French violence enters 10th night

[skooooo]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4411192.stm

Urban violence in France has entered a 10th night, with fresh arson attacks in suburbs of Paris and elsewhere.
Reports say that the Essonne region south of the capital and the southwestern city of Toulouse are the latest to be affected.

The attacks came as the French authorities said they were determined to stop the unrest.

Interior Minister Nicolas Sarkozy warned of stiffer jail sentences for arsonists following Friday's damage.

[anotherdrew]

1. so when do the mass deportations start?

We're not hearing much about the general populations opinions on these events... I can't believe that this isn't going to spark a huge backlash. These riots are surely NOT going to result in these people being treated "better." They are asking for a one way ticket to northern africa or elsewhere.

Who knows tho, maybe good will come of this, but France can be very mean spirited when this kind of thing goes down, look at Hatti, they still haven't forgiven that revolution.

[skooooo]

2. Here are some residents' opinions..

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/spl/hi/picture_gallery/05/europe_paris_riot_suburb_residents/html/1.stm

[meganmonkey]

3. Thank you for the link

Very interesting :thumbsup:

[GrumpyGreg]

5. They all seem quite sorry for themselves---one of them even thinks

youth clubs would help. Youth clubs?

My great- grandparents faced the "No Irish need apply" signs but they didn't riot in the streets,they worked like dogs.

[tocqueville]

10. thank you for this one

these guys live on welfare (free housing, free medical care and an allowance of around $400 a month). Most of them don't want to take a job and find that stealing or drug dealing is more profitable.

The racial argument is an excuse to keep on undisturbed with "the good life". It's true that around 20% are unemployed in those neighbourhoods (which means that 80 % are) and it's true that there is racism and prejudice. But the primary reason for the violence is criminal activity, not social issues.

[wookie294]

18. The Irish certainly did riot in the streets of America

A little Googling the subject will reveal this!

[Tomee450]

30. But maybe these youth

would work like dogs if they had jobs. That's the problem, no work. Having so many young people with no hope for the future is a dangerous situation.

[smirkymonkey]

6. Great link - very insightful and it's good to hear it from the

perspective of the residents vs. the media.

[tocqueville]

8. why is the police "hassling" them ?

because they sell drugs, which they often forget to mention. And regarding the death of the two teens, the police wasn't chasing them, but other guys. They went into the transformator station because they probably had something to hide.

Even if some of the rioters express justified resentment, the ones causing real damage, pouring gasoline on passengers in busses and setting fire, setting factories ablaze, are criminals wanting to win a territory war against the authorities...

so far the only winner is the extreme right. And the left complaining about the government's "tough repression" is only helping the same far right.

[skooooo]

9. How do you know...

.."they" sell drugs? How many of them do you think really sell drugs?

[tocqueville]

11. ask anybody in France, read any newspaper, watch any TV

my neighbourhood really turned into a place like that last year. It was through a massive police intervention it went back to normal. When the crack dealers were in jail. Or was it a coincidence ?

[skooooo]

13. I did see a french police..

...claim that the mayhem was to keep the police out so that some individuals can deal their drugs. Most of the people have to be innocent though.

[Obamarama]

19. Bonjour, tocqueville. I agree with your comments....

I have visited Paris multiple times in my lifetime and spent a year studying at the American University. When I was there last autumn, I came to the conclusion that things in these suburbs had devolved quite a bit in recent years.

I was driving back from Pierrefond and Compiegne on the A1. There was a massive accident on the periphique, so I attempted to take a shortcut and got lost in the area of Romainville. It was after dark and I ended up going into some scary areas. People were looking at me like "what the hell are you doing here?" I eventually found a way onto the A3.

I had never feared for my safety before in all the years I have visited Paris. Chirac needs to do something to avert this.

[CHIMO]

24. I Guess

That we would agree that there is a problem.

[tocqueville]

4. you cannot deport French citizens

and 90% of the population of these suburbs is pissed at the rioters

[anotherdrew]

20. let's hope they don't borrow any tricks from bush

now in the US, citizenship can be revoked at any time and even legal immigrants are deported on just one felony conviction. Even people who's parents brought them to the US as babies and they've lived here all their lives are being deported to countries they've never known and don't speak the language of.

I hope France doesn't lower itself to such tactics.

[Pooka Fey]

22. Does being born in France confer automatic citizenship?

Do children born in France become French citizens regardless of the immigration status (legal or illegal) of the parents - like in the U.S.A.?

[tocqueville]

28. yes and these guys are mostly second and third generation

immigrants from naturalized parents

[skooooo]

7. French Police Arrest 250 As Arson Grows

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory?id=1284651&CMP=OTC-RSSFeeds0312



ACHERES, France Nov 5, 2005 — Youths armed with gasoline bombs fanned out from Paris' poor, troubled suburbs to shatter the tranquility of leafier towns, torching 900 vehicles, a nursery school and other targets Saturday in the worst wave of arson since the urban violence began more than a week ago.

Police deployed a helicopter and small teams of officers to chase down youths who sped from one attack to another in cars and on motorbikes. The new security tactics yielded more than 250 arrests during the ninth straight night of unrest.

The violence originally concentrated in neighborhoods northeast of Paris with large immigrant populations is forcing France to confront anger long-simmering in its suburbs, where many Africans and their French-born children live on society's margins, struggling with unemployment, poor housing, racial discrimination, crime and a lack of opportunity.

[Flagg]

12. We're saved

KADHAFI OFFERS HELP OVER FRENCH RIOTS

Received Saturday, 5 November 2005 19:01:00 GMT
TRIPOLI, Nov 5 (AFP) - Libyan leader Moamer Kadhafi called French President Jacques Chirac Saturday to express his concern about rioting in Paris suburbs and other parts of France, the official Jana news agency said.
It said Chirac thanked Kadhafi for his interest and reassured him that the situation was under control.
Kadhafi was reported saying Libya was "disposed to help France overcome these events," which he described as "regrettable."
The report did not outline what kind of aid might have been forthcoming.
French authorities Saturday stepped up police action against youths responsible for more than a week of urban riots, in which hundreds of vehicles were set alight, as suspicions grew that gangs were becoming increasingly organized.

http://www.ttc.org/200511051901.ja5j1rh18137.htm

[skooooo]

14. lol..strange...

Can you imagine?

[skooooo]

15. Paris seeks "hidden hands" in riots

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=worldNews&storyID=2005-11-05T162250Z_01_SCH558929_RTRUKOC_0_US-FRANCE-RIOTS-BLAME.xml

AULNAY-SOUS-BOIS, France (Reuters) - With every night that France's rundown suburbs burn, officials grow increasingly convinced that drug traffickers and Islamist militants are using frustrated youths to challenge law and order here.

Many people who watch their cars, shops and schools go up in flames, however, are not buying it. They blame unemployment, racial prejudice and widespread youth boredom for the outbursts.

Finding "hidden hands" behind the unrest seems like trying to catch the rioters as they rampage through the night. Some may get caught, but far more slip away in the darkness.

"Everybody is fed up seeing our town and our district trampled over daily by these organized gangs," declared Gerard Gaudron, conservative mayor of the northeastern Paris suburb of Aulnay-sous-Bois after an hour-long march against violence.

[wookie294]

29. The CIA has financed similar unrest in the past

Zbigniew Brzezinski not long ago revealed that on July 3, 1979, unknown to the American public and Congress, President Jimmy Carter secretly authorized $500 million to create an international terrorist movement that would spread Islamic fundamentalism in Central Asia and "de-stabilise" the Soviet Union...

The CIA called this Operation Cyclone and in the following years poured $4 billion into setting up Islamic training schools in Pakistan (Taliban means "student").

Young zealots were sent to the CIA's spy training camp in Virginia, where future members of al-Qaeda were taught "sabotage skills" - terrorism.

Others were recruited at an Islamic school in Brooklyn, New York, within sight of the fated Twin Towers.

In Pakistan, they were directed by British MI6 officers and trained by the SAS.

More here...

http://rense.com/general31/cyc.htm

[anotherdrew]

32. good point

but I'd source those points somewhere else than rense

[Flagg]

16. Another 2 schools set ablaze by the "rioters"

PARIS, France (CNN) -- Rioting in France raged for a 10th straight night Saturday, as arson fires burned in the central and southern parts of the nation, the Interior Ministry said.

Two schools in Grigny, south of Paris, were set ablaze and firefighters responded to 30 reports of arson in Toulouse, in southern France, the ministry said. Several cars were on fire and several trash cans were burning outside public buildings.

As of 11 p.m. (5 p.m. ET), 200 cars were set ablaze across the country, a cultural center in the central city of Nantes was destroyed by fire, and a youth hostel burned in Paris, the ministry said.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe/11/05/france.riots/index.html

[Endangered Specie]

17. I still dont know exactly why these riots are happening...

anyone know?

[Dancing_Dave]

21. Because the French Government now co-operates with Bush

And the Bush Administration's middle east policy.

When France and Germany gave up on their bid to form a European foreign policy seperate from Washington, this crisis became inevitable in Europe. It will not end until European governments clearly reject imperialist neo-con policies against the Islamic world.

[olebrowser]

23. I don't think you can lay this one on Bush

This is clearly an internal backlash to the job loses in France over the last twenty years. It's not about Bush, it's not about religion, It's not about race.

[Demoiselle]

25. This scares me. The French police impress me as being very very tough..

at least in Paris they all look young and very fit and very alert...like Marines. If they can't shut this down, I don't see how they're going to avoid sending in the army. What a sad and frightening thing.

[flannelmouth]

26. whistling past the graveyard

If you don't think that these riots won't be used by the rightwing to justify the wot you are dreaming. Most people that I run into think that kicking a little Muslim ass was why we went to Iraq in the first place. Payback time, ya know? And now these ungrateful rag heads are turning on the French who opposed Bush going to war. This whole thing is going to take everything else out of the headlines, mark my words. How bad can it get you ask? I watched the 1984 Olympics in Sarajevo. I watched in disbelief a few years later when the Muslims and Christians destroyed that country. WW1 and WW2 started in Europe, I'm afraid that WW3 is starting now!

[Catrina]

27. I just posted pretty much what you said

in another thread. I am certain Rush et al will screaming all next week about how the French refused to join the 'war on terror' and now look what's happening to them!! Makes me wonder who really is behind the whole thing.

[wookie294]

31. If France sent troops to Iraq, there would be no riots in Paris

LOL!