Martinez warns of Chavez populism spreading

[barbaraann]

Sen. Mel Martinez delivered a hard-hitting speech warning of a 'dangerous relationship' between Hugo Chávez and Fidel Castro.

By PABLO BACHELET
[e-mail]

Sen. Mel Martinez warned on Friday that unless the United States adopts a more comprehensive and active approach toward Latin America, the region risks sliding into "populist Chavismo, anti-American sentiment."

The Florida Republican has previously voiced his concerns that the administration was doing too little for the region, but his remarks to The Herald's annual Americas Conference at the Biltmore Hotel, via a videoconference hookup with his office in Washington, were especially blunt and detailed.
...
''We are already seeing the problem of radical ideology spread like a virus in a triangle of Chávez, Castro and populism,'' said the senator, who has been taking an increasingly higher profile on Latin American issues.
...
The Bush administration has been reluctant to give Latin America more aid, although it is giving hundreds of millions of dollars to Nicaragua and Honduras, among the hemisphere's poorest countries.
...
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/12788310.htm

Populism (from dictionary.com): A political philosophy supporting the rights and power of the people in their struggle against the privileged elite.

[Qibing Zero]

1. Mel Martinez is scum

..as if we all didn't already know it, especially those of us in FL.

[struggle4progress]

63. I really hope Martinez's brain fungus isn't contagious. eom

[ShockediSay]

64. "populist Chavismo, anti-American sentiment"

is going to put Martinez in the minority in '06.

Why?

Because the alternative, what we have now, is government in the hands of elitist super wealth, often ill gotten.

[1932]

2. And why is this bad?

Even Colin Powell says, "Poverty, environmental degradation and despair are destroyers of people, of societies, of nations. This unholy trinity can destabilize countries, even entire regions."

[barbaraann]

3. Because being anti-populism is being pro-elite.

i.e. oligarchy

[damntexdem]

56. And Chavez is not only a populist:

he's one with major resources that he has said he will use to help the rest of Latin America. He is not anti-American, however, he is anti-Bushista. He dings Dubya in major speeches, then sends extra gasoline to an America reeling from Katrina and Rita.

And I just got my CITGO credit card today, although I already filled up there. Join the CITGO buycott! Support Venezuela and Chavez!

[dkofos]

16. And you see where that got him

[NEOBuckeye]

30. Funny, the US itself is beginning to really suffer from all 3 of these.

Powell may be onto something. I think we're headed for breakdown and collapse.

We're already in what I consider to be "pre-revolutionary" times.

[1932]

31. Yep. It's like the corporatocracy realized they were making so much $

exploiting the developing world that they decided, 'what the hell, let's use these same techniques on Americans!"

[Dhampir Kampf]

58. I agree

Populism sounds like the BEST thing for this region, and it's, 'a threat to america?"

[stepnw1f]

4. Is This A Threat Again by the Reicht Wing?

Keep it up my Fruity Fascists! Keep it up. You make our jobs soooo much easier!

[bemildred]

5. Dangerous to whom, Mr. Martinez? That's the question.

I doubt that Mr. Chavez represents a threat to me or anyone
I know. And what exactly is it that Mr. Chavez might do?
Can we expect the Venezuelan Legions to be landing in the
ruins of New Orleans soon?

[TheFarseer]

18. no but expect them to be linked to drug terrorism soon

It's the next logical step. Also expect them to be linked to any anti-ruling government movements in South and Central America.

[sarcasmo]

35. Just like the CIA , is that what your saying.

[VegasWolf]

20. Well said, "Dangerous to whom?" nt

[Cha]

25. Brilliant! Why to him and his

ilk, of course!

Watch out mel martinez..the big bad, rich, Democratically elected President of Venezuela is comin' to get ya! BOO!

Go hide under the bed with bush.

[natrat]

40. exactly

how is giving cheap oil to poor americans a threat

[damntexdem]

57. Nope, no legions.

But I wouldn't be surprised to see aid arriving in NO from Chavez.

[Vickers]

6. Wait, the guy whose aide got drunk and claimed she worked for Nelson?

:rofl:

[barbaraann]

7. Populism: bad Getting drunk: good

Remember, the GOP is the party of moral values!

[IChing]

14. Yes the same neo-fascist, I mean neo-con

Notice he is using the disease (virus) conniption used by the fascists to describe a certain group about 70 years ago?

[IndianaGreen]

15. Yep, that's the same guy

that hired the drunken tart.

[Cha]

27. She wasn't drunk enough to

lose her fear of getting reamed for working for martinez.

[Missy M]

8. Martinez using the same old rhetoric we have been hearing for...

so long. We the people can decide for ourselves and so can the people of Latin America. News flash for Mr. Martinez, there has been anti-American sentiment in Latin America for a long, long time.

[Judi Lynn]

9. Mel Martinez is Bush's idiot Cuban puppet. He says what he thinks

_Bush would like him to say, nothing else. He has always been in the _Bush back pocket.



He's also the one who "treated" for little hostage Elián Gonzalez's publicity trip to DisneyWorld on a sunny day he should have been going home to his own dad. What a hero!

[gtar100]

39. Oh My Eyes!!! I'm feeling nauseous...

The sickening decay of the human spirit is too much to look upon!!

Arrgghh!

[tocqueville]

10. populism is not a positive word

'Populism' is a political philosophy or rhetorical style that holds that the common person is oppressed by the elite in society, and that the instruments of the State need to be grasped from this self-serving elite and used for the benefit and advancement of the people as a whole. A populist reaches out to ordinary people, talking about their economic and social concerns, and appealing to their common sense. Most scholarship on populism since 1980 has discussed it as a rhetorical style that can be used to promote a variety of ideologies.

Individual populists have variously promised to stand up to corporate power, remove "corrupt" elites, and "put people first." Populism incorporates anti-regime politics and sometimes nationalism or racism. Many populists appeal to a specific region or a specific social class such as the working class, middle class, or farmers. Often they employ dichotomous rhetoric, and claim to represent the majority.

Modern populism, of all political hues

Populism is alive and well in various countries around the world. Examples of populists in the contemporary era include:

Pauline Hanson in Australia
Winston Peters in New Zealand
Jean-Marie Le Pen in France
Carl I. Hagen in Norway
Jerry Brown, Pat Buchanan, Howard Dean, Jim Hightower, Jesse Jackson, Dennis Kucinich, Cynthia McKinney, Ralph Nader, Ross Perot, Bernie Sanders and George Wallace in the United States.
Aung San Suu Kyi in Burma/Myanmar
Silvio Berlusconi, Umberto Bossi and Alessandra Mussolini in Italy
Nelson Mandela in South Africa
Jörg Haider in Austria
Viktor Orbán in Hungary
Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva in Brazil
Pim Fortuyn in the Netherlands
Preston Manning, Mike Harris and Ralph Klein in Canada
Hugo Chávez in Venezuela
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad in Iran.

It should also be noted, however, that not all politicians who adopt a populist campaign are in fact true populists. Some politicians adopting the rhetoric and language of populism are criticized for using populist rhetoric merely as an organizing tactic without any actual intent of standing up for common people.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Populism

[barbaraann]

17. Lumping Chavez and Haider of Austria together is just WRONG.

There is a huge difference between a populist and a demagogue.

Demagogue, from dictionary.com:
1. A leader who obtains power by means of impassioned appeals to the emotions and prejudices of the populace.
2. A leader of the common people in ancient times.

[tocqueville]

21. well if you look at the list you'll find

Le Pen and Howard Dean - and Mandela among others. Fortuyn was a neo-fascist.

In European terminology a populist is practically synonym with a demagogue (several languages). Galloway can be considered as a populist.

The idea is that most of populists even the well intended ones fall sooner or later into demagogery.

[barbaraann]

22. I do agree that a populist can become a demagogue.

But I don't think that's it's inevitable.

[Cha]

28. A lot of reports I read said

that Al Gore ran a "populist" campaign.

[reorg]

45. how about the historic populism

from which the term originates? The incredibly shallow Wikipedia article hardly even mentions it at all, nor does it examine the viewpoint (which happens to be its very own) from where "populism" is interchangeably left or right wing, merely some kind of modus operandi for demagogues.


"This is Your Story - The Progressive Story of America. Pass It On." by Bill Moyers

>> (...)

You are the heirs of one of the country's great traditions – the progressive movement that started late in the l9th century and remade the American experience piece by piece until it peaked in the last third of the 20th century. I call it the progressive movement for lack of a more precise term. Its aim was to keep blood pumping through the veins of democracy when others were ready to call in the mortician. Progressives exalted and extended the original American revolution. They spelled out new terms of partnership between the people and their rulers. And they kindled a flame that lit some of the most prosperous decades in modern history, not only here but in aspiring democracies everywhere, especially those of western Europe.

Step back with me to the curtain-raiser, the founding convention of the People's Party – better known as the Populists – in 1892. The members were mainly cotton and wheat farmers from the recently reconstructed South and the newly settled Great Plains, and they had come on hard, hard times, driven to the wall by falling prices for their crops on one hand and racking interest rates, freight charges and supply costs on the other. This in the midst of a booming and growing industrial America. They were angry, and their platform – issued deliberately on the 4th of July – pulled no punches. "We meet," it said, "in the midst of a nation brought to the verge of moral, political and material ruin....Corruption dominates the ballot box, the legislatures and the Congress and touches even the bench.....The newspapers are largely subsidized or muzzled, public opinion silenced....The fruits of the toil of millions are boldly stolen to build up colossal fortunes for a few."

... their opposition wasn't simply to government as such. It was to government's power to confer privilege on insiders; on the rich who were democracy's equivalent of the royal favorites of monarchist days. (It's what the FCC does today.) The Populists knew it was the government that granted millions of acres of public land to the railroad builders. It was the government that gave the manufacturers of farm machinery a monopoly of the domestic market by a protective tariff that was no longer necessary to shelter "infant industries." It was the government that contracted the national currency and sparked a deflationary cycle that crushed debtors and fattened the wallets of creditors. And those who made the great fortunes used them to buy the legislative and judicial favors that kept them on top. So the Populists recognized one great principle: the job of preserving equality of opportunity and democracy demanded the end of any unholy alliance between government and wealth. It was, to quote that platform again, "from the same womb of governmental injustice" that tramps and millionaires were bred.

But how? How was the democratic revolution to be revived? The promise of the Declaration reclaimed? How were Americans to restore government to its job of promoting the general welfare? And here, the Populists made a breakthrough to another principle. In a modern, large-scale, industrial and nationalized economy it wasn't enough simply to curb the government's outreach. That would simply leave power in the hands of the great corporations whose existence was inseparable from growth and progress. The answer was to turn government into an active player in the economy at the very least enforcing fair play, and when necessary being the friend, the helper and the agent of the people at large in the contest against entrenched power. So the Populist platform called for government loans to farmers about to lose their mortgaged homesteads – for government granaries to grade and store their crops fairly – for governmental inflation of the currency, which was a classical plea of debtors – and for some decidedly non-classical actions like government ownership of the railroad, telephone and telegraph systems and a graduated – i.e., progressive tax on incomes and a flat ban on subsidies to "any private corporation." And to make sure the government stayed on the side of the people, the 'Pops' called for the initiative and referendum and the direct election of Senators.

Predictably, the Populists were denounced, feared and mocked as fanatical hayseeds ignorantly playing with socialist fire. (...) <<


From "This is Your Story - The Progressive Story of America. Pass It On." by Bill Moyers

http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0610-11.htm

[barbaraann]

48. Great article. Thank you!

Bill Moyers is such a treasure.

[cosmicdot]

55. that's now bookmarked

"Step back with me to the curtain-raiser, the founding convention of
the People's Party – better known as the Populists – in 1892 ...
<snip>

"Corruption dominates the ballot box, the legislatures and
the Congress and touches even the bench.....The newspapers are
largely subsidized or muzzled, public opinion silenced....The fruits
of the toil of millions are boldly stolen to build up colossal
fortunes for a few..." <snip>

"Mark Hanna – Karl Rove's hero – saw to it that first Ohio and then
Washington were 'ruled by business...by bankers, railroads and
public utility corporations'." <snip>

[Gman]

11. Let's look at the definition of "populism"

pop·u·lism   Audio pronunciation of "populism" ( P )  Pronunciation Key
 (ppy-lzm)
n.

   1.
         1. A political philosophy supporting the rights and power of the
 people in their struggle against the privileged elite.
         2. The movement organized around this philosophy.
   2. Populism The philosophy of the Populist Party.

Populism is a bad thing? That Martinez' remark can only be made by a member of the "privileged elite". Martinez' remark can only be made by someone scared of what could happen to him if populism is allowed to grow.

[tocqueville]

24. read my post

and you'll see that the definition of populism is far more ambiguous

[0007]

12. Martinez doesn't speak for the down trodden

or the folks that are interested in education and medicine. Cuba has made great gains that the US should be looking at, instead of trying to spread hatred and telling counties who they should and should not do business with.

For the sake of time, I will outline just a few figures for Latin America as a whole as compared to Cuba.

- Illiteracy rate: Latin America, 11.7%; Cuba, 0.2%

- Inhabitants per teacher: Latin America, 98.4; Cuba, 43, in other words, 2.3 times as many teachers per capita

- Primary education enrolment ratio: Latin America, 92%; Cuba, 100%

- Secondary education enrolment ratio: Latin America, 52%; Cuba, 99.7%

- Primary school students reaching Fifth Grade: Latin America, 76%; Cuba, 100%

- Infant mortality per thousand live births: Latin America, 32; Cuba, 6.2

- Medical doctors per hundred thousand inhabitants: Latin America, 160; Cuba, 590

- Dentists per hundred thousand inhabitants: Latin America, 63; Cuba, 89

- Nurses per hundred thousand inhabitants: Latin America, 69; Cuba, 743

- Hospital beds per 100 thousand inhabitants: Latin America, 220;
Cuba, 631.6

- Medically attended births: Latin America, 86.5%; Cuba, 100%

- Life expectancy at birth: Latin America, 70 years; Cuba, 76 years

- Population between 15 and 49 years of age infected with HIV/AIDS: Latin America, 0.5%; Cuba, 0.05%

- Annual AIDS infection rate per million inhabitants, i.e. those who develop the disease: Latin America, 65.25; Cuba, 15.6

- The first international study of the Latin American Laboratory of Evaluation of educational quality, carried out in 12 Latin American countries including Cuba, produced the following results. Although these data have been already mentioned, I would like to briefly refer to them in detail:

- In Language, 3rd Grade: Cuba, 85.74 points; the remaining 11 countries, 59.11 points

- In Language, 4th Grade: Cuba, 87.25; the rest, 63.75

- In Mathematics, 3rd Grade: Cuba, 87.75; the rest, 58.31

- In Mathematics, 4th Grade: Cuba, 88.25; the rest, 62.04

What is or will be the future of those countries?

Perhaps Martinez should take another view and work for the good of humanity, instead of George W. Bush!!

[IndianaGreen]

13. The Cuban Nazi has spoken!

the region risks sliding into "populist Chavismo, anti-American sentiment."


The only good thing about the Iraq War is that Bush no longer has the military muscle to impose his will on Latin America. Bush has made Karl Marx relevant to a new generation of political activists in what was considered to be Uncle Sam's private whorehouse.

The "anti-Americanism" that Mel Martinez warns about is one that I fully support and share. This "anti-Americanism" is not hatred of the American people, but hatred of the American government and its policies.

Viva Chavez! Abajo con Bush!

[TankLV]

33. "Chavismo"???!!!!! Now that's a new one!

I wonder how long they all sat around in the dark recesses of their monkey bar before some idiot came up with that?

[Dover]

19. Is it Chavez's populism or popularism that has them worried?

I would suggest that next to Bushco fascism, just about ANYTHING else looks pretty darn good. The elite must be in a panic.

[Cha]

23. Yeah, mel martinez..do you even know

what "populism" means..you ignorant catupulter? Or are you just blowin' smoke outta your ass?

OR..do you know damn well what it means and you wanna give the meaning a bad connotation like the word "Liberal"? You sneaky sly gargoyle.

[barbaraann]

26. I searched for populism in Google News.

There were too many VERY interesting results for me to post just one or two. However, it does look like the next victim of GOP propaganda might just well be the concept of populism.

If they pervert every word that we have to describe goodness in humanity, then maybe they will destroy any chance we have to achieve that goodness. :-(

[Cha]

29. It's time for those Blood Suckers

to start reaping what they sow. I know they've given "compassionate" a Bad Name..and "Mission Accomplished" will always mean.."bush preens in a codpiece and all Holy Hell breaks lose in Iraq"!

[muriel_volestrangler]

37. What is your concept of populism?

And how do you think the GOP is trying to change the concept?

I ask because there is a wide range of politicians that have been described as 'populist' - see Tocqueville's post #10. Few people, if any, would describe them all as 'good'.

[barbaraann]

38. My concept of populism is a government that

TRULY represents ordinary people. The wikipedia article does not represent my idea of populism.

The GOP has perverted the meaning of so many words (freedom, peace, compassion, etc.) that I'm just guessing they plan on perverting every word that reflects goodness.

[natrat]

42. librul

[muriel_volestrangler]

47. The question is whether it's doing good for the people

or just appealing to their immediate desires.

Disconnecting it from whether Chavez is a populist, there are a lot of right wing politicians to whom the word is applied - it's a crude measurement, but Google returns 33,700 results for "right wing populist", and only 854 for "left wing populist". Right wing populists are typically anti-immigration - with an undercurrent of racism. They appeal to a significant section of a population that feels hard done by, but say that it's the fault of immigrants taking the good jobs, or welfare. And the word is used far outside of the USA - the Republicans don't have control of it.

[TankLV]

34. Next thing you know, people will be demanding DEMOCRACY

you know, the th?ing that the DEMOCRATIC party gets its name from

[TankLV]

32. Oooo - I wish it would spread HERE - maybe then the WINNER of the election

you know - the person with the MOST VOTES - would be considered the WINNER! Now that would be radical!

Repukes can't have that, ever - how else would they stay in power?!!!

[mntleo2]

36. I (heart) Chavez

I am a low income indigenous woman who adores his message. I also love Brazil's Lula, even though he is getting hammered by us and has caved in to some of the things he stood up for. Chavez is my hero because he is one of the few with enough kahunas to stand up for the poor with no bones about it. Now he is going international with his message to we the poor that we can become empowered as well. For this he, has my heart.

If that makes him my demagogue so be it. He speaks to the poor and he knows there are far more of us than the elite. He knows if we voted, we would be the ones that ruled. I think our vast numbers terrifies the elite to death because they know, they can rig elections, belittle us and demonize us, use guns or whatever, but if you get us mad enough, NOTHING will stop us... The poor have little problem with wealth ~ as long as it does not take from the poor and middle class, which is happening in America at this time.

More and more of us are ready to rise up and take back our country by doing what Chavez did, making the 60% poor disenfranchised talk by their votes, which is far more the majority than the rest of the this country combined. When this happens (and it will happen) then there will be no more American corporate fascism, but a true democracy!!!!!! YES!!!!!



VIVE CHAVEZ!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Cat In Seattle <---who speaks to the poor about the importance of voting and often uses the example of Chavez in my talks

[Nostradamus]

41. The correct word is popular.

[raysr]

43. I know the why

but the US should just leave people the fuck alone!

[LynnTheDem]

44. The entire world is anti-American, and the UK & Canada are pals w Cuba

Gee, looks like only America. Must be the rest of the world that's on the wrong side.

Heh.

[malaise]

46. He should worry

after all watching governments put their citizens first and providing education, health care and protection from disasters is likely to be very popular with most of the world's poor. Don't let them hear about these things Mel. Convince them that the NOLA/Bennett model and the structural adjustment model are the way to go.

Edit - sp.

[shenmue]

49. Friendship bad!

Rrrrgghh! Thog smashey-smash!

:mad: :grr: :nuke:

If Martinez gets any further to the right, he's going to tip over.

And foreign aid beats what we gave them back in the Reagan era: death squads.

[Judi Lynn]

52. Any "foreign aid" Bush is giving them is going to Chavez' wealthy enemies

who have been working to overthrow him from his first day in office.

This money is arriving through grants handed out to their political groups by various groups disbursing American taxpayers' money. This allows them to organize and creat anti-Chavez programs without having to spend any of their own money, on our dime.:

Narco News: How much money is going into opposition groups every year from the U.S.?

Eva Golinger: This particular year, it's around $6 million. That's combined USAID and NED. We don't have the figures yet, but it probably will go up for fiscal year 2006, The State Department has already stated that they're going to increase it. President Bush, speaking before Congress in early February to justify the whole 2006 budget, actually specifically referred to the case of Venezuela and said he wanted to increase financing to political parties and civil society groups working for democracy - which is only the opposition in their eyes. But since 2001, the total calculated amount of financing is a little over $27 million. And that's just NED and USAID; it's not CIA.

Narco News: The NED part has been pretty well publicized. What is the USAID money going to?

Eva Golinger: That's because the NED is more specific as to who they're funding, whereas USAID - first of all, they censored out the names of all the recipients of the funding in the documents they gave me. But in general it's going to the same organizations that receive NED funding, but even more groups. In the case of Venezuela, others that have received financing include the Carter Center and the OAS for all the referendum activities. The OAS got like $100,000, but they also have their own funding. The Carter Center got $1.75 million. Pretty much all their activities in Venezuela were funded by USAID. Which is interesting.

Narco News: I guess that wasn't a very good investment on USAID's part.

Eva Golinger: Yeah. And others: IRI, the International Republican Institute, and NDI, the National Democratic Institute, also receive aid funding for work in Venezuela, which they then are giving out - and this is in some of the documents - to Súmate, and the other political parties, like Primera Justicia and Proyecto Venezuela; the same groups that get NED funding. It's not as though there are a ton of opposition groups. We know who they all are, and pretty much all of them receive U.S. funding or training or support.
(snip/...)

http://www.witnessforpeace.org/midatlantic/Articles/Venezuela_and_NED.html

[wellstone_democrat]

50. Texas Progressive Populists

We have our own wing of the Democratic party---we are basically your *old style* Democrats holding up the Democratic Wing of the Democratic Party. Jim Hightower's our man, Molly Ivins our woman.

Mel Martinez is the worst of old style Miami Cubano politics.

[Zynx]

51. An active approach just like during the Cold War?

Does he want the military juntas back? I'm sure we could find some more Pinochets, Videlas, and Montts.

[MisterP]

53. *Buggles music* gusanos killed the motorcycle star

[FloridaPat]

54. Thought the title was referring to Florida!

[freethought]

59. If they are worried about Cuba just drop the embargo

Castro is aging but not out. Drop the embargo, drop travel restrictions. Keeping these policies in place is wasted energy.

[hollowdweller]

60. Shows how brainwashed our country is that he could attack populisim

[Pepperbelly]

61. Mel Martinez has every reson to fear populism, the rat bastard.

Fuck him.

[peacetalksforall]

62. Viva populism in all of the Americas.I have a sneaking suspicion that

they might be using Martinez as a prelude-spokesperson to an invasion.
Terrorism bad. Populism bad.

Invade with money and soldiers that we don't have. Appropriate 160 billion that we don't have. And you can be assured that we will be told 0that Vnezuelan oil will pay for the invasion and a coup. Instead of being found in a well, perhaps they plan to have Chavez found in a palm tree on one of their pretty beaches or hiding behind Angel Falls.

Mel, keep talking - there are many of out here who see right through you.

[xxqqqzme]

65. can't anyone shut these neo-kon kriminals

up? These kriminals R even dangerous when they're asleep.


I really do hate these kriminals.

[daleo]

66. Bush and his cronies are becoming so unpopular

That they want to denigrate the general notion of being popular. This sets up the meme that they are doing "unpopular but necessary" things, for which the right loves to congratulate itself. That usually amounts to tax cuts for the rich and war service for the poor.

The term "populist", like most political terms, has a huge range of meanings to different people and at different times in history - as is true with the terms "liberal" or "conservative". You always have to look at the context of political labels, especially when the labeling is being imposed by powerful forces.

[GRLMGC]

67. Ugh

I wonder why this is the case? Maybe its because of the fact that many of these countries suffer from extreme poverty and powerlessness in the hands of oligarchies. If a country exploits your resources w/o any regard to your well being? Why the fuck wouldn't you hate them? There's a reason there are socialist revolutions. When people are so beaten down by unfair circumstances, they're bound to break. Martinez is an asshole.