebled since the invasion of Iraq, is legislating to repress this movement in the military."

[alphafemale]

30. Are you 3rd ID?

Noticed the avatar.

[noamnety]

31. HAHAHA no

It's the pattern of a tie that some DUers (not me) sent to Keith Olbermann. The whole planning of the gift was so epic, I felt it needed to be memorialized. Somehow I remember 30-40 threads of heart-felt debate over patterns, each with hundreds of posts, running for weeks on end.

[crikkett]

23. Boo, this link doesn't work for me!

Anyone have a proper link?
Thanks

[mom cat]

24. Imprison AWOL Bush FIRST!

[Tempest]

25. They would be political prisoners

It's hard to believe just how far this country has sunk.

We're no better than the rouge nations we complained about in the past.

[noel adamson]

27. Then they will have to re institute the draft and make exceptions for...

...Commander in Chief's who desert their posts to pillage and plunder leaving us undefended against guys with box cutters... and, considering this one's desertion of his National Guard duty, a second offense at that.

The UCMJ (Universal Code of Military Justice) is already a brutal pre-constitution dinosaur which denies many of the rights to service members that the rest of us have under the U.S. constitution for which they are fighting and dying.

[One Honest Guy]

29. Copy-Pasting the link directly into your browser is the solution

for the people who get errors.

http://news.independent.co.uk/uk/politics/article548953.ece

[truthisfreedom]

32. PEOPLE: this is about BRITISH soldiers, not US.

[Seattleman]

33. support the troops

These NEOCON bastards are always looking for new ways to trick people into fighting for their agenda, and now it seems they are going to bring out the thumbscrews for anyone who is fed up with the lies and their imperialist actions.