NYT: Michael Dell Should Eat His Words, Apple Chief Suggests

[DeepModem Mom]

Michael Dell Should Eat His Words, Apple Chief Suggests
By JOHN MARKOFF
Published: January 16, 2006


SAN FRANCISCO, Jan. 15 - It may not be the last laugh, but on Friday afternoon, after the close of the stock market, Steven P. Jobs, the chief executive of Apple Computer, shared an e-mail chuckle with his employees at the expense of Dell, a big rival.

The message was prompted by the 12 percent surge in Apple's stock price last week, which pushed the company's market capitalization to $72.13 billion, passing Dell's value of $71.97 billion.

In 1997, shortly after Mr. Jobs returned to Apple, the company he helped start in 1976, Dell's founder and chairman, Michael S. Dell, was asked at a technology conference what might be done to fix Apple, then deeply troubled financially.

"What would I do?" Mr. Dell said to an audience of several thousand information technology managers. "I'd shut it down and give the money back to the shareholders."

On Friday, apparently savoring the moment, Mr. Jobs sent a brief e-mail message to Apple employees, which read: "Team, it turned out that Michael Dell wasn't perfect at predicting the future. Based on today's stock market close, Apple is worth more than Dell. Stocks go up and down, and things may be different tomorrow, but I thought it was worth a moment of reflection today. Steve."...


http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/16/technology/16apple.html?oref=login

[ixion]

1. woohoo!! way to go Apple!

I've been a Steve Jobs fan since way back when.

[The Backlash Cometh]

2. Congratulations Steve Jobs.

I hope he leans left.

[DeepModem Mom]

3. I think its Dell who leans right -- or, at least, supports W bigtime. nt

[The Backlash Cometh]

6. Dell is a given. His stock went up when the Bushes got into office.

I think he got the state contracts in Florida to put his computers in the schools.

[megatherium]

9. Dell's personal wealth is $14 billion. Jobs' is $4 billion I think. nt

[Voltaire99]

76. Dell gave money to Santorum, Delay, Hastert and Bush...

...among other right-wing scum. See here:

http://www.newsmeat.com/billionaire_political_donations/Michael_Dell.php

When you buy a Dell computer, you're buying Bushism. It's simple: don't. Apple makes much better technology, anyway.

[Cha]

82. I got my Dell before I knew that in

2002 so I'm stuck with it until I buy again somewhere down the line..next time I want an Apple!

[Tesha]

4. He does (lean left)! (NT)

[onehandle]

12. Jobs is a Democrat. Apple is 99% Blue.

Bill Clinton has slept at Job's home.

[Upfront]

56. Apple

Will be my next computer.

[HarukaTheTrophyWife]

78. I believe Apple only gives it's political contributions to Democrats

nt

[AlecBGreen]

5. this rise is on the back of iPods

the most expensive POS Ive ever owned :argh: DONT BUY ONE, they are trash. Mine died after less than a years use. Since I live in China, cant use the warranty.

:grr: :grr: :grr:

[megatherium]

8. My iPod died after a few months. I used the warranty.

Now that one doesn't work. I still have warranty protection, I'll do it again.

But my iBook is a year old, no problem at all. It's a nice little notebook computer. I suspect we are both unlucky with iPods, most people don't have problems with them (until the battery dies).

[kma3346]

60. Just take it in to an Apple store

They will fix it or replace it for you. I just did this and they replaced it with no problem.

[megatherium]

63. No Apple stores in these parts (Louisville, KY area).

Nearest one is in Indy.

[NYC Liberal]

66. Call Apple and they will send you a box and you'll have a new one

within a few days.

1-800-APL-CARE

[megatherium]

68. Last time I just went to the internet and got my box. Thanks. nt

[henslee]

14. why cant you send it to a friend who cansend it in to apple?

[PatGund]

16. I've had two iPods....

And both of them have been absolute little champs.

Then again, I've very rarely ever had *any* problems with anything I've bought from Apple.

[kma3346]

61. Me too

I bought an iPod when they first came out and it's still going strong. I know MANY others who have iPods and are very happy with them.

[Jane Austin]

69. Same here.

I love my iPod.

Had to send it in once and it was back so fast I couldn't believe it.

I'm very hard on laptops, but I adore my "Chicklet" iBook. :)

[Bozita]

19. Grimmy like his i-Pod (today's toon)

[AspenRose]

33. So does Deserted Rose!

And she loves her PowerBook too! And Apple customer service is top notch. :-)

[Javaman]

20. G5, 2 iPods, 1 Shuffle and a Nano, All work fantastic!!!

Never ever a problem and I work all of them to death.
I used the iPods for information transporting, the shuffle while I run and the nano as our music system in our house. No fuss, no muss.

[ninkasi]

37. How do you like the G5?

I use an older IMac running OSX Panther, which is the limit I could upgrade to...it came with OS 9. I mainly hang out here, and surf a bit, but love Mac.

[Javaman]

47. It's been great. No troubles at all.

I use it for 3D graphics, Photoshop and video editing. Not a single hitch. It has been the best purchase I have made since my last Mac. LOL

cheers.

[Massacure]

58. Macs are nice for graphics editing.

But I use Windows because it pretty much has a monopoly on the videogames. Gotta love us 17 year olds, blowing each other's heads off on cyberspace. :hi:

[Tesha]

22. Millions disagree with you. (NT)

[joefree1]

25. 60 gig Ipod working great as well as G4 laptop, Mini Mac, ...

And I love my 23 inch high def cinema screen. I work in the entertainment industry and we artistic folk are very amused by all our techie friends returning to MAC machines since the birth of MAC OS 10 and it's Unix inner workings.

He who laughs last laughs best.



made on a Mac

[wicket]

28. Never had a problem with my iPod

:shrug:

[TommyO]

36. Sorry to hear about that

but as with any product, there are going to be ones that fail early, and ones that seem to last forever. My iPod itself has been flawless, however syncing with my Windows machine is ocassionally problematic (hence my upcoming switch to a shiny new PowerMac on Friday).

[Placebo]

43. I've owned 6 iPods and they all performed flawlessly.

Sorry for your bad experience, but millions of iPod owners can't be wrong. :)

[architect359]

84. On the other hand, mine has been working excellently...

Not to knock your experience with your iPod, but I'm still using my 1st gen 5 gig iPod since I bought it at the end of 2001. I did have to finally change the batteries last year but otherwise it hasn't failed me yet ...yet. Which is not to say that I haven't been drooling over the new machines! Can't justify that splurge while my current player is still working tho.

[acmejack]

7. As an ex Dell person I can make a suggestion as to what michael can eat...

And it damn sure ain't words!

[Red_Viking]

15. I'm ex-Dell, too!

And Michael can suck it as far as I'm concerned. What a shitty place to work, especially if you're a woman.

I fled from a high-paying job to return to grad school and maybe do something useful with my life, after suffering at the hands of (male) managers without a clue how to run a department. I'm in another state now, but just heard that one of my former bosses, who got fired or left or something, accidentally killed someone last week. Karma is a bitch.

Viva Apple! I'm happily using my PowerBook right now, and intend to never own another PC. Got a Nano for Christmas and I love it.

Peace,

RV

[Pavulon]

10. Apple is

kept alive by Ipod and niche computers. Not that this is bad. But they have no real presence with a real server line or enterprise software to go along with the xserv.

I wish them luck though. Good company.

[PatGund]

18. Oh.......

Medical School I work for here in Qatar. 75% of our servers are either XServes or G5 minitowers, all running OS X Server. The remaining 25% are either Solaris or AIX, no Windows servers at all.

And we strongly rely on those servers, because a lot of our courses are distance taught from our main campus in New York. We have to have things as bulletproof as possible, and OS X server has been exactly that.

[WhereIsMyFreedom]

42. You may think your OS X Servers work great

and they may for the services you provide, but OS X isn't really designed to be a server. Its performance collapses under even a moderate server load. That's why they don't command much of the server market--they shine as workstations not as servers.

Check out
http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2436
and for a followup
http://www.anandtech.com/mac/showdoc.aspx?i=2520

[PatGund]

79. Really now??

That's really funny, since our G5 Servers usually match their counterparts running other flavours of *nix.

We even tested two G5's, identical hardware configuations, one running OS X Server 10.4, and one running Yellow Dog Linux. We didn't see much if any difference in performance.

*Shrug* Would be curious to repeat that running SUSE Linux for PowerPC and see if it's a difference in the distro.

And we run VERY heavy server loads on occasion, especially when it comes to the distance learning apps.

[MadHound]

39. Yeah, niche computers doing things that aren't even possible

On a Wintel box. All that CGI you see in theatres now, vast of it is created on Apple computers because of the sheer speed and power that is in a Mac, not to mention all of the cool, Mac only, software that is designed for graphics users. Niche markets like the ever growing share of laptop and desktop units. And oh yeah, Mac makes servers running on OSX server software, and they, like other Mac producsts are rock solid, and aren't prone to viri, glitches and downtime like the Wintel shit is.

And the Mac products last forever. Every single Mac I have, back to my Mac II, is still functioning. Can't say that about other computers, including Dells.

[Pavulon]

48. They make nice stuff

no doubt. I use autocad for my job and it runs on dual core dual proc intel machines. I have tried some of their drafting tools and they are quite good. However that is a niche.

W2k3 and Linux are fine os that run on reasonable hardware. OS10 is bsd with a pretty face.

Ever seen a blade server running os10.x? AIX, HPUX, W2k3 yep, mac no.

High density grids and mass storage are where the industry is going but there is no MAC there to take part in it. Machines are replaceable units like raid drives. Their low cost is what drives them.

SAP does not run on macs. No enterprise software runs on mac.

I have an old 8088 box that still runs. Not worth to much other than fond memories.

[MadHound]

80. LOL, you obviously haven't checked out Mac servers in awhile

Being UNIX based, Mac servers run all software, including SAP and enterprise software. As far as blade servers, high density grids, mass storage, I think you should again, do some research before you speak. Check out the Apple website, I think that you will find that what you are saying is false. And in the ultimate irony, with one piece of software, you can run ANY Windows program on a Mac desktop unit. Sad to say, you can't do the same with Wintel boxes.

And autocad was originally developed on Macs, long ago, and Macs are still used to run it in many of the bigger shops. Something about those higher quality graphics and quicker rendering times that a Mac gives you.

And who was it who had the first dual processor desktop box? Oh, yeah, Apple, in fact I think that was the same computer who had export restrictions put on it because it was the first desktop box to be declared, officially, a supercomputer.

But hey, if you want to stick with your Wintel box, you're welcome to it, and all of the viri, freezes, glitches, backdoors, spyware, patches, and other fun problems that are associated with Wintel systems. Meanwhile, I and many, many others will continue on, trouble free, with our Macs.

[onehandle]

11. Dell has been copying Apple's success religiously since he said that.

Many innovations that shows up on Macs, show up in some form at Dell in a lesser way, at a later date.

Sadly, Microsoft can't copy the rock solid Mac OS. Got Viruses? Not me.

[QC]

30. "Got Viruses? Not me."

Mac users 'too smug' over security

Although the risk of a malicious Mac program spreading as quickly as any Windows one is very low, it should not be ruled out. After all, the very first internet worm, back in 1988, affected Unix systems with a security model very similar to Mac OS.

The Mac ships with a good firewall, and it should be used. There are tools to scan your system for known malicious programs or to check whether it has been hacked into, and they should be used too.

Mac users demonstrate an indefensible smugness when it comes to the dangers of having their systems compromised by malicious software and opened up to exploitation by others. It's time they started behaving a bit more responsibly.

[onehandle]

31. A "what if" article? So what?

We're smug because we're well taken care of.

I love it when Windows users shout, "It's coming! You'll get yours!".

I'm sure there will be much celebration when it does.

In the mean time, I haven't had to worry about viruses and spyware for over twenty years.

[QC]

41. Why so defensive?

Relax. I mean, it's not like a tech commentator for the BBC can be expected to know anything about this subject, right? He must surely be full of shit, right?

[alfredo]

49. Oh sure, we all must not become complacent, but out of the box

the Mac firewall is on, and you are not given admin privileges unless you ask for it. Even then it is for that particular action. Chances are, if you do get infected, it will be most likely confined to your user account. That's the unix way as I remember. You can easily fix the situation by logging in your admin account, remove the user account, and then make a new one. You can then rebuild from your back up.

[onehandle]

50. I didn't say he was wrong.

But you are crowing over something that hasn't happened.

I'm pretty proud of my choice of a platform that has been clearly superior for over twenty years.

[QC]

70. Not crowing at all here, just amused by the smug cultishness

of the Mac set, especially by how excited they are over the Intel move, after having spent more than a decade insisting that Intel chips are shit and PowerPC chips the bomb. Not even a precision drill team could perform such a perfect vote-face as that one!

[onehandle]

75. Intel Chips were shit next to PowerPC chips.

They got better while IBM fell behind.

Mac users want what's best for the platform at the time. After all, 680xx chips were dumped for PowerPC.

I can see how it can be amusing, though. I'll give you that. I remember the PowerPC "toasts Intel" commercials.

[OnyxCollie]

13. I love my Apple G5.

I've had five Apple computers over the past twelve years. Except for a bad hard drive on an iMac, no problems whatsoever. Got an iPod, too. Still running on the same battery after nearly two years. As long as Apple continues to make computers and multimedia players, I will own one. No intention to start a Mac/PC flame war, but I've always considered PC's to be the tool of the Great Satan. Completely void of any design charm, using non-intuitive, poorly written software (Those aren't bugs. Those are features!), it just seems like that would be the kind of crap republicans would force upon us.

[wheresthemind]

17. Wooo!

If you have not made the switch yet, nows the time folks!

[Auntie Bush]

23. Damn...I just bought a new Dell laptop just before Xmas and it has

crashed 2 times already. I was fooling around with a lot of pictures so trying to learn how to do something...so it was probably my own fault.
But I wonder if that would have happened if I had an Apple.

[Tesha]

38. It probably *WASN'T* your fault.

> I was fooling around with a lot of pictures so trying to learn how to
> do something...so it was probably my own fault.

It probably *WASN'T* your fault, but Microsoft absolutely
*DEPENDS* upon you assuming it was.

Here's some news they don't want you to know:

*ANY TIME* a computer program crashes or hangs (not when it
gives you an error message but when it goes totally toes up
and dies), it is either due to a hardware error in your
computer (not likely) or (far more likely) a programming error
by the software engineer(s) who wrote it or the operating
system upon which it is running. That latter situation of a
programming error is *FAR, FAR, MORE PROBABLE* than a computer
hardware error.

If a program and operating system were both correctly coded
(programmed), you simply couldn't crash it no matter what
mistakes you made.

One crucial difference in the "Mac experience" is that programs
crash/hang far less frequently than in Windows systems. But that
isn't enough to convince people who are willing to place the
blame upon themselves, as you did.

Tesha

[A Brand New World]

21. My son works for Apple in Cupertino and he LOVES the company!

I doubt that he will ever work anyplace else. He's 24 so I hope he's set for life. He's a Mac guy through & through.

[gunsaximbo]

24. Dell PC's are sh_t

I've gone through 6 hard drives in 6 years and two key boards. You can't over clock the Intel processors with a dell.

I'll never own another.

Oh yeah - Dell is RED!

[AX10]

26. Dell is SHUknow the rest.

Both Mikey and his computers.

Besides, Apple is Blue and Dell is Red.

[Angry Girl]

27. Long-time Dell customers buy Mac instead

We are very excited! It should be here this week too! Not the top of the line by any means, but it's not a Dell!

And Mr. Gates and Mr. Norton, you can go screw yourselves too because next month I'm putting Debian Linux on our Internet boxes!

[wicket]

29. Awesome!!!

My mom just made the switch to Macs and she is so happy with hers! :D

[Angry Girl]

32. Apple upgraded our order for FREE (lucky timing)

We ordered right when the new Core Duos were going to start shipping. A couple of days after we placed the order, Apple offered us a FREE upgrade to the Core Duo, including bumping up the memory from 1.5GB to 2 GB! Wow! They certainly didn't have to do that. We were stunned and amazed!

Long Live Apple!

[wicket]

34. wow!!!

That's super cool! OMG, that computer is going to scream! :D

[onehandle]

52. That often happens when new models come out.

I've heard similar stories many times. That's Apple for you.

[martymar64]

35. As a current G4 eMac owner and former Apple employee . . .

I say SUCK IT MICHAEL DELL!
No, really . . . SUCK IT MICHAEL DELL!!!

Here in Austin, I've known several people that work for Apple that used to work for Dell and not one of them had anything good to say about Dell. Apple treats their employees like gold, their training is top-notch and they give away alot of their cool stuff to outstanding employees every quarter, employees voted on by their co-workers.
I've owned Windows machines and they used to crash with amazing regularity, not to mention spyware and viruses out the wazoo. Never again.

I give up my Mac when they pry it from my cold dead hands.

[LeftHander]

40. Got 6 macs...

Perfoma 66Mhz (more a of a curiosity now)
iMac Blueberry 350 Mhz (Mp3 Juke Box)
PowerBook Ti 400Mhz (my notebook)
iBook 500Mhz White Dual USB (daughters notebook)
Powemac 64 MDD FW800 Dual 1.0 (in recording studio)
iMac G5 (wife's design machine)

With OSX I'll not consider a windows machine ever again.


(no iPods....yet)

[WhereIsMyFreedom]

44. Living Contradiction

I love Apple, hate Dell.
I love my Lenovo Thinkpad, hate my Apple iBook.
I love my iPod, hate iTunes.
And most of all, I love the cognitive dissonance in all the smug Mac users caused by Apple's move to the Intel platform.

[onehandle]

51. They moved from an IBM chip to an Intel chip.

This only happened because IBM dropped the ball.

I don't buy Macs for a chip, I buy them for the Operating System, Superior Components, and Style.

Cognitive dissonance? That was then and this is now.

[WhereIsMyFreedom]

74. But the IBM chips were sooo superior to the Intel chips

According to the Mac people I talked to (and Apple's website, for that matter). Those Macs just blew Intel's chips out of the water, ran circles around them, and now they are moving to those very same chips and all of a sudden they are better than the IBM chips. :eyes: Personally, I think that it's a great move for everyone and I look forward to owning a dual boot OS X/Windows machine.

And it wasn't a dis directed towards all Mac users, only the snobbish ones, which it sounds like you aren't. :hi:

[Placebo]

45. Way to go Apple!

Proud Mac user here. :)

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

46. Dem geek makes Repub geek look like an ass.

How geekily delicious.

[DrZeeLit]

53. I love my Mac!

I've never owned any other "brand" of computer.
I've had to work on some others and use Microsoft on these-- and when I did -- oy, was that stressful.
I've never had:
a crash/loss of info
a virus
a problem that required erasing and rebooting the system
a problem that required a technician
a problem that required service

A friend, who was a computer programmer/whiz up in Silicon Valley during the hey day, would only use Macs at home. He said that Microsoft and its tie-up of the market was a "plot." I think we've all seen that by now.

Since I'm an educator, I've grown with Apple through many models. I'm on my third laptop. And last year I sprung for the G5 with bells and whistles. People say, "yeah, but you don't have software." Well, I have what I need and more. The graphics are terrific. The ease is amazing. The innovations are within my grasp (without a degree in some computer language).

Now I have 3 different iPods and LOVE them, too.

And yes, about 3 years ago we finally bought Apple stock.

So... Hoorah for Steve and the gang. Many happy returns!

[Solon]

54. I fucking hate Dells, and Gateways, pretty much any "prebuilt" computer...

company. The only exception might be Alienware, but I don't know much about them. All I know is this, on my Sister's Dell we tried to put the old CPU onto another Motherboard, one with an AGP slot, couldn't do it without damaging the computer, making it almost inoperable. The situation is this, the CPU (Intel Celeron 1.8 GHz) had a huge assed heat sink that was GLUED onto the processor. This made it almost impossible to remove the processor, the socket it was in had a lever off to the side that you need to pull up to unlock the CPU from it, the heat sink was larger than the processor and was not attached to the motherboard at all. No screws or anything, just the glue, attached straight to the CPU. They had one of their "computer expert" friends work on it, he pulled the CPU out by force, bending many of it's pins. It took me about 2 weeks, but I straightened out the pins, and was able to reattach it to the old board. Now I'm kinda leery about plugging it back in, I don't know if the socket itself is damaged, plus, the heatsink is not attached right now. The messed up part is that there are four holes in the Motherboard that are SUPPOSED to be used to attach the heatsink to, you can see them, loud and clear off the corners of the CPU socket. Right now, I'm thinking of drilling holes in the current heatsink to correspond with the holes, and screwing it in with spacers. It actually wouldn't be that hard, it is only aluminum, so easy enough for most drill bits to drill into.

OK, that was the problem with the Dell, now onto the old Gateway my Grandma has. My uncle bought her a CD burner so she can backup her data onto it. So she calls me up and asks me to install it, should be simple, right? Wrong, first, I had to rearrange the interior of her computer, she only had 4 total bays, two small ones, for hard drive and floppy, and two big, one for the DVD-ROM and the other for the Zip drive. I got rid of the zip and put the CD-R into that bay. Problem is, it wouldn't fit, the tower case wasn't deep enough at the top, and the drive stuck out half an inch or so from the front, and the back was flush against the edge of the damned motherboard. I was able to get it working, but it doesn't look pretty. Not to mention that her hard drive was screwed in wrong, note that no one else ever opened this computer. It was installed on its side, in a rack that was for more than one hard drive to begin with, so I moved it to the orizontal position, and made it look cleaner in the computer and freed up the second small bay in the process, the rack extended below it, of course.

This is why I build my own, not only am I a geek, I admit it, proudly, but also, I don't have to deal with subpar equipment nor shoddy workmanship. I told both my sister and my grandma, for the next computer, I'll build it for free, they will just have to pay for the parts. I'm just glad that I don't have to open my Mom's computer up yet(another fucking Dell), I told her the same thing, BTW.

ON EDIT: In case you are curious, my computer is an AMD AthalonXP 1.25Ghz that outperforms the Celeron mentioned above, for some reason, I don't know why. I built the computer myself(of course) and I don't have windows on it either, Ubuntu Linux for me. :)

[htuttle]

57. Hey, I recognize your type...

[Solon]

64. Except for not having a scruffy beard, plus being 27, plus only being...

a Linux user for about 2 years, I would say, no, that isn't me. :)

I just slam bad products, I don't slam the people who buy them, I know more cause I wanted to, one of my jobs is to make sure my relatives are properly informed.

ON EDIT: Cleaned up the language a little bit. :)

[Massacure]

59. Dells aren't what they used to be.

That is why I built my own PC using parts ordered from Newegg.com.

[Occulus]

62. I've been doing that for a long long time

Amazingly, along with a router and AdAware/Spybot, virus scanner, and good surfing/emailing rules... I don't have a real problem with viruses or spy/adware.

Crashes are another issue.

[Massacure]

67. Windows XP is nice in when a program crashes, the OS doesn't go with it.

This wasn't true in older versions.

[Solon]

65. I never bought a pre-built computer...

The only exceptions were the Apple IIc and the IBM 8086 my dad bought new. The Apple was mine, too bad if was fried. The 8086 is still in the basement, in storage, nice and dry, probably still works too, monitor and all, but haven't fired it up in a long time, has a total of 2 MB of memory, one of those "expansions" that plugged into the ISA on the Mobo.

The first computer I built was an Intel 386 40 Mhz, I was about 12 I guess, maybe a little younger, had Windows 3.1 and AOL 3.0 on it. I was online pretty early on with that thing. Not to mention the BBSes from the earlier computers.

[DainBramaged]

85. Just remember, we're in the age of appliances now

$299 (complete) tops ego everyday in the real world.

[Solon]

87. You know how much my computer cost, new?

I spent about 250, give or take a few. I recycled the ATX case, monitor, and my floppy drive from an older AMD 500Mhz before. Actually, the 1.44 floppy drive I have now is from an old 386 that my dad had from 1992. The thing still works, though I'm thinking of getting rid of it for the next upgrade, makes less sense now in the age of bootable CDs and DVDs. Also, another suggestion that I admit sounds a little shady, but if you want a perfectly good monitor or printer, look in garbage bins of offices, specially of companies that are office suppliers themselves. They write off alot of stuff when upgrading computers for tax purposes, they will trash other computers, I had a friend that cleaned said offices, and she used to come home with inkjet printers that still worked, and I had like 6 monitors that I sold on the streets for 30 bucks, 19" in up. Hell, she one time came home with a full fledged computer, granted it was a Pentium 3, but it still worked, oddly enough. I couldn't believe the type of stuff these companies would throw away, why they don't donate this stuff to schools or youth centers is beyond me.

[DainBramaged]

89. They won't donate it because of liability and "gimme" calls

"gimme the software, gimme the box, gimme everything you have, gimme someone's time to gimme your old computer".

If said computer burns out the power supply and burns down "gimmie's" house, who gets sued?

[Solon]

90. If said computer burns down a house, there were already serious problems..

With it! I blew power supplies before, nice fireworks, and loud popping from the capacitors blowing, but no fire, a little stink and smoke though, ahh, the burning smell of electronics in the morning! :)

Besides which, they could donate said things to charities that can test them to verify they are at least safe, electrically. Also, usually donations from companies to charities include "no liability" clauses, in addition to no warranties, obviously.

Part of my problem with this is that not only would these be good donations, and tax writeoffs themselves, but can help the enviroment as well. I'm of the school that says you should work things to death, so to speak, so if someone doesn't want something, ANYTHING anymore, especially if its electronic, hell, I'll take it. I've restored old VCRs, Portable CD players, and many other items of electronic nature(ahh, the glories of being a trashman in rich neighborhoods:)), and I made nice money on the side doing that stuff. Hell, one time I fixed a portable CD player in about five minutes, less probably. Someone through away a brand new CD player because it couldn't play more than one track. I took it apart, and the screw that moves the laser reader had a hair in it, a pair of tweezers took care of that, that was about 6 years ago, and I still have that CD player, and it still works perfectly.

[fujiyama]

92. Unfortunately

Alienware is red. They look nice but seem overpriced.

I'll stick to building my own as well. I did that with the computer I'm using now and it's been working fine for some three years. Unfortunately I haven't been able to make the switch to Linux, though I'd love to. If I get myself more hd space, I'll run a dual boot.

[Solon]

94. Yep, sticking with that now...

The only deal you get from pre-built computers, that I can see, are the monitors. Then again, you can spend as much for those computers on a new monitor at 21+ inches, and that's a flatscreen. Though I don't use those, unless its plasma, LCDs simply don't have the color accuracy of old fashioned CRTs. Overpriced pieces of crap is what they are. I will tell you something about Linux though that makes it really shine, at least to me. My sister's fiancee got an old Compaq Pesario from his dad, it had Windows ME on it, barely ran(800MHz), and loaded with viruses and shit. Anyways, he got a brand spanking new 200GB hard drive from the friend that broke the Dell, but no computer to put it in. So, I told him I'll set up a small Windows file server on this computer, using the 200GB so he can keep track of his Ipod collection. Problem was two fold, one, there were no unused Windows XP disks anywhere.

So what I did was rip the old 10GB hard drive out of the Pesario, put in the 200GB one, with my old 20 Gig one in for good measure, I then installed Linux on it and setup a Samba file server. It was surprisingly easy, the default set up ALMOST worked, just had to set up a server user name and password. Now they have a monitorless computer for storage purposes only. The great thing about it is that I set it up with Remote Desktop so that I can use vncviewer on it, troubleshooting and maintaining it remotely, from anywhere in the world.

[MagickMuffin]

55. An Apple a Day, keeps the Viruses Away ;-)

I've been a Apple users since '93, although they were clones. Still have them by the way, but they are not being used.

I own a G-4 laptop Xmas 03, and we have a G-4 tower '04, and a i-mac Xmas '00. All of them have never had a problem, except for a bad drive in the i-mac, and I got a shuffle for my birthday back in Sept. '05.

I use my laptop for video production, graphics, music, and just the general daily routine of surfing the web.

I Love my Apples!!!! :think: Different

We also own a Sony Viao laptop, and have nothing but trouble from it. Need it for work related projects, or we wouldn't have wasted our money....:argh:

[MetaTrope]

72. Except for the ongoing series of Quicktime security flaws

http://blogs.washingtonpost.com/securityfix/2006/01/apple_fixes_qui.html

And the patches which break the OS in turn:
http://www.informationweek.com/news/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=177100379

[MagickMuffin]

73. I haven't upgraded to the newest QT,

because of this concern. Apple is working on correcting this problem.

And again I have been virus free well since I have been working on computers.

I had to work on window machines at my last job, and it was a nightmare.:evilgrin:

[lovuian]

71. LOL!!! Is this an omen that the tide is turning...

Dell outsources and Apple has stuck with America...

[NNguyenMD]

77. Apple has the right business model and its quality

when you buy an Apple, you know you're getting quality goods, when you buy a Dell, like I have, you're getting somethign thats inexpensive, unreliable and cheap. Its the difference between shopping at Walmart and shopping at Macy's, nay! Shoping at Walmart and shopping at SAks Fifth Avenue. I think Jobs has the right idea at making buyers pay a premium for the quality work of the Apple products, if you price products too cheap then people will formulate the idea that they're cheaply made goods. Anyway I'm hoping to spend my first pay check on a brand spanking new apple desktop.

[Cha]

81. Wow...I was just talking about

Steve Jobs yesterday to my friend on the way back from Saratoga..saying he was the head of Apple and he gave money to Dems and I had a Dell who gave money to repukes and if I had it to do over I would have gotten an Apple.

[Greyhound]

83. Dell has been living on its reputation for the last seven or

eight years. They are no longer better than anybody else, just a lot more expensive. Go Apple.

[DainBramaged]

86. But Intel gets the last laugh, new Mac's Intel powered

so Doris gets her oats.:applause:

[goforit]

88. An apple a day keeps the doctor away!!

Whooo Hooooo!!!!!

[niallmac]

91. Well deserved gloat.

Apple is far and away the superior OS. The PC DOS is the best marketed and that's all. I am a yellow dog democrat and a red apple fanatic.

[fujiyama]

93. Good for Apple

Fuck Dell. I hate that smug bastard and his shitty overrated computers.

That said, I'm a PC user through and through (I prefer building my own) and have no interest in changing. Windows XP isn't the greatest, but is a hell of a lot better than previous Windows versions and I haven't experienced any real problems with it. But once I get more hard drive space, I'll try Linux out again using dual boot (I actually installed Red Hat about 8 years ago but had to get rid of it cuz I didn't have the time to figure everything out).

Apple makes some nice looking products. My sister got an iPod recently. Beautiful screen. But I thought iTunes sucks.

[Irreverend IX]

95. Mac hardware only seems good...

If you're used to crap computers like Dell's.

Otherwise there is little true performance difference between the platforms, and because of Apple's rigidly controlled hardware standards some technological advances, like dual-channel RAM, are slower to appear on the Mac. I just built a computer for $800 that has better performance across the board than $1200 Apple offerings, and when running Linux all the software is free. Buying any sort of prebuilt computer, from Apple to Dell to Gateway, limits you to the manufacturer's often poor hardware choices. And because OSX and Windows require faster hardware with every upgrade, using them forced you to buy expensive new systems again and again.

If writing letters, surfing the Internet and posting to DU are all you do with your computer, there's no reason not to use Linux. Today's popular Linux versions are very easy to install and set up, and some even have live CDs that allow you to try Linux without installing it on your computer. Gaming, CAD and visual editing have fewer options in Linux but it is possible to get Windows apps working if you roll up your sleeves. It's also interesting to note that some movie studios have migrated their graphic editing systems to open source Linux machines. The Scooby Doo movies were edited on Linux machines using a free program called CinePaint. And Windows and OSX simply can't compare to Linux as a server operating system; they're just not written well enough to hold up under massive traffic loads.

And FWIW I am a photographer and have never seen any especial advantage to image editing on Macs outside of Expose which is occasionally a nice thing to have but not worth hundreds of dollars. Indeed, when working with large numbers of text files and images, I often find that the lack of a taskbar in OSX forces me to work half as fast as I could on a PC. Just the other day I was talking to a couple longtime professionals who were both carrying Windows laptops.