Report: Tamiflu is 'useless' for avian flu

[lovuian]

http://feeds.bignewsnetwork.com/?sid=d3d95996c20548f5

A Vietnamese doctor with experience in treating avian flu says Tamiflu, the drug being stockpiled for treatment of avian flue is useless against the virus.

Dr. Nguyen Tuong Van of the Centre for Tropical Diseases in Hanoi has treated 41 victims of H5N1, following World Health Organization guidelines and administering Tamiflu to her patients. She told the Sunday Times of London the medicine had no effect.

'We place no importance on using this drug on our patients', she said. 'Tamiflu is really only meant for treating ordinary type A flu. It was not designed to combat H5N1.

More...

The people who have stockpiled this stuff is in for a surprise!!!

[Kagemusha]

1. Including flu experts I take it?

That was the buzz after all. If flu experts are stockpiling it then there must be something to it.

Well, it's the only thing that had a shot here, at having ANY effect. In terms of anti-viral drugs. Real pity if that one shot turns up not being useful at all.

[tinrobot]

2. I thought governments were stockpiling it

Rumsfeld owns lots of stock in the company that makes Tamiflu. He used to sit on the board.

You think THAT might be the reason governments are stockpiling it?

Perhaps?

[MADem]

8. Oh, he'd NEVER do a thing like that!!! (said with all due sarcasm!)

Or perhaps he just might.... http://money.cnn.com/2005/10/31/news/newsmakers/fortune_rumsfeld/?cnn=yes

Rumsfeld served as Gilead (Research)'s chairman from 1997 until he joined the Bush administration in 2001, and he still holds a Gilead stake valued at between $5 million and $25 million, according to federal financial disclosures filed by Rumsfeld....

[mia]

15. It's Rumsfeld's turn to make some money.

[mod mom]

75. Exactly why the administration is pushing the fear tactics!

[spotbird]

57. Duct tape revisited

I'm glad the avian influenza funding was slashed, it was just another upward transfer of wealth.

[merwin]

3. it's being stockpiled only because rumsfeld has a

crapload of stock in tamiflu. the drug is 100 percent hype when it comes to bird flu. in fact, bird flu itself is a big hype. you have as good of a chance of getting it as you do ebola. for it to be even a threat, it has to mutate to something that can pass from person to person... and how do we know what drugs will work on a virus that doesn't exist yet?

[madrchsod]

12. well if one eats bats in that area one

has a good chance in getting ebola..20 or so percent of the bats have the ebola virus.

[merwin]

41. Yet another reason why I avoid eating bats...

:-)

[MadisonProgressive]

58. Darn, I'll have to revert back to eating scorpions

[merwin]

62. The pointy bits are the best part

[tsetaerg]

4. I have a problem with infor from a third world nation

Is her study funded by the who? Where was the tam obtained from.
was it given on onset of flu?
I know we worry about being ripped off by drug companies.
This is the best we have...after it comes chicken soup.

[MADem]

11. Not chicken soup--KIM CHI!!!! (BBC, a fairly reliable source, too!)

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/4347443.stm

South Korea's spicy fermented cabbage dish, kimchi, could help to cure bird flu, according to researchers.

Scientists at Seoul National University say they fed an extract of kimchi to 13 infected chickens - and a week later 11 of them had started recovering.

The researchers said the results were far from scientifically proven and if kimchi did have the effects they observed, it was unclear why.

South Koreans are reported to be eating more kimchi as a result of the study. ... more at link.

Is it the cabbage, the garlic, the secret sauce, or the fermentation?

[formercia]

45. MMMMM Kim Chi

It will kill anything, especially romance.

[MADem]

46. Not if everyone partakes!!!

I love the stuff--hoooooooooo eeeeeee!!!! Spicy as all get out, and don't light a match with all the tootin' after the meal--but it is good stuff, if you go for that sort of thing!

[formercia]

63. I love it too.

Definitely an aquired taste. Like the old saying goes, once you get past the smell..............

[MadisonProgressive]

59. SauerKraut works wonders too!

[lovuian]

16. This is the final paragraph of the article WHO answers with

The WHO has acknowledge Tamiflu had not been widely successful in human patients, but said it believes it would have been more effective in many Asian countries if it had been used earlier in the illness.



thats the World Health Organization!!!

[tsetaerg]

18. that is the whole taco

when the tamiflu is used. Too bad... tamiflu is a drug for the rich..my ppo will not cover it.

[lovuian]

19. Your right thats the whole enchilada!!! But even the rich may not

find it effective either...

The vagueness of this makes stockpiling this drug questionable...

[tsetaerg]

20. of course,.

u can join the army and get it free. not a case reported in Iraq yet.

[tsetaerg]

21. time to bring our troops home

[lovuian]

23. Well if they did get it would be told about it!!!

NO!!! well of course Rumsfeld who owns stock in Roche would be stockpiling for the Army!!!

[lovuian]

54. When this gets out Roche's stock is going down!!!

:crazy:

[Media_Lies_Daily]

22. Vietnam has been dealing with Avian Flu for quite some time, and their....

...medical personnel have quite a bit of experience attemping to treat it and have compiled quite bit of very useful data. Unfortunately, the best anyone can do right now is quarantine those that get the disease. 50% or more of those that have gotten the disease in Vietnam have died.

The Tamiflu lack of effectiveness against the H5N1 Avian Flu variant has been discussed on most of the disease message boards for about a year now. If you want to stockpile Tamiflu, that's your business, but at least you can now make an informed decision on whether or not to do it.

[lovuian]

24. Words of Wisdom Media Lies Words of wisdom!!!

:crazy:

[depakid]

78. Like I mentioned in another post- you're misinforming people

based on rumor and internet conspiracy theory.

Why that is, I wouldn't know for certain, but I suspect it's from either the inability to do proper research or understand credible, scientific material-

Either way, you do people a disservice by posting this crap without checking your statements against the evidence that's readily available at organizations like the WHO or through simple keyword searches on
on google scholar or pubmed.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

79. LOL. You don't have any idea what you're talking about...

...and if you're depending on WHO for credible information on this or any other disease, you're wasting your time. That organization's poor performance during the SARS outbreak, and its' current poor performance at trying to get China to tell the world what they've been dealing with for the past six months should tell anyone what they need to know about the WHO.

IMHO, the only thing the WHO is good for is reacting to diseases once they've emerged, and then marshalling medical forces to go to the affected geographic areas to attempt to control the spread of the disease. By the time they arrive at a trouble spot, a week or two has passed. If Avian Flu begins to spread efficiently human-to-human, how far will it spread before the WHO finally reacts?

Additionally, you do people a disservice by continuing to support the views of the medical/pharmaceutical industry when anyone with half a brain should realize that everything they do is being done with huge profits in mind. The same goes for the so-called peer review medical publications that do little more than protect the medical status quo.

By the way, I've been following this story since the first known deadly outbreak of Avian Flu in Hong Kong several years ago. I would wager a guess that I'm much better informed on this subject than 95% of this board.

[depakid]

81. I think I'll stick with empirical science

and what I know about the WHO & their collaborative partners and leave you to run on with the half-baked internet conspiracies.

I just hope no one is dumb enough to believe your quakery.

Next thing we know, you'll be citing Mercola... :+

[OregonBlue]

42. Vietnam may be third world but, they are very sophisticated.

Lots of very well-educated people. Many doctors are trained in France, Germany, Canada, U.S.

Don't assume that because a nation is poor, they are also incompetent. I get most of my health care in Thailand. Much better than here. More modern, latest equipment and research. Best health care I have ever had. All the doctors I see there are trained in U.S. or Australia.

Lots of good research going on in SE Asia. Also, big pharmaceutical companies there.

[rooboy]

5. It didn't help my wife when she had the normal 'flu, either...

if you don't take it at the very onset of symptoms, it's a complete waste of time.

[etherealtruth]

33. I think that is key ...

There is a a relatively small window in which tamiflu treatment is effective ...at least that is what i have understood from health care professionals,

I wonder at what point, in the course of illness were the patients in Vietnam treated,

This physician may well be correct, but, i'd like to see some research data that coincided with her anecdotal info.

[depakid]

6. That's NOT what the peer reviewed research says

Nor is it what just about every other public health official around the world believes.


I think I'll trust their collective wisdom over this one doc- and the usual conspiracy theories.

[lovuian]

7. This is the biggest farce and Tamiflu has made Roche a

bunch of money for nothing!!!

[tsetaerg]

10. not a farce..

the chicken farmers in the US. believe..u go to visit the farm..they treat u like a bio- threat.

[madrchsod]

13. it is a bio threat-to chickens.

with nam and china vaccinating their birds i`m sure the us farmers are doing the same. actually most hog farms,turkey,and chicken farms have signs warning people not to enter without protection of one form or another.

[depakid]

29. Try reading some real science

Like this:

Oseltamivir (Tamiflu) and its potential for use in the event of an influenza pandemic

Recent cross species transmission of avian influenza has highlighted the threat of pandemic influenza. Oseltamivir (Tamiflu®) has been shown to be effective in the treatment and prevention of epidemic influenza infection in adults, adolescents and children (≥ 1 year). Although oseltamivir has not been approved for prophylactic use in children, it has been shown to be effective. Oseltamivir is also active against avian influenza virus strains.

Journal of Antimicrobial Chemotherapy 2005 55(suppl_1):i5-i21

http://jac.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/55/suppl_1/i5

See also:

http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v435/n7041/full/435407a.html

[stickdog]

72. So it's "active" against avain flu?

What does that "science" mean? Does it cure chickens or something?

[madrchsod]

9. tamiflu has no effect on the "bird flu"

it`s one big con game on a global scale. the best way to combat the disease is to vaccinate the birds. this is already being done in nam and china.

[tsetaerg]

14. it's the home grown birds

that the threat...wild duck flys in to eat and poop. mommy go out to get dinner..caught the sic chicken...serves it up to u..the virus
jumps into your blooodstream...u kill off the world pop about 60 million worldwide..

[Media_Lies_Daily]

25. The Avian Flu will not become a pandemic until it achieves the....

...capability to jump easily from human-to-human. It may have already developed this capability, but the countries that are the most likely candidates for this to happen have the poorest national healthcare programs.

[KitchenWitch]

26. Given that millions are without health insurance in this country

I believe we are likely candidates.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

35. Yep....no doubt about that. Especially since we have so many....

...overseas flights arriving daily, not to mention the ship traffic in and out of our port cities.

There is also a free-flowing conduit from Mexico into the U. S. Canada didn't handle the SARS episode very well, so we can probably expect something to come from that direction, too.

And what is the NeoCon Junta's solution? Use troops to quarantine the infected areas. Why do I get flashes of different scenes in Stephen King's book "The Stand", especially the part where one of the main characters leaves New York City by walking through a tunnel where he discovers dead troops at one end that attempted to close off the city?

[KitchenWitch]

56. No Kidding about the Stephen King novel

This whole thing is like a combination of a Stephen King and a Tom Clancy novel (I mean our current political climate, and the disaster stuff).

[tsetaerg]

27. it not weather it can..

just when.

[barb162]

17. I think Japan is using this like crazy for the avian flu also

[Media_Lies_Daily]

38. Japan is one of the biggest consumers of Tamiflu over the last....

...several years in regards to treating previous strains of influenza among the human population. The very real danger is that they may have developed a tolerance for Tamiflu which would make it virtually worthless for treating human Avian Flu.

If I were living in Japan, I would be very worried about the rumors coming out of China for the last six months to a year. Those rumors consist of entire villages being quarantined in response to an unspecified disease, the occupants being removed to locations unknown, and the villages being razed to the ground.

China is also where the latest fears of H5N1 infected migratory birds has originated. The migratory birds surviving the H5N1 Avian Flu outbreak have already migrated west, south, and northeast along their migratory flight paths resulting in the reports of infected domestic flocks as far west as the eastern outskirts of Europe.

[Up2Late]

28. BullShit! Another BS article by "Big News Network"

Come on folks, please stop listening to these Non-credible sources!

Isn't it strange to anyone here that the author of such a BIG NEWS Story would NOT put his or her name on the story, or that this BIG NEWS story did NOT originate at a credible News organization, but instead is coming from a corporation who is "...incorporated in Manama, Bahrain...." But their "...main offices are in Sydney, Australia...?" <http://www.bignewsnetwork.com/about.html>

To add to the mystery, the formerly great, but now Moonie run UPI has it in the same form too, though at UPI, they take credit for it. <http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/view.php?StoryID=20051203-094414-4342r>

I'm not even going to go into the "Taking one 'Vietnamese doctor with experience in treating avian flu'" word for this, instead of a conclusion reached by the scientific method, I'm not even going to get into that.

Oh brother, get a clue folks, this is BS propaganda, or worst, lies just to see how many suckers their are out there.:banghead: :mad:

[muriel_volestrangler]

34. I agree that 'Big News Network' is a slightly annoying source

since it's not always clear where their stories comes from. When I look at it now, I can see it's credited to UPI; I don't know if it's always said that.

But reading the article, it's clear that it really comes from the British Sunday Times. Here's their article, more or less identical apart from the "Sunday Times has learned"-type phrases: http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-1903046,00.html

What surprises me slightly is that the name of the female Vietnamese doctor is identical to the male Vietnamese-Australian just executed in Singapore for drug trafficking. Possible, I suppose, but a strange coincidence. Can anyone Vietnamese confirm that the name is reasonable for a woman?

[Up2Late]

49. Maybe, but if you look at the date of the BNN/UPI "articles" and the...

"The Sunday Times" article, "The Sunday Times" article is dated AFTER (December 4, 2005) the BNN/UPI publication date (December 3, 2005), how does that work?

Yes, often what happens is a newspaper to the East of the U.S. will publish a story late in the evening or early morning local time, then it's picked up up and published in U.S. newspaper. The paper in the east (like this, the UK) and the US paper usually has the same date, and, unless a crime is bing committed, has the original authors name on it. That didn't happen here.

And seeing how "The Sunday Times" is part of Rupert Murdoch's "News Corporation," I don't trust anything they put out either.

<http://www.newscorp.com/operations/newspapers.html>

There is one and maybe two crimes being committed here, Plagiarism and/or Conspiracy, could be both, or it could even be bigger than that. I doubt that "The Sunday Times" plagiarized UPI, but who can say at this point.

Seeing how MOST of the "Breaking News" stories at BNN (with few from Reuters thrown in to try to give a bit of respectability) most are from "The New York POST," I wouldn't be at all surprised if this turned out to be a covert propaganda project of Rupert Murdoch and/or "News Corporation."

This is not a trust worthy source.

[muriel_volestrangler]

64. No, I think your time zone explanation does fit

The Sunday Times publishes just after midnight (GMT), Sunday, Dec 4th; UPI, 5 hours to the west, pick it up, write it as "blah, blah, blah, the Sunday Times was told", and put it out on their site, where it's still Dec 3rd, EST.

Since UPI make it clear it's the Sunday Times' story, there's no plagiarism, nor conspiracy (since their acknowledgement is open).

[Up2Late]

70. You're probably right about the conspiracy question, but...

...I think it's a clear case of plagiarism. Crediting an authors article to his or her newspaper mid-way though the article is generally not considered sufficient attribution.

Plus they edited out a bunch of qualifying statements and info, and changed the wording of other statements. I wrote more about this further down the thread.

Here is how two different U.S. Universities define plagiarism:

<http://gervaseprograms.georgetown.edu/hc/plagiarism.html>

<http://sja.ucdavis.edu/avoid.htm#reasons>

This link goes to the Georgetown website index, linked to above:

<http://gervaseprograms.georgetown.edu/hc/index.html>

[Media_Lies_Daily]

39. You need to do more research on this subject...

...because you are woefully uninformed.

[Up2Late]

44. What!?! Are you saying that to me or the original poster?

Who is woefully uninformed?

[Media_Lies_Daily]

51. Why the apparent confusion? I replied directly to your post.

[Up2Late]

60. Why then, the cryptic messages "Media_Lies_Daily"?

If you have something to say, then say it. A personal attack on me, instead of what I wrote is a cop-out.

You have to be the last person, someone who uses the member name of "Media_Lies_Daily," who I would expect such blind trust of such a shady media source from.

If you have any evidence that "Big News Network" IS a trustworthy source, I'd like to see it, tell me how I'm "woefully uninformed!" Let's see your "...research on this subject."

[lovuian]

61. Is the NYT trustworthy>??? Big News majority articles

come from Rueters UPI New York Post BBC etc... etc...
this are News Agencies???
tell me a trustworthy News agency Fox CNN MSNBC ... NONE of them are trustworthy...

instead of going after the news agency go after proof that TamiFlu cures avian Flu H5N1

then you have proved your point...

[Up2Late]

67. My reply to this and your previous question is below.

Please don't take this personally, I'm not trying to attack your credibility, just UPI's unethical editing and plagiarism of this article and BNN propagation of it.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

74. What "cryptic messages"? I thought I made myself pretty clear.

[rfkrfk]

30. Tamilu works great, when my Norwegian Blue Parrot got the flu ...

I gave him a few drops, he perked up the next day

[Media_Lies_Daily]

36. That flu was NOT the H5N1 Avian Flu variant. If it had been, you....

...would either be buying a new parrot, or you would have been six feet under.

[AngryAmish]

37. He wasn't sick

He was just pining.

[Robb]

40. What kind of talk is that?

E's off the twig! :D :thumbsup:

[nadinbrzezinski]

31. Tell taht to peer review

look they want to make muricans go, well good grief good thing that the gov'menmt did not stock it.

Care to tell me waht is the percentage of US Population covered right at the moment? If you said less than 1% you got the lottery. Why do you think they are running this BS? THINK.

[libodem]

32. put this in your test tube and grow it

most flu vaccines are cultured in eggs....perhaps that makes an avian flu susceptible to compromise because of the medium?

[WhiteTara]

43. brought to you by the man

who brought us Saddam Hussein, aspartame, nuclear facilities in North Korea and Bush's War. The one and only Donald Rumsfeld. When do you think the world will wake up to this man?:grr:
IMPEACH BUSH AND SEND THEM ALL TO THE HAGUE

[Corgigal]

47. 60 minutes did a report on some of the poor countries

One doctor in charge of monitoring and treating any patient found with Bird flu mentioned he has one, ONE tablet per county.

Yeah I can see how Tamiflu wouldn't work there.

[goforit]

48. WhoooHooo...isn't this great?.....Unfriggin believable!!!!!!

[Up2Late]

50. No No No NO NO Noooooooooooooooooooo! This is BS Dis-INFO!!!!

See above <http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=102&topic_id=1966363&mesg_id=1966478>

[Media_Lies_Daily]

52. No, it is NOT disinformation. Like I stated previously....

...you are woefully misinformed on the effectiveness of Tamiflu on the H5N1 Avian Influenza variant.

[lovuian]

53. Are you saying the United Press is not a good source???

Rueters???
The articles from Big News come from Independant News Mirror News Rueters...

this are all news agencies

Murdoch owned Moonie owned well welcome to half of all the news agencies in the world and we are not allowed to post these articles from these agencies???

New York Times had Judith Miller and put out tons of propoganda and this is a News Worthy agency...

Lets see Murdoch owns the
Herald ,Time,New York Post, Fox news, Independant,
does that mean none of these newspapers can post articles

I have been posting newsworthy articles from Big News now for over 4 years... here on the DU...

All news is suspect these days and its a propoganda tool...
America is using propoganda in Iraq news with our tax dollars...

I would want to know all points of view...

[MADem]

65. Helen Thomas quit UPI, in disgust. She had been with them for years nt

[Up2Late]

66. No United Press is NOT a good source anymore. I hasn't been...

...quite a while now. Especially when they plagiarize a story from another newspaper, and change the word of the original story and the Headline to support an agenda they are promoting.

Check out all that was left out or changed on the BNN/UPI version, which originally came from, but was not credited to The Sunday Times. That which was left out is in bold, text that was change is in Italic or bold italic:

Original headline and author:

Doctor says bird flu drug is ‘useless’

(changed to "Report: Tamiflu is 'useless' for avian flu" in UPI version)

Jonathon Carr-Brown (Un-credited in UPI version)

“...We place no importance on using this drug on our patients,” she said. “Tamiflu is really only meant for treating ordinary type A flu. It was not designed to combat H5N1 . . . (Tamiflu) is useless.”

Her verdict casts doubt on the pandemic flu policy put in place by the Irish government. Mary Harney, the minister for health, has ordered 1m doses to “protect” a quarter of the population against the flu pandemic.

Van, who has also treated patients with Sars, the respiratory condition linked to birds, said avian flu had a frightening effect on its victims and the only way to keep patients alive was to “support” all their vital organs, including the liver and kidneys, with modern technology such as ventilators and dialysis machines.

Van would not criticise governments for stockpiling Tamiflu but said doctors had to explain its limitations. Roche, the company that makes Tamiflu, has sold stockpiles of the drug to 40 countries and insists there is clear evidence it will protect against a future flu virus. However, it stresses the drug must be given within 48 hours to be effective.

“Laboratory studies show that Tamiflu is effective against all strains of flu,” said Bill Hall, director of the National Virus Reference Laboratory, who defended Ireland’s stockpiling of Tamiflu and other flu treatments. “The only limitation is when it is not administered within the first 24 hours of onset of symptoms.”

The WHO admitted (changed to "has acknowledge" by UPI) Tamiflu had not been widely successful in humans. “However, we believe in many Asian countries it hasn’t been used until late in the illness,” a spokesman said.(changed to "but said it believes it would have been more effective in many Asian countries if it had been used earlier in the illness." by UPI)

<http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,2087-1903180,00.html>

UPI's "cherry picked" version <http://www.upi.com/NewsTrack/view.php?StoryID=20051203-094414-4342r>

Here's a good definition and explanation of Plagiarism
<http://gervaseprograms.georgetown.edu/hc/plagiarism.html>

So, do you call this good and credible Journalism? This IS one of the major problems with the media today. Now this BS UPI story has been picked up by almost all the RW "news" websites, adding to the confusion and distrust of the News.

I'm not even going to get into the fact that they are trying to pass off One (1) Doctors opinion as a "Report," That's a another issue, which other might want to get into, but I don't, I'm talking about bogus and unethical journalism here.

I haven't gone through the rest of "Big News Network" yet, to see if they edited or changed any of the credible newswire articles, but if not, they are most likely there to give the site a little credibility. At the very least, BNN is now as site that shows little concern for journalistic ethics. I will not say the BNN was NEVER a good, credible news site, but posting this article clearly shows that they are part of the problem and are helping to spread Bogus News.

As you said, "...All news is suspect these days and its a propoganda tool...
America is using propoganda in Iraq news with our tax dollars..."

I agree, that is why we all must be vigilant in checking the source of all stories that we post here, otherwise we all end up looking like a foolish and ill informed bunch of LW wackos.

I'm not going lie and tell you that I haven't posted a few news items that I later regretted, I have, and I'm not trying to criticize you here, I'm just trying to do my small part of trying to stop bogus info from gaining credibility here.

[lovuian]

69. Up2 late we are definitely on the same page... Great research

on the sources and great job at keeping us on our toes...

But as a medical personell person myself the governments are scrambling at why they have spent millions on Tamiflu

when its supposed effectiveness is within the first 48 hours

thats in the profession a shot in the dark cause symptoms can be simply allergies or cold or Avian Flu

are we on every sniffle going to take TamiFlu???

I think we will see unfortunately how well this government protection that they haved paid millions for is going to be effective!!!

[reprobate]

55. Is it just coincidence this is all happening under Boy Bush?

[Maddy McCall]

68. I hope all of the hoarding hoglets are reading this.

LOL. Gotta hurt to know you spent $1500 on medicine that is only good for one year, and won't combat the bird flu.

:rofl:

[Mojorabbit]

73. Actually, it is good for five years

http://www.thejakartapost.com/detaileditorial.asp?fileid=20051206.F03&irec=3


The writer also questions the efficacy of Tamiflu in influenza A and B infections, and the safety of Tamiflu. Two large data sets presented in September at the second European Influenza Conference in Malta (www.eswi.org) address unequivocally these questions.

A large U.S. study of more than 176,000 patients showed that oseltamivir significantly reduced the risk of pneumonia by 32 percent and of death by 91 percent. Additionally, in Canadian patients with laboratory-confirmed influenza (A or B) requiring hospital admission, oseltamivir reduced the risk of death by 68 percent.

Elsewhere, a recent large-scale study examined the effectiveness of oseltamivir in protecting family members who had come in contact with a person infected with flu: oseltamivir protected about 80 percent of contacts from flu infection.

Regarding the reported 12 deaths in Japanese children treated with Tamiflu, the FDA Advisory Committee affirmed on Nov. 27 (surely after the writer submitted his article) the safety of Tamiflu in children. This was followed on Dec. 2 by the confirmation of the Japanese Pediatric Society, which established no links between the deaths and Tamiflu.

It was also reported that of the 24.5 million people in Japan who have used Tamiflu since 2000, 11.6 million (47 percent) were children. The death rate under Tamiflu (1/1000,000) was lower than the rate of mortality in children infected with influenza (2/1000,000).

Given its beneficial effects on the treatment and prevention of influenza, the prevention of complications and hospitalizations, and on overall patient mortality, WHO experts and others around the world have decided there is definite wisdom in stockpiling oseltamivir as part of governmental pandemic preparedness plans.

[Media_Lies_Daily]

76. I'm sorry, but being protected by Tamiflu against the effects of any...

...previous/current variant of A or B influenza will NOT be even a remote guarantee of ANY protection against the variant of the H5N1 influenza that will eventually emerge, sooner or later, as an efficient human-to-human transmitter of the virus.

Once that particular H5N1 variant emerges, it will be a furious race against time to develop an effective vaccine from that variant (approximately six months), and then to actually put that vaccine into production (another six months to a year) in the quantities necessary to protect the most amount of people. As of this point in time, we absolutely do NOT have the capability to produce enough doses of a new vaccine to protect evan a small percentage of Americans.

From what I've read of the effects of H5N1 on humans in Vietnam and China, those falling victim to the disease have been primarily victims of what's known as a "cytokine storm". This event takes place as the body's immune system overwhelmingly attacks the virus in the body causing the lungs to fail as they fill with fluid.

Additionally, Tamiflu is NOT a vaccine, and will not act as such. IMHO, it appears that some posters are getting confused on that point.

One final comment...after watching the NeoCon Junta in action against Katrina, Rita, and Wilma, who could trust this group to act quickly to save American lives in the face of a pandemic?

[Mojorabbit]

77. I am aware that tamiflu is not a vaccine

Right now it is the only thing that MIGHT work. My hubby is a physician and we do have tamiflu stocked at home. If he is expected to work during a pandemic I am not going to count on the gov to supply him with it.
They have nowhere enough to supply first responders as it is and yu can be sure that govt officials and their families will be first in line for distribution of it. Being that supportive care is all that will be able to be done for those with this flu if it comes I am not at all sure that I want him to go in and work at all. That is my selfish side. I don't want to lose him when in the end there is not a whole lot he will be able to do for those who get it.

[stickdog]

71. Wow! Then stockpiling it would be truly Rumsfeldian! (nt)

[Name removed]

80. Deleted message

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