Bremer attacks 'idiotic' Spanish troops in Iraq

[Julius Civitatus]

A friend just sent me this very revealing article. Call it another diplomatic success for the Bush administration. Basically, Bremer is bitching in his book that the Spaniards, as well as other members of the "coalition of the willing," REFUSED to follow his orders even when those orders were QUESTIONABLE under UN law (like the take of Falluja, Najaf, etc).

The so "diplomatic" comments by the career diplomat Bremer have angered people in Spain from all political stripes, left and right, given that Spain has lost many soldiers, civilians and journalists in both Iraq and Afghanistan.


Mr. Bremer doesn't seem to understand that:
a) foreign armies do follow their own chain of command, and are not at the service of viceroy Bremer, and

b) most countries that sent troops to Iraq as part of the "coalition of the willing" did so under the auspices of the UN. It was their prerogative to make certain decisions in cases where international law could be broken.

But again, asking the Bush administration to understand "diplomacy" is like asking my cat to understand algebra.

Bremer attacks 'idiotic' Spanish troops in Iraq

12 January 2006

MADRID — The former US governor of Iraq has condemned Spanish troops for their 'idiotic' conduct in Iraq.

Paul Bremer claimed they "did nothing" as a battle between Shi'ite militia forces and coalition troops went on around them in the Iraqi city of Najaf in 2004.

In his memoirs, Bremer wrote: "They are sitting in tanks doing nothing", quoting from notes he made at the time.

"It is a perfect outrage – I call it the 'coalition of the not-at-all- willing'."

Bremer's book, 'My year in Iraq: The struggle to build a future of hope', challenges the version given by the Spanish military of the Najaf uprising in April 2004. (...)

Full article

[ixion]

1. oh, you mean those troops that just cleaned up two Al-Qaida cells?

those troops? The ones that were actually out doing something rather than stand around and kill innocent civillians? You mean those troops, right?

*sigh*

[xchrom]

2. maybe they were trying to tell bushco

their bribe package wasn't big enough?

[saigon68]

3. BREMER IS AN IDIOT and A WAR CRIMINAL

KILLER OF CHILDREN

[TheBaldyMan]

4. Spain has long standing cultural and historical links to Arab culture ...

It seems strange that he couldn't trust his subordinates who were actually in situ to handle it. Symptomatic of the micromanagement and political blindness that is going to get the allies butt kicked out of Iraq eventually.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

6. "Allies?"

[Amonester]

12. Yeah, like everything else in these "New" modern days...

Peace = Endless Wars
Down = Up
Idiots = Leaders
Traitors = Patriots
Allies = The Axis Powers ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Axis_Powers )

It Just Goes With This "New" (old) Millennium of the "New" Dominionists

:sarcasm:

[TheBaldyMan]

15. the 'coalition of the willing' - remember them?

like the contingents from :

UK
Australia
Phillipines
Italy
Spain
Poland
Japan
Brazil
Marianas Islands
Fiji
Kiribati and Vanuatu

[Julius Civitatus]

8. I'm not sure I fully agree

I think that Spain actually has a more historical feeling of resentment with the Arab world, rather. This can be observed today in general attitudes and cultural behavior. At least I get that vibe from my friends from Spain.

In any case, I do believe the Spanish command may have seen way too many violations of human rights and/or international law, and became less "proactive" when engaging in massive takeover of cities or rounding up civilians. Who can blame them.

If I remember correctly, the Polish army did the same thing.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

13. They were at war (REAL war) with the Arabs non-stop for CENTURIES.

Of course they know better now. And Spanish culture owes much of its beauty to the Arabs.

[TheBaldyMan]

14. odd that the forces that have direct experience of totalitarian states

are the ones that act less repressively.

btw are your spanish friends Hidalgo (no arab blood) that might explain their attitude to non-whites. About half of the Iberian peninsula was moorish at one time so there is a more than a few drops of Arab blood running in Spanish veins today. I think thats where the expression 'blue-blooded' comes from - the more white you were the more you could see the veins more clearly through your skin. The architecture, food and music are heavily influenced by islamic culture.

Today there is a lot of resentment and suspicion about Arabs from N.Africa but I'd put that down to problems with immigration rather than a historical legacy.

[many a good man]

21. Spain has the best relations with the Arab world

of any country in Europe.

Parts of Spain were under Muslim control for over 700 years while Europe was mired in the Dark Ages. Spainiard deeply respect and admire the cultural and scientific achievements of that era. This has created a special bond between the two peoples. Muslim, Jew, and Christian lived side by side in peace and prosperity for long stretches of time until the occasional religious wacko would rear his ugly head and screw everything up for a few generations.

[Julius Civitatus]

22. Not quite. France is the EU country with best links to Arab world

both politically and economically.

And while some of the historical points you mention are true, they were not as rosy color as some historians have made it to be. Allow me to ellaborate:

Islamic armies invaded the Southern 1/3 to 1/2 of the peninsula and installed a Caliphate under Islamic law. Between 711 and the early 1200s the southern third of Spain was under Muslim rule. The residents of this area either converted of became taxated by the new Muslim rulers. Coexistence was never peaceful except in some key cities that were centers for exchange and commerce like Toledo (the "New York City" of the Middle Ages). There was a period of prosperity during that time in the Muslim regions because of the influx of arts and culture they brought from the other side of the Mediterranean (as Islam invaded areas of the Eastern Mediterranean they got to transfer a great deal of classic greco-roman culture back to Western Europe).

While Christians and Jews were tolerated under the Muslim areas, they were heavily taxated, and had to subject to the Muslim laws for the "Dihim." Still, about half of population of Southern Spain remained Christian under Muslim rule (These were called the "Mozarabs," basically Christians living under the realm of the Muslim caliphate). Mozarabs were the cultural bridge between both cultures, being able to translate much of the classic works back from Arabic to Latin, then pass them to the rest of Western Europe. In the meantime, the Christian kingdoms of the Northern half of Spain kept their campaign of reconquest of the peninsula, a campaign that was relentless. Tension was always part of the relationship, and except for trading areas and cultural centers, coexistence between the cultures was always part of a state of war.

The first one and 1/2 centuries of Muslim rule were quite a prosperous time... but that ended with the Almoravids, a fundamentalist movement (more or less similar to the Taliban) that decided to end up all that epicurean lifestyle and sinning the Caliphs were enjoying in Southern Spain. They invaded back from Northern Africa and took over the Muslim areas of Southern Spain with a vengeance, now with a fundie zeal. They decided to try and take over the Christian Kingdoms as well, as they were engaged in this war since 711. Yet they kept slowly losing key battle after key battle until most of the Iberian Peninsula was retaken by the Christian kingdoms by the mid 1200s.

The only place that remained Muslim for the next two centuries was the city of Granada and its surroundings, until its fall in 1492, when it was sieged and retaken by Ferdinand and Isabella.

There is an awesome history book about the relationships between Islam and Christianity that I read recently that I strongly recommend:

The Cross and the Crescent, by Richard Fletcher

It explains very well the relationship of the two religions through history, sheds light on some myths, and brings new info to how this ages-long clash of civilization has evolved over time.

[DBoon]

11. Spain has a recent history of fascism under Franco

and maybe understands exactly what is involved in war crimes.

[Spinzonner]

5. I think you'll have better luck with the cat

At least s/he's just intellectually incapable, not willfully rejectionist

[The_Casual_Observer]

7. Bremer, like Brownie, simply wasn't up to the task.

He is a failed bonehead.

[oblivious]

16. Yes, he's a complete and utter failure.

[cliss]

9. Oh, this is funny.

I remember reading about how the U.S. first occupied Iraq. In Baghdad, Bremer just moved in to one of Saddam's former palaces. That was appropriate! It didn't take long for Bremer to realize, "Hey, this is cool!". "I like the idea of being Emperor".

Not a damn thing got done while he was Emperor, other than he fired Saddam's army of Baathists, and it led directly to the insurgency which has gone on ever since.

And who could forget the billions of dollars which vanished under his watch. Paul?

[NYC]

17. Bremer learned recipes while he was emperor.

"The food in Iraq is delicious," says Bremer, "a blend of standard Arabic cuisine with Persian influences and Turkish influence in the north. And the Kurds live in a garden paradise -- they can grow anything: nuts, apples, pears, apricots, grapes, melons, herbs. They make great goat cheeses, cow's milk cheeses and the best honey I've eaten anywhere."

See Judi Lynn's post #62 here:
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=102&topic_id=2026118#2026878

for a picture of Bremer with china to match wardrobe. He wrote a book on Iraq, so I guess he is still finding ways to make money off the misery of Iraqis.

[wookie294]

10. This is proof we continue to LOSE the war in Iraq

Let the allies bitch at each other. Hitler's henchmen were fighting amongst themselves, too, during his last days.

[BikeWriter]

18. In 2000, the National Commission on Terrorism, led by Ambassador Paul

In 2000, the National Commission on Terrorism, led by Ambassador Paul
Bremer, found that, among other things:

• The FBI, which is responsible for investigating terrorism in the United States, suffered from bureaucratic and cultural obstacles to obtaining terrorism information;
• The Department of Justice applied the statute governing electronic surveillance and physical searches of international terrorists in a cumbersome and overly cautious manner;
• The risk of personal liability arising from actions taken in an official capacity discouraged law enforcement and intelligence personnel from taking bold actions to combat terrorism;
• The U.S. intelligence and law enforcement communities lacked the ability to prioritize, translate, and understand in a timely fashion all of the information to which they have access; and
• The law enforcement community was neither fully exploiting the growing amount of information it collected during the course of terrorism investigations nor distributing that information effectively to analysts and policymakers.
http://www.thememoryhole.org/911/hearings/911hearing-hill-oct03.htm

[struggle4progress]

19. Hmmpf! That chickenhawk got his own butt out of Iraq just as fast as ..

.. he could in June 2004. I wonder how much of his "year in Iraq" he actually spent in Iraq ...

[leesa]

20. Not everyone likes to be a war criminal like you are Bremer