Bush illegally spied on Americans prior to 9-11

[Vyan]

Contrary to the Bush Administrations claims that they were granted the authority to conduct warrantless wiretaps of U.S. Citizens as a result of the 9-11 and the Authorization to Use Force in Afghanistan against al-Qaeda, Truthout.org reveals today that Bush performed domestic spying against U.S. Citizens long before September 11th, 2001.

The National Security Agency advised President Bush in early 2001 that it had been eavesdropping on Americans during the course of its work monitoring suspected terrorists and foreigners believed to have ties to terrorist groups, according to a declassified document.

The NSA's vast data-mining activities began shortly after Bush was sworn in as president and the document contradicts his assertion that the 9/11 attacks prompted him to take the unprecedented step of signing a secret executive order authorizing the NSA to monitor a select number of American citizens thought to have ties to terrorist groups.

In its "Transition 2001" report, the NSA said that the ever-changing world of global communication means that "American communication and targeted adversary communication will coexist."

"Make no mistake, NSA can and will perform its missions consistent with the Fourth Amendment and all applicable laws," the document says.

However, it adds that "senior leadership must understand that the NSA's mission will demand a 'powerful, permanent presence' on global telecommunications networks that host both 'protected' communications of Americans and the communications of adversaries the agency wants to target."

What had long been understood to be protocol in the event that the NSA spied on average Americans was that the agency would black out the identities of those individuals or immediately destroy the information.

But according to people who worked at the NSA as encryption specialists during this time, that's not what happened. On orders from Defense Department officials and President Bush, the agency kept a running list of the names of Americans in its system and made it readily available to a number of senior officials in the Bush administration, these sources said, which in essence meant the NSA was conducting a covert domestic surveillance operation in violation of the law.

http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/011306Z.shtml

Vyan - Truth 2 Power

[Blutodog]

1. This will never see the light of day

This might be true but the rt. wing noise machine will make sure it will never see the light of day.

[fooj]

3. Ye of little faith...

Welcome to DU!

Peace.

[Steve A Play]

8. I beg to differ

It just did! :) Now get out there and tell everyone you know. Write a letter to the editor of your local paper. Write your representatives and let them know that you know about it and ask them what they are going to do about it. Talk it up on every forum and blog you post to.

We are the media!

Steven P.

[Blutodog]

33. We aren't the media

Read Dauo's col. today in here. We are part of the leftwing blogosphere and that's as far as much of what we talk about ecver gets.

[Catchawave]

64. It gets on Olbermann :)

Tune in sometime, we know his staff lurks here frequently :hi:

[superconnected]

15. bet fox is desperately looking for a young blonde kidnap victim

in any country.

[BreakForNews]

30. Ummm, they got one already..... a redhead though, not blonde

'Black Ops' Implicated in Jill Carroll Kidnapping
http://wagnews.blogspot.com/2006/01/black-ops-implicated-in-jill-carroll.html


by Fintan Dunne, http://www.BreakForNews.com
12 January, 2006 14:00GMT

There are clear signs that the kidnapping of the still-missing American journalist, Jill Carroll was a political act closely tied to U.S. interests relating to the Sunni opposition in Iraq.

The 28-year-old freelancer for The Christian Science Monitor was ambushed by gunmen in Baghdad last Saturday morning. Her Iraqi interpreter, who carried press ID was killed during the incident. No group has claimed responsibility.

On the face of it just another of Iraq's many kidnappings. But when we examine the timing, location and events subsequent to the abduction, they point to collusion involving the U.S. --or worse still, an American-inspired 'Black Ops' gambit.....

...more
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=364&topic_id=133064&mesg_id=133064

[slestak]

29. If it does

they'll blame it on the Clenis.

[robbedvoter]

45. Except the article clearly states: W personally changed long standing

policies - that comes from Risen's book:

    James Risen, author of the book State of War and credited with first breaking the story about the NSA's domestic surveillance operations, said President Bush personally authorized a change in the agency's long-standing policies shortly after he was sworn in in 2001.

[ozymandius]

2. Anybody think that the Senate anthrax attacks were part of the program?

Just asking. I'm sure there were many documents just out in the open when the cleanup crews swept through.

[fooj]

4. When you consider the anthrax was sent to Dems and Media...

let's not forget the one sent to the journalist who wrote the NASTY LITTLE TRUTHS about Little Lord Pissypant's twins! Hmmmmmmm...

Peace.

[The Backlash Cometh]

69. How much you want to be that they KNOW who sent the anthrax.

But like everything else, it's now hush-hush because of national security.

You know, I see the misfortunes of the Taft family in Ohio, and I am hopeful that the Bush Dynasty will also learn that in America, there are no royal families.

[Papa]

99. OF COURSE they know who sent the Anthrax

They did it themselves.

Do you remember that it came out that Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, and all those guys were innoculated with CIPRO before the Anthrax attacks happened? How could these guys who have done everything wrong, be so impossibly impcompetent, be smart enough to take Cipro just before the attacks happen?

With everthing else that has happened and is happening now, there is enough to conclude in my book that they were responsible and could have stopped it. Look who got sent the Anthrax.

[spooked911]

111. yep

[Catamount]

16. YES..n/t

[Libby2]

44. Absolutely nt

[nicknameless]

51. You bet.

[spooked911]

110. No doubt. Anthrax was an extension of 9/11, and 9/11 was an inside job

[geomon666]

5. yeah....

And they still couldn't stop 9-11. I wonder if the administration gave this info to the 9-11 commission.

[cantstandbush]

22. Now this is a great point. Tell.

So what good was the surveillence? And what good was the Bush administration.

[Vyan]

23. That probably won't hunt...

all the NSA had prior to 9-11 was a list of name of U.S. citizens who had been captured in reference to possible terrorist suspects. The NSA deleted this information after 9-11 when Bush asked them to share it with the FBI -- it was after that point that Bush decided he had authority to override FISA via the AUMF and began signing the executive orders we've heard about recently.

Vyan

[hang a left]

49. But they were already sharing the information with members of the

adminstration. What did the people do with the shared information?


snip>
What had long been understood to be protocol in the event that the NSA spied on average Americans was that the agency would black out the identities of those individuals or immediately destroy the information.

But according to people who worked at the NSA as encryption specialists during this time, that's not what happened. On orders from Defense Department officials and President Bush, the agency kept a running list of the names of Americans in its system and made it readily available to a number of senior officials in the Bush administration, these sources said, which in essence meant the NSA was conducting a covert domestic surveillance operation in violation of the law.
snip>

[Jawja]

50. Yes, I thought

Little Lord Pissypants said his criminal spying was to "connect the dots." So if he was doing it BEFORE 9/11, why weren't the dots connected?

[ClintonTyree]

66. Yeah, that kinda' blows their assertion that IF they had spied before 9/11

that 9/11 might not have happened. :eyes: Fucking lying sacks of shit. I've really had it with this bunch of lying, cheating, thieving bastards......I don't know how much longer I can take this. :cry:

Will this ever hit the Corporate Media? Don't bet on it, and if it does I'm sure they'll say Clinton did the same thing. Sure, that would be another lie as well, but I see nothing that's going to stop them. Our Corporate owned Media just keeps parroting everything the bush administration tells them as if it were the truth si it isn't going to make any damned difference at all. Americans themselves are so damned lazy and complacent they won't bother trying to find out the truth.

This country is fucked, BIGTIME! :grr:

[janetle]

77. My thoughts exactly

[janetle]

78. Esp. when Cheney said they would have stopped the attacks if...

[Vyan]

6. More details...

Ok, so the point here is that the way the systems like Echelon are setup, they are always monitoring (as was alluded to by Russell Tice) but that information regarding persons within the U.S. is typically disgarded.or redacted.(As was the case with the NSA intercepts reviewed by John Bolton, until he requested and was granted access to the identities of U.S. citizens mentioned in the intercepts) Prior to 9-11 NSA did generally follow this procedure.

More from Truthout...

The NSA's domestic surveillance activities that began in early 2001 reached a boiling point shortly after 9/11, when senior administration officials and top intelligence officials asked the NSA to share that data with other intelligence officials who worked for the FBI and the CIA to hunt down terrorists that might be in the United States. However the NSA, on advice from its lawyers, destroyed the records, fearing the agency could be subjected to lawsuits by American citizens identified in the agency's raw intelligence reports.

Eavesdropping on Americans required intelligence officials to obtain a surveillance warrant from a special court and show probable cause that the person they wanted to monitor was communicating with suspected terrorists overseas. But Bush said that the process for obtaining such warrants under the 1978 Federal Intelligence Surveillance Act was, at times, "cumbersome."

In a December 22, letter to the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, Assistant Attorney General William E. Moschella wrote that the "President determined it was necessary following September 11 to create an early warning detection system. FISA could not have provided the speed and agility required for the early warning detection system."

However, what remains murky about that line of reasoning is that after 9/11, former Attorney General John Ashcroft undertook a full-fledged lobbying campaign to loosen the rules and the laws governing FISA to make it easier for the intelligence community to obtain warrants for wiretaps to spy on Americans who might have ties to terrorists. Since the legislative change, more than 4,000 surveillance warrants have been approved by the FISA court, leading many to wonder why Bush selectively chose to bypass the court for what he said were a select number of individuals.

In addition to this revelation it appears that President Clinton has completely debunked the allegation that he ordered domestic spying in violation of FISA during his 2 terms as Commander in Chief.

Former President Clinton said Thursday that he never ordered wiretaps of American citizens without obtaining a court order, as President Bush has acknowledged he has done.

Clinton, in an interview broadcast Thursday on the ABC News program ''Nightline,'' said his administration either received court approval before authorizing a wiretap or went to court within three days after to get permission, as required by law.

''We either went there and asked for the approval or, if there was an emergency and we had to do it beforehand, then we filed within three days afterward and gave them a chance to second guess it,'' Clinton told ABC. link

When it comes down to it, the core of this spying scandal is actually a difference in interpretation of NSA legal duty between attorneys and employees (like Tice) at NSA who themselves feel that FISA should prevail and the Bush Administration who contend that FISA is unneccesary under the Presidents Article II powers -- however the question I have is why not go the extra mile and get the FISA warrants simply to protect the government from liability and protect any possible criminal cases from "fruit of the poison tree" contamination?

This dispute is what makes the Alito Nomination critically important - as his own stated views (at least those that he would admit too) of the "Unitary Executive" would tend to trump the NSA, regardless of precedents such as Hamdi where the famous "President doesn't receive a blank check" quote comes from.

A blank check and a rubber stamp to violate the civil rights of American citizens is exactly what this potential Justice would give the President.

Vyan

[ClintonTyree]

83. It really doesn't matter what Clinton said........

because the Corporate Media has been repeating the lies pushed by he Republicans that "Clinton did it too". Once again the Corporate Media has aided and abetted the Republican propaganda machine telling everyone who turns on a TV or radio that "Clinton did it too". Of course that's a categorical lie but the propaganda has already been "catapulted", so it makes no difference now. :grr:

Would it be too much to ask for the media to do some FACT CHECKING before shooting their mouths off? :wtf:

[Igel]

7. Indeed, long before 9/11.

The report was written in 12/00, a month before * was sworn in.

Clinton said his administration didn't engage in warrantless wire-tapping; if the report says what you say it says, he's wrong. That's not to say he lied, of course: I'm one of those that believe 'lie' has 'knowingly intend to deceive' as part of its meaning.

It's possible that a vast data-mining operation began under *'s watch, but Able Danger--if real--was precisely such an operation and had reports in 9/00; the claim is that it was *shut down* under *'s watch. So the claim may become "he shut down one and started another", but it's hard to have that particular brush only paint him.

As for not making names of Americans available, that's been hashed out a few times in the MSM over the last couple of years as more and more examples of the names' being requested, and the requests' being approved, percolate up. It may be due for a rehashing.

[Vyan]

9. No, Clinton isn't wrong...

Bush received the report and took subsequent action to save the information that the NSA would normally have redacted or deleted involving U.S. citizens. Eventually the NSA did delete the data when Buah asked them to share it with the FBI after 9-11, because their attorneys were concerned about the liability. It was after that point that he started using the AUMF arguements to justify sharing the information with other domestic agencies.

Read my "More details.." post, or the full Truthout article for details.

Vyan

[Igel]

32. My point was that Clinton said he

didn't engage in warrantless wiretapping; the **OP** claims the report, dated 12/00, before * was sworn in and when Big Dog was still woofing, says they *had* already engaged in warrantless wiretapping. There's a timing problem in that assertion. Blacking out the names is besides the point, and much discussed in the MSM already; the warrantful or warrantless nature of the eavesdropping under Clinton is the point, and hasn't been much discussed.

On the other hand, I haven't actually read the report, beyond the first few lines (and the cover page), so it may be that it doesn't actually state they engaged in warrantless wiretapping. Even if they did, Clinton might simply not have known of it. Many hundreds of thousands of programs, even the most assiduous bureaucracy-watcher can't watch everything.

[Vyan]

101. The report doesn't...

allege illegal wiretaping taking place before 2001.

That is something that Truthout gleamed from other information. The report was the baseline - if you will, the article then goes on to show how that baseline was changed by Bush in 2001.

Vyan

[LiberalVoice]

10. Nominated for greatest Page!

[EFerrari]

11. Another B* Whopper. K&R

:kick:

[AverageJoe]

12. K & R

:kick:

[elehhhhna]

13. It was something-HOP for sure.

[Gregorian]

14. Thank you. My senator now knows this...

I think this is as big as they get. I had to call my senator and breakt his to him.

[Vyan]

18. I think a lot of Senators...

particularly those on the Judiciary Committee should be made aware of this.

Vyan

[PegDAC]

94. Unfortunately,

my Senator on the Judiciary Commitee is none other than Lindsay Graham.

:puke: :eyes: :thumbsdown: :cry:

[LeftHander]

17. Kick

[leveymg]

19. Not sure that an approach to telecoms regarding cooperation in

data-mining in early 2001 was actual unwarranted surveillance. Would like to see further proof that unwarranted wiretaps actually occurred pre-9/11.

The news that the NSA passed the names of US persons to other agencies is surprising, but if that data was redacted after 60 days, probably no laws were broken. What's really significant here is the item -- which has been reported before -- that Bolton retained intercepts and used them against his bureaucratic rivals, an apparent violation of law. A felony.

This is suggestive and interesting. K&R

[AzDar]

20. Un-effing-believable..and yet the planes STILL managed to hit

the towers.Hmmmmmm....

[leveymg]

26. That was a compartmentalized operation.

There was consensual monitoring and third-country surveillance. Able Danger linked the four primary hijackers. No record of FISA warrants ever sought from the FISC Court. Not surprising, as this was a CIA op that also involved DIA in domestic surveillance.

Lots on the record about "botched" FBI Carnivore intercepts of other al-Qaeda during 2000 and 2001. See, http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0310/S00257.htm

[AzDar]

21. Dupe.

[stepnw1f]

24. No More Excuses!!! IMPEACH HIM NOW!!!!

[wordpix]

56. RIGHT! how many more examples of executive abuse, scandal and corruption

do we need to impeach the Chimp and cronies??

[stepnw1f]

93. I'd Like to Know..

because since you responded to my post, till my reply, right now, I think another damning charge has come forward..

[NoAmericanTaliban]

25. Once you commit the first lie...the rest come easier...

* whole election was a lie to begin with. Reminds me of the Al Franken's book title
Lies & the lying liars that tell them

[Michigander4Dean]

27. SURPRISE!!

:sarcasm:

[0007]

28. Randi Rhodes is going off on this right now.

[Vyan]

62. Good...

I called her about it yesterday.

Vyan

[greiner3]

31. Hell, I can imagine that a secret part of the FIB;

Carried on secret spying during the Clinton years, without Bill knowing about it. Their goal was that they knew they'd be in power soon and wanted a leg up on who their enemies were.

[BattyDem]

34. So this proves two things ...

1) Bush is lying when he says that he has to spy on people without warrants because "9/11 changed everything" - things obviously changed BEFORE 9/11 ... at least for him. :eyes:

2) Bush is lying when he says that spying on people without warrants is necessary in order to prevent another 9/11 because it obviously didn't prevent the first one (unless he didn't want to prevent it - which is something else to consider).

[leQ]

55. and that he knew about 9/11 (eom)

[dutchdemocrat]

35. Parallel thread.

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=364x129973

The nation's electronic intelligence agency warned President Bush in 2001 that monitoring U.S. adversaries would require a "permanent presence" on networks that also carry Americans' messages that are protected from government eavesdropping.

"Make no mistake, NSA can and will perform its missions consistent with the Fourth Amendment and all applicable laws," the document says. But, it adds, senior leadership must understand that the NSA's mission will demand a "powerful, permanent presence" on global telecommunications networks that host both "'protected' communications of Americans" and the communications of adversaries the agency wants to target.

Click Here to see HTML document

http://www.thisiswiretap.com/2001 /

[dutchdemocrat]

36. Other key quotes

Other key quotes


...key quotes from the NSA document:



The Fourth Amendment is as applicable to eSIGINT as it is to the SIGINT of yesterday and today. (pg. 32)

Make no mistake, NSA can and will perform its missions consistent with the Fourth Amendment and all applicable laws. (pg. 32)

Mr. President, the NSA itself realized this.- why didn't you?????

http://www.thisiswiretap.com/2001/

[Phoebe Loosinhouse]

37. This nails it as far as I am concerned.

I've said it before, I'll say it again - we don't need one more fact to begin a totally righteous, judicious, legal, patriotic, bi-partisan IMPEACHMENT. NOW. RIGHT NOW!!!!

[AlCzervik]

38. but he didn't read the aug pdb "Bin laden determined to strike the US"

he was so concerened he wiretapped people before 9/11 but he didn't read his own briefing, hmmm.

[dutchdemocrat]

39. Converted Docs - Jewel in here somewhere?

I have converted both of these unclassified documents on Hayden into HTML from PDF.

Here

http://www.thisiswiretap.com/hayden2/ (24)

and

Here


http://www.thisiswiretap.com/hayden1/ (27)

There might be a jewel in there somewhere....

I have converted both of these unclassified documents on Hayden into HTML from PDF. Document 24: Statement for the Record of NSA Director Lt Gen Michael V. Hayden, USAF before the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, April 12, 2000

In a rare public appearance by the NSA director, Lt. Gen. Michael Hayden outlines the regulatory safeguards and oversight mechanisms that are in place to ensure that the agency's electronic surveillance mission does not infringe upon the privacy of U.S. persons, and to respond to recent allegations that NSA provides intelligence information to U.S. companies.

The agency may only target the communications of U.S. persons within the United States after obtaining a federal court order suggesting that the individual might be "an agent of a foreign power." The number of such cases have been "very few" since the passage of the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act in 1978. In cases where the NSA wishes to conduct electronic surveillance on U.S. persons overseas, the agency must first obtain the approval of the Attorney General, who must have probable cause to believe that the individual "is an agent of a foreign power, or a spy, terrorist, saboteur, or someone who aides or abets them." With regard to the unintentional collection of communications to, from, or about U.S. citizens, Hayden stresses that such information is not retained "unless the information is necessary to understand a particular piece of foreign intelligence or assess its importance."

In response to other allegations, Hayden asserts that NSA cannot request that another country "illegally" collect intelligence on U.S. persons on their behalf, and also that the agency "is not authorized to provide signals intelligence information to private U.S. companies."

Document 27: Statement for the Record by Lieutenant General Michael V. Hayden, Director, National Security Agency/Central Security Service Before the Joint Inquiry of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence and the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, October 17, 2002, Unclassified

Hayden, in his testimony to the joint committee intelligence performance prior to the terrorist attacks on New York and Washington of September 11, 2001, addresses three major questions: what did NSA know prior to September 11, what did NSA learn in retrospect, and what had NSA done in response? In his conclusions, Hayden addresses a number of issues - including the relationship between SIGINT and law enforcement, and the line between the government's need for counterterrorism information and the privacy interests of individuals residing in the United States.

[psychopomp]

40. kick for NSA whistleblowerers

bttft

[dflprincess]

41. But, but Cheney just said if they had been wiretaping before 9/11

they could have prevented it....This would mean he LIED! :sarcasm:

[ComerPerro]

65. Yeah, I guess this debunks that talking point

[dutchdemocrat]

42. I think it's Echelon turned inwards. So does Tice.

I think it's Echelon turned inwards. So does Tice.

See more at http://www.thisiswiretap.com or www.chris-floyd.com/bush/

Inside the Puzzle Palace
A Reason interview with NSA whistleblower Russell Tice

http://www.reason.com/hod/js011306b.shtml

Tice: I've thought about this for a while, and as I said, I can't tell you how things are done, but I can foresee it, especially with what we've seen now. We're finding out that NSA conducted surveillance on U.S. citizens. And FISA could have been used but wasn't, was sidestepped. No one even made the attempt to see if they had a problem they could have fixed through FISA.

That would lead one to ask the question: "Why did they omit the FISA court?"

I would think one reason that is possible is that perhaps a system already existed that you could do this with, and all you had to do is change the venue. And if that's the case, and this system was a broad brush system, a vacuum cleaner that just sucks things up, this huge systematic approach to monitoring these calls, processing them, and filtering them—then ultimately a machine does 98.8 percent of your work. What you come out with from a haystack is a shoebox full of straw. Once you have that, you have people that can look at it.

Now here's an interesting question: If this approach was used, and hundreds of thousands if not millions of communications were processed in that manner, and then if and when the truth ever came out, a lawyer—and I think lawyers are going to be arguing semantics in this case—the argument could be made, well, if a machine was doing the looking and the sucking in, it doesn't matter because that's not monitoring until a human looks at it.

SNIP

http://www.reason.com/hod/js011306b.shtml

[wordpix]

59. I'm waiting to hear from ACLU since they obtained list of NSA targets

including ACLU, Greenpeace and PETA by FOIA. But ACLU is silent so far.

[dutchdemocrat]

43. I think it's Echelon turned inwards. So does Tice.

I think it's Echelon turned inwards. So does Tice.

See more at http://www.thisiswiretap.com or www.chris-floyd.com/bush/

Inside the Puzzle Palace
A Reason interview with NSA whistleblower Russell Tice

http://www.reason.com/hod/js011306b.shtml

Tice: I've thought about this for a while, and as I said, I can't tell you how things are done, but I can foresee it, especially with what we've seen now. We're finding out that NSA conducted surveillance on U.S. citizens. And FISA could have been used but wasn't, was sidestepped. No one even made the attempt to see if they had a problem they could have fixed through FISA.

That would lead one to ask the question: "Why did they omit the FISA court?"

I would think one reason that is possible is that perhaps a system already existed that you could do this with, and all you had to do is change the venue. And if that's the case, and this system was a broad brush system, a vacuum cleaner that just sucks things up, this huge systematic approach to monitoring these calls, processing them, and filtering them—then ultimately a machine does 98.8 percent of your work. What you come out with from a haystack is a shoebox full of straw. Once you have that, you have people that can look at it.

Now here's an interesting question: If this approach was used, and hundreds of thousands if not millions of communications were processed in that manner, and then if and when the truth ever came out, a lawyer—and I think lawyers are going to be arguing semantics in this case—the argument could be made, well, if a machine was doing the looking and the sucking in, it doesn't matter because that's not monitoring until a human looks at it.

SNIP

http://www.reason.com/hod/js011306b.shtml

[robbedvoter]

46. No more blaming Clinton. Important Risen info

    James Risen, author of the book State of War and credited with first breaking the story about the NSA's domestic surveillance operations, said President Bush personally authorized a change in the agency's long-standing policies shortly after he was sworn in in 2001.

[robbedvoter]

47. Important: W personally changed long standing policies

that comes from Risen's book:

    James Risen, author of the book State of War and credited with first breaking the story about the NSA's domestic surveillance operations, said President Bush personally authorized a change in the agency's long-standing policies shortly after he was sworn in in 2001.

[Rigby Reardon]

48. I have to say again....

This is pretty common and has been going on for years. It is within the chater on the NSA to conduct this type of survelliance.

Just saying is all


Rigby ( ex-NSA )

[WhereIsMyFreedom]

57. Not true

Yes the NSA has been mass scanning domestic communications long before Bush came to power, but they took steps to protect the privacy of the US citizens. Right after Bush became president he personally authorized a change in those policies. Instead of immediately redacting the names of US citizens that were monitored (their policy under Clinton) they started to keep a list of names and even provided those names to senior Bush administration officials. That represents a significant change in policy, and is illegal.

[spooked911]

106. Yeah right. Then what is this article about?

Like I really trust YOU.

[Julius Civitatus]

52. Impeachment time!

Long overdue!

[leQ]

53. what this tells me is that bush knew 9/11 would happen

how could someone do this much (and probably more) spying and not know?

[Media_Lies_Daily]

61. LIHOP or MIHOP. Those are the ONLY options now available to help us....

...understand the true nature of the attacks that took place on 911.

[TankLV]

98. Definitely proves LIHOP. One step closer to MIHOP.

But is leaves no doubt about LIHOP.

But those of us who don't refuse to see the obvious and who don't have our heads up our asses and contiue to make excuses for bunkerboy and the repukes already knew it

[spooked911]

105. His administration knew it was going to happen

because they made it happen. There is simply no doubt.

[leQ]

54. what this tells me is that bush knew 9/11 would happen

how could officials do this much spying (and probably more) and NOT know?

[wordpix]

58. lies and more lies from BushCo

snip:
the document contradicts his assertion that the 9/11 attacks prompted him to take the unprecedented step of signing a secret executive order authorizing the NSA to monitor a select number of American citizens thought to have ties to terrorist groups.

[DemonFighterLives]

60. This info. will come in handy

Heh heh dubby,you dirty rat. heh heh
:kick:

[zann725]

63. Surprise...surprise....NOT.

He IS what he was raised to be, the son of an ex-CIA leader...who violates, by second-nature...the privacy of all, without any conscience. But in Jr's. case, fails to differentiate between true American citizen/patriots...and the enemy. Since ALL who are not his "parrots"...his "base"... are in his paranoid mind, the "enemy." How sad for Democracy and us all.

[dailykoff]

67. So that's how they pulled it off.

I used to wonder how they managed nearly perfect spin control from 9/11 to this day.

[The Backlash Cometh]

68. Filegate! Filegate!

Just a matter of time. tick tock, tick tock.

[PegDAC]

95. Joe Conason has stated

that the files requested were those of White House lower-level employees (kitchen staff, gardeners, janitorial, etc.) and that no Repuke activists' files were ever checked. I recall this from when he was on Al Franken with the slanderer who wrote that book about Hillary Clinton.

[The Backlash Cometh]

97. The Dems should take this and run with it.

And it should be coming out of Hillary's mouth if it's true that none of the people involved in Filegate were political opponents. What a weapon to use against the Bush Administration.

[DallasNE]

70. It All Fits

As I have posted before, my theory is that Bush set this up right after gaining power to snoop for dirt on people dealing with Saddam, either directly or indirectly through third parties. The executive order looks like it stemmed from push-back from NSA. This then just provides additional strength to that theory. Also, the in-fighting between NSA and Defense could have in fact contributed to the dots not being connected on 9/11. The NSA, after all, did have a legal wiretap on the San Diego hijackers and the Phoenix office of the FBI reported the same hijackers as taking flying lessons.

[adarling]

71. impeach!!!

this is a good reason to impeach him that can have strong ground underneath it. I feel the winds are a changin!! hahaha

[Selteri]

72. Keep passing this on.

We all need to keep passing this on until we find out all the details and force this to become the national issue that it is.

[IndianaGreen]

73. NSA used city police as trackers (Baltimore)

NSA used city police as trackers

Activists monitored on way to Fort Meade war protest, agency memos show

By Douglas Birch
Sun reporter
Originally published January 13, 2006

The National Security Agency used law enforcement agencies, including the Baltimore Police Department, to track members of a city anti-war group as they prepared for protests outside the sprawling Fort Meade facility, internal NSA documents show.

The target of the clandestine surveillance was the Baltimore Pledge of Resistance, a group loosely affiliated with the local chapter of the American Friends Service Committee, whose members include many veteran city peace activists with a history of nonviolent civil disobedience.

Under various names, the activists have staged protests at the NSA campus off the Baltimore-Washington Parkway every year since 1996.

Since the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, members of the group say, their protests have come under increasing scrutiny by federal and local law enforcement officials working on behalf of the NSA.

An internal NSA e-mail, posted on two Internet sites this week, shows how operatives with the "Baltimore Intel Unit" provided a minute-by-minute account of Pledge of Resistances' preparations for a July 3, 2004, protest at Fort Meade. An attorney for the demonstrators said he obtained the document through the discovery process from NSA.

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/custom/attack/bal-md.nsa13jan13,1,7390821.story?page=1

[happydreams]

74. Great addition to this. I filed a report in the Summer of '01

with my local police for harrassment and being surveiled. Maybe that wasn't such a good idea.

[IndianaGreen]

75. Russ Feingold On the Administration's Wiretapping Program

Fact Sheet from Senator Russ Feingold
On the Administration's Wiretapping Program

January 11, 2006

Senator Feingold and members of Congress from both parties have expressed deep concern about the President authorizing the National Security Agency (NSA) to wiretap American citizens on American soil without a warrant. The Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) makes it a crime to wiretap Americans in the United States without a warrant or a court order.

The government should wiretap suspected terrorists to protect our national security, but, in order to protect innocent people, a court should make sure that there is evidence indicating that the people being wiretapped might be terrorists. Below are facts about FISA, and about the Administration’s arguments in defense of the NSA’s wiretapping program:

On the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act

It Is Illegal to Wiretap Without a Warrant or Court Order: The law is clear that the criminal wiretap statute and FISA “shall be the exclusive means by which electronic surveillance . . . and the interception of domestic wire, oral, and electronic communications may be conducted.”

FISA Has an Emergency Exception: The Administration has indicated that it ignored FISA because it takes too long to get a warrant under that law. In fact, in an emergency where the Attorney General believes that surveillance must begin before a court order can be obtained, FISA permits the wiretap to be turned on immediately as long as the government goes to the court within 72 hours. Prior to 2001, the emergency wiretap period was only 24 hours. The Administration requested and received the increase to 72 hours in intelligence authorization legislation that passed in late 2001.

FISA Provides for Wartime Situations: FISA also permits the Attorney General to authorize warrantless electronic surveillance in the United States during the 15 days following a declaration of war, to allow time to consider any amendments to FISA necessitated by a wartime emergency.

The Administration Has Used FISA Thousands of Times Since 9/11: Administration officials have criticized FISA, but they have obtained thousands of warrants approved by the FISA court since 9/11, and have almost never had a warrant request rejected by that court.

On the Administration’s Arguments Defending the Wiretapping Program

Military Force Resolution Did Not Authorize Wiretapping: The President has argued that Congress gave him authority to wiretap Americans on U.S. soil without a warrant when it passed the Authorization for Use of Military Force after September 11, 2001. There is no language in the resolution and no evidence to suggest that it was intended to give the President blanket authority to order these warrantless wiretaps.

In fact, Congress passed the Patriot Act just six weeks after September 11 to expand the government’s powers to conduct surveillance of suspected terrorists and spies. Yet the Administration did not ask for, nor did the Patriot Act include, any change to FISA’s requirement of judicial approval for wiretaps of Americans in the United States.

Prohibition on Wiretapping Limits Executive Power: The President’s assertion of inherent executive power is also wrong. The President has extensive authority when it comes to national security and foreign affairs, but given the clear prohibition in FISA, that authority does not include the power to wiretap American citizens on American soil without a warrant.

Executive Branch Review of Wiretapping Is Not Enough: The President has argued that periodic executive branch review provides an adequate check on the program. But Congress when it passed FISA explicitly rejected the idea that the executive branch should be fully entrusted to conduct national security wiretaps on its own – a power that the executive had abused in the past. In addition, news reports indicate that NSA employees decide whose communications to tap. Low-level executive branch employees are no substitute for FISA Court judges.

Congress Did Not Approve This Program: While a handful of congressional leaders were informed about this program, some have said they were not given complete details and they were all prohibited from discussing what they were told with anyone, including other members of Congress. The fact that they were informed under these extraordinary circumstances does not constitute congressional oversight, nor does congressional inaction constitute approval of the program when only a handful of members, at most, even knew about it.

http://feingold.senate.gov/~feingold/releases/06/01/2006111.html

[wordpix]

92. Feingold-Schumer for president-I know that will never happen since they'r

they're both Jews but what the hell, the men have some BALLS

[Raksha]

76. I am pissed at these bastards!!!

Not only (or primarily, in this case) at the illegal wiretaps, but because I'd like to know WHY THE HELL DIDN'T THEY STOP IT???? Maybe because they didn't want to? There goes their argument that these wiretaps are a "highly effective" tool in fighting terrorism. What total bullshit...oh well, no point in preaching to the choir here.

[Josh999]

79. I have a neighbor

who, when I mention this illegal wiretapping NSA scandal, claims that under Clinton there were 2 invasive surveillance programs called Carnivore and Echelon and that they were extensively used without the permission of the court that was set up to deal with this (I have forgotten the name of this special court, sorry) I told him I don't believe him but before I make a fool of myself can any of you here give me information i can use against his claims?

[spooked911]

112. Welcome to DU first.

As to your question, Echelon and Carnivore were very different.

Echelon is the NSA spying program, and Clinton complied with FISA for Echelon.

Carnivore is an email spying program developed by the FBI, and was very controversial. I think it was scrapped. It's not clear Clinton did any spying with Carnivore though freepers will tell you otherwise.

[Roland99]

80. No wonder the bastard Propagandist wanted the NY Times to STFU.

BRING THEM DOWN!!!!

[savemefromdumbya]

81. HOW DID THEY MISS 9/11 TERRORISM IF THEY WERE SPYING?

So they did so much spying on American people who was calling their Aunt Sadie in Paris that they forgot about the terrorists? How did they miss the lead up to 9/11?

[stepnw1f]

82. lol...Another GOP Red Herring Exposed!

I love it...

[wordpix]

89. my question, too. Answer has to be: incompetence by dangerous morons

[spooked911]

107. They were the fucking terrorists? Got it now?

[savemefromdumbya]

115. When one reads the 9/11 'omission report

It makes one think that wool has been pulled over eyes.

[xchrom]

84. i wanna know who they were spying on pre-911?

if they were spying on quakers post 9-11 -- were they spying on them before?

then who else?

and if the president is spying up, down and sideways -- why wouldn't he take seriously the reports that bin laden was going to strike the u.s. -- and how does that memorandum that was sitting on his desk while he went on vacation fit into this?

for my money using a court procedure CAN work for the 21st century -- but you have to be somebody who doesn't see themselves as the center of the universe -- but a team player.

[wordpix]

91. my guess is BushCo spying on environmental, other activist groups

They just have to get their hands on public lands to strip them of their natural resources and keep BushCo profits healthy and donors wealthy

[Vyan]

102. And you probably..

would be guessing correctly.

Walter Pincus in the Washington Post has written that...

Information captured by the National Security Agency's secret eavesdropping on communications between the United States and overseas has been passed on to other government agencies, which cross-check the information with tips and information collected in other databases, current and former administration officials said.

The NSA has turned such information over to the Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) and to other government entities, said three current and former senior administration officials, although it could not be determined which agencies received what types of information. Information from intercepts -- which typically includes records of telephone or e-mail communications -- would be made available by request to agencies that are allowed to have it, including the FBI, DIA, CIA and Department of Homeland Security, one former official said.

Couple this revelation with other sources which indicate *who* at least some of that information was about, it appears NSA information has been used by Pentagon to spy on Gays (Cause y'know, there a really huge national security risk with all that Pink and fashion sense and all..) while the FBI has been spying on Greenpeace, Peta and Anti-War Protestors.


Vyan

[rambler_american]

85. Story is Untrue

The difference between us and BushCo is that we can admit mistakes:

New Truthout Spying "Scoop" Doesn't Prove What It Says It Does

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/1/14/141253/617

[understandinglife]

87. self delete.

Peace.

[Vyan]

96. The story is different...

than it appears on first blush, but it's still true. I've read and posted in the Dkos thread - and the core issue remains the same.

1 ) Bush specifically asked the NSA to retain information that that they normally wouldn't (the list of U.S. names) - without first obtaining FISA approval prior to 9-11.

2) This had not been done by the previous administration.

3) After Sept 11th, Senior Bush officials wanted to share this information with outside agencies such as FBI, CIA or DIA - NSA refused and deleted the names just as they should have been doing all along.

This is slightly different from the Risen issue - but I suspect this reluctance by NSA is what cause the President to 40 sign executive orders allowing NSA information gathered about U.S. citizens to be shared with FBI, DIA, HSA. etc, without FISA warrants in fhe first place.

The problem now is that this information has the potential to be "fruits of the poison tree" since it was gathered without a warrant, and any subsequent clues or evidence gleaned from this data would be inadmissable in court. Unless -- so-called "high risk" targets are grabbed up by the special access group that been kidnapping terrorist suspects overseas for several years now, and puts them in our secret prison system abroad. In that case, it wouldn't matter if all your evidence is tainted - no ones ever going to see it, or the suspect - again.

Vyan

[spooked911]

108. Yes, exactly. Well put.

The story isn't wrong, but there are a few issues being merged together here.

[Canuckistanian]

86. The USA Patriot Act was signed on October 26, 2001

ANY spying or wiretapping on US citizens without a FISA warrant before that date, Even by the president's standards, is a clear violation of the law.

[savemefromdumbya]

100. yes it was and still is a violation of the law

who is going to do something about it? Can they arrest the Pretzeldent?

[donkeyotay]

88. The preznit is a serial liar, and the media and repo's let him.

So * has been going around saying:

We don't spy on Americans.
Well, we do, but it's just a few.
Well, we spy on a few but only within the law.
Well, it might have been a lot, but only with FISA warrants.
Well, it might have been a lot and without warrants, but I have UNITARY powers and I'm above the law anyway.
Well, even if it was a lot and I'm not above the law, 9-11 changed everything so I can do this for your own good.

Now, it turns out that even the last excuse was a lie, and he knew it was when he said it.

[emald]

90. there is no doubt bushit is implicit in deep dereliction of duty

in almost every aspect of his "pResidency". The big question is why has nothing been done by congress? Is this country so sold out that never an opposing voice is heard? Why have we allowed this to happen? This man is an admitted liar, a fucking sleazbag full of putrid hate, a president without moral compass though espousing just such a compass? I have little hope for this country; if nothing has been done by now it probably won't.
How loud will we all yell after he nukes Iran? When he's started drafting undesirables into an army of hate?
I'm getting very mad, viciously mad. But what to strike out at? A single man with no target makes a mighty slim resistance. But this lying and selling out of our country has me furious and I see nothing being done but a little whimpering on the side lines. This bully of a president will not leave office, hell he hasn't won an election yet but there he is. Skeptical? you fucking bet I am. These pricks have all but won. ameriKa the great. World terrorist.

[imouttahere]

104. Totally understand how you feel....

someone will have to show me where the hope lies. Meantime, I'm working on getting the hell out of here.

[greiner3]

103. bushco can't even get their own facts straight;

About lying about lying.

[spooked911]

109. Nice graphic!

[Rex]

113. So 911 was their official excuse for domestic spying

unofficially they started 9 months before 911. My my my. It's as if they knew something was up. They knew and wanted to see who else knew in America. To bad you have to get a blowjob to be impeached.

[nittacci]

114. spread the news

This story has to be spread far and wide. I know it's no surprise to us, but there are plenty of Americans who are thinking "he's protecting us" and might be interested to find that Bush's willingness to violate the law really had nothing to do with "security" or "terrorism".

Please spread the word on this important story.

[Ganja Ninja]

116. We're still one blow job short of a scandal.

or so it seems. :eyes: