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NNN0LHI Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-25-03 07:54 AM
Original message
Basque government approves plan for autonomy from Spain
Trouble brewing here. Spain has its own little Chechnya.

http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/L25595633.htm

MADRID, Oct 25 (Reuters) - The Basque government approved on Saturday a controversial plan for autonomy for the northern region which Spain's central government has already said it will stop by whatever means necessary.

The Basque government said its proposal for a "free associated state" gave the region the right to determine its own sovereignty via a referendum and would end more than 30 years of separatist violence by the Basque guerrilla group ETA.

"We call on the sense of democracy of the Spanish people in order that the will of the majority of Basque society...can be respected," Juan Jose Ibarretxe, head of the Basque government, said after a special meeting of the regional cabinet.

However Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar's centre-right government said the plan "legitimised ETA terrorism".

more

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La_Serpiente Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-25-03 08:00 AM
Response to Original message
1. Oh Oh
Edited on Sat Oct-25-03 08:00 AM by La_Serpiente
this doesn't look good. Las Etarras (members of the ETA) will be pissed of the government intervenews.

The ETA just wants their own state. That's all. They are not going to kill anyone or anything. And besides, they speak a different language anyway. They speak either Euskerra and Catalan (I'm not sure which on it is).

They are just afraid to have a socialist type government next to them. It is irrational fear.
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July Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-25-03 08:22 AM
Response to Reply #1
2. All I can say is "Huh?"
Reality: As the article points out, ETA has killed more than 800 people in the last three decades. So where do you get "they are not going to kill anyone or anything"?

The language spoken in the Basque region is Euskera. Catalan is spoken in Catalonia, the region in which you find Barcelona.

As for "they are just afraid to have a socialist type government next to them," again, huh? The Spanish government is not socialist. As the article also points out, the main OPPOSITION party is the Socialist Party. However, even when the Socialists were in charge, Spain was not run as a socialist society.

ETA wants independence from Spain. It is not clear that most Basques want this, although there is considerable fear in the Basque region that keeps most people from challenging ETA. Once in a while an ETA killing riles people up enough to protest. Basques do want considerable autonomy at the very least -- they were repressed under Franco, and the Basque region and Catalonia have quite a bit of autonomy under the set-up put in place after Spain became democratic. I believe those two regions actually have more autonomy than the other regions of Spain.
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La_Serpiente Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-25-03 08:31 AM
Response to Reply #2
3. I thought they wanted an independent state?
Edited on Sat Oct-25-03 08:35 AM by La_Serpiente
They don't want to take over the Peninsula or anything. They've been abused by the Franco regime for at least 5 decades and many of their members have been killed. They were also stripped of their language due to Franco's insanity.

They are hardly the radicals that they were during the Franco regime.

But I was probably wrong about the province that wants independence. I thought a majority supported the ETA's goal of independence.
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July Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-25-03 08:51 AM
Response to Reply #3
4. ETA wants an independent state,
as I mentioned in my earlier post (I didn't say anything about taking over the Peninsula -- but please note that ETA killings have occurred all over Spain), but ETA is not the entire Basque population.

The Franco regime -- which has ended, didn't quite last FOUR decades, so I don't know where you get "at least five decades." The Basque language was suppressed (the "official" language under Franco was Spanish), but, like Catalan, survived, and since Franco's death and Spain's transition to democracy, the Basque language has flourished in the Basque country. It is not suppressed today.

ETA are radicals, still. The ordinary people who support the political party wanting independence may not be, but ETA is still killing people, to the outrage of many Spaniards, including many in the Basque region. There have been large protests over some of their murders.

Again, some Basques do want independence, some are fairly happy with the great deal of autonomy they have in their region. BUT, there is fear about speaking out against ETA. To do so is to put your life in danger. I don't know what the percentages are, but I believe those who want complete independence from Spain are in the minority (but may be a sizeable minority).
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La_Serpiente Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-25-03 09:02 AM
Response to Reply #4
5. Didn't he come to power at the end of the Spanish civil war?
OK, maybe I exaggerated, but it was a long time. He came to power in 1939 after he took over Madrid. Didn't he die two years after Picasso died which was in 1975 or 77? I'm not sure. but Three and a half decades is quite a while.

Yeah, it is not suppressed. They spoke it at the Olympics in 1992.

Now that you said it, I can see why they wouldn't want to become an independent nation. The ETA are probably totalitarians and are like Trostky and Stalinists.

Are you from Spain? I want to go to La Rioja for some wine.
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Seneca Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-25-03 10:52 AM
Response to Reply #5
6. Franco died in November of 1975
Or as they used to say on SNL's Weekend Update, "Francisco Franco is still dead".
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Dogmudgeon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-25-03 12:54 PM
Response to Original message
7. The Basque future of Europe (warning: long and rambling!)
Egun On!

Basque autonomy, and the eventual establishment of an independent Euzkadi, have been made almost inevitable by the last several decades of history. It is a surprise to see the first moves made right now, especially since I never thought Ibarretxe was all that radical, but as the Aussies say, "good on ya, mate!"

The ETA gets all the press, but the reality is that it is in decline. Most Basques don't like their dedication to blowing people up, and recently, they have been blowing themselves up, since most of the ETA's munitions experts have either been killed, imprisoned, or are hiding out in Ireland.

There are several BIG currents in the struggle for Basque independence that simply do not get press. While the Comunidad Autonoma Vasco (Basque Autonomous Community) -- the official title Spain uses for it -- is made up of three Basque provinces, there are actually seven Basque provinces. One of the slogans in the movement (which is composed of much more than just ETA) is Zazpiak Bat -- "The Seven make One". Kind of like E Pluribus Unum in this country. And there is pressure building in all of them.

The fourth Basque province is Navarre, which was a powerful independent republic (yes, a republic, not a kingdom) until about 1519, when the Castillians took over. Navarre didn't join the CAV because the southern half is owned lock-stock-and-barrel by rich Castillans. The northern Navarrese are very loyal Euskara, and much of the ETA's support is there.

The other three states are in France, collectively called Iparralde ("North Area") in Basque, and Department Pyrenees-Atlantique by the French. Before Navarre, there was another Basque state called Aquitania that extended halfway up the French coast and halfway in. So the actual area of Basque culture in Europe is approximately the size of modern Italy; and none of it is independently Basque.

The French also oppose Basque independence, but have been much more sly about it. Think about it -- an independent Euzkadi would reduce the size of France by some five percent, and Spain by as much as 15%. That's a major chunk of Europe. It's like losing five states from the USA and a Canadian province to a hypothetical country in North America.

The gasoline on the fire was that after WWI, both Spain and France marginalized Euzkadi and tried to turn the area into a large "white trash" ghetto by stocking it with factories, enforced urbanization, and economic redlining. The pre-Nazi Eurofascist politicians thought that the area and its people could be exploited for great gain at low cost. But since the largely agrarian population needed to be trained to an industrial lifestyle, capital investment, infrastructure, and schools were necessary. (Similar pressures were put on the Catalonians, Bretons, and Languedoc/Provencal people -- as well as African Americans here.) The result of this was to create an energized, radical, urban intelligentsia that now defines the Basques. And when Franco called on the Luftwaffe to teach those red Basques a lesson at Guernica, they defected en masse to an anarcho-syndicalist-socialist underground.

People also overlook the influence of Basque culture in Europe because much of it was appropriated by the French and the Spanish. Almost all the initial voyages to the New World were accomplished with money from the Basque members of the the European royal families; Queen Ysabela was one of them. The Basques were master mariners in that era, and had been actively exploring the New World for decades, having learned of it from the last of the Viking mariners, as well as the Irish mariners seeking new lands to which to spread the Gospel.

The French beret, for example, was a major appropriation of what the Basques consider their primary cultural icon, the txapela. It's still a sore point among them.

Even (or, should I say, especially) in the Latino community in this country, there are large chunks of Basque culture that remain. Family names like Ochoa and Echevarria and Bolivár are Navarrese; Peru and Cuba were areas of major Basque settlement. A secondary diaspora after WWI brought thousands of Basques to this country, most of them to Navada, California, and Idaho, giving us the Laxalt and Larramendi families, among others. (The Laxalts produced a U.S. senator and a novelist.)

And recently, puzzling artifacts found in the prehistoric caves in Basque country (places like Lascaux and Altamira) have been positively identified as being culturally "proto-Basque". The oldest flute ever discovered is unmistakably "Basque-oid" with its flared mouth. The Basques are basically the remnant of the peoples that once lived in Europe but were pushed out by the Aryan-Kurgan-Indo-European invaders about 5000 years ago.

Does it sounds like I am claiming that the Basques invented everything, like the Rooskies did in the 1950s? Well, I'm not. These are simply aspects of European culture that have been ignored because of the relative lack of political power the Basque people have had. But that power is increasing because the smokestack industries and normal schools established almost a hundred years ago have flowered into a major, well-funded, and highly literate "Silicon Valley" in Europe. The University of Donostia has been turning out computer scientists, engineers, physicists, biologists, and other scientists at a rate exceeding most of the rest of Europe.

So it is natural that there has been a recent development of interest in things Basque in Europe. The Germans seem especially enamored of them, possibly because of the love by German youth of punk rock and techno music, both of which have also absorbed much of the youth of Euskal Herria -- or what the Germans call Baskenland. Basque polymath musician Kepa Junkera is all but unknown in the USA, but European audiophiles place him in the same pantheon as Brian Eno and Serge Gainsbourg.

These are some of the reasons why I think that Basque people will eventually have a fully independent state, one that will be a major leader in the EEC and the world from its first day of freedom. The area is rich, its people are well-educated, ambitious, and progressive politically and socially.

If I had to guess, I'd give it about ten years. It's happening that fast. The only way the Spanish and French can keep the genie in the bottle is by force of arms, and not even Aznar wants to risk yet another genocide in Europe. France is much more progressive today than it was under Petain and DeGaulle, and many of the French at least sentimentally support the Basque cause. So no, I don't think this will turn into a Chechnya, though Señor Boosh will certainly stick his jackass nose into the matter.

So. what's my txakur in this fight? None, really, and it embarrasses me that I'm skating so close to wannabe status. I once had an ethnic Basque girlfriend, and another friend of mine wrote one of the few instructional books on the language in English (Joseph Conroy, Hippocrene Conversational Basque Phrasebook.) This past summer, after reading about the closing of the major Basque newspaper Egunkaria because of Aznar's paranoia, I started studying the language. Of course, I learned a lot more than I bargained for.

The Euskaldun are a people worth keeping an eye on. They will soon emerge as major players on the world scene.

--bkl

Want to know more about Euskal Herria and all things Basque?
Read Buber's (Pedro Blas Uberruaga's) Basque Pages at http://www.buber.net/Basque/ -- it's all there. Every imaginable link, and Buber keeps most of 'em fresh.
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Dogmudgeon Donating Member (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore Sat Oct-25-03 01:26 PM
Response to Original message
8. From Berria (Basque newspaper and net feed)
http://www.berria.info/english/ikusi.php?id=123

It looks like the Aznar government is taking steps to eventually try Ibarretxe and the rest of his political party for treason, or something similar.

Also see http://www.behatokia.org/txostenak/BEHATOKIA%20NEWSLETTER%206%20SPECIAL.pdf -- it seems that the Spanish government had been "cracking down" again lately, and the Ibarretxistas decided it was time to take action.

--bkl

------

Spanish Government prepared to take legal measures

It regards the proposal which the Autonomous Community Government will be approving today as a “challenge” to all Spanish people

Agencies – MADRID

The Spanish Government says it is prepared to respond to the proposal of the Government of the BAC “with whatever legal and political initiatives are necessary at each moment.” In an appearance after the cabinet meeting the government spokesman, Eduardo Zaplana, read out the official declaration regarding the plan (1) of Juan Jose Ibarretxe on the excuse that the codified text is scheduled to be approved today.

The declaration, however, not only regards the proposal as a “challenge” to the Spanish Government, but a “challenge” to all the Spanish people. So the Government is “demanding a response from the whole of the society and the solidarity of all Spanish people: of the economic and social bodies, of the intellectuals, of the associations and platforms promoting freedom and of the political parties based on democratic and constitutional values.” Zaplana added: “it aims to take away the Spanish people’s status as sole holder of national sovereignty.” The Spanish Government spokesman did not specifically mention changing and beefing up the Criminal Code, but only said they were prepared to take “the necessary legal measures”. However, Jesus Caldera, the spokesman for the PSOE (Spanish Socialist Party) in the Spanish Lower House did bring up the subject and appealed for “calm” after emphasising that they were prepared to debate the matter.

Despite the fact that the day before yesterday Patxi Lopez, the secretary general of the PSE-EE (the Spanish Socialist Party’s wing in the BAC), had said that it would be a “terrible mistake” to change the Criminal Code in order to oppose Ibarretxe’s plan, Caldera’s declarations yesterday indicated quite the opposite. “We will always be prepared to enter into a debate of this kind and to give a response of this nature, but the right moment has to be found,” he pointed out. “This is because calm, prudence and an analysis beforehand are needed to implement such a serious change.”


(1) “The New Political Agreement for Coexistence”: a pact based on free association with the Spanish State and shared sovereignty first presented on 27-09-02. (See news item of 27/09/03 of this English Edition). (bkl note: European dates are in the format day-month-year, so 27-09-02 is 9 September 2002)
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