Texas School Board Adds Bible Class

[shadowknows69]

<http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=519&ncid=519&e=2&u=/ap/20050427/ap_on_re_us/bible_class>

this gets a big hearty :wtf: the theocracy gains momentum.

[Bleacher Creature]

1. Had enough yet America??? eom

[lebkuchen]

4. Why not subdivide the country?

What on earth do NYC and SF have in common with TX? I say, cut your losses.

[Bridget Burke]

12. "It is not just inthe Bible belt...."

From the National Council On Bible Curriculum In Public Schools:

www.bibleinschools.net/sdm.asp?pg=implemented

LIST OF STATES WHERE NCBCPS CURRICULUM HAS BEEN IMPLEMENTED

ALABAMA
ALASKA
ARIZONA
ARKANSAS
CALIFORNIA
CONNECTICUT
FLORIDA
GEORGIA
ILLINOIS
INDIANA
KANSAS
KENTUCKY
LOUISIANA
MARYLAND
MASSACHUSETTS
MICHIGAN
MISSISSPPI
MISSOURI
MONTANA
NEBRASKA
NEW MEXICO
NORTH CAROLINA
NORTH DAKOTA
OHIO
OKLAHOMA
OREGON
PENNSYLVANIA
SOUTH CAROLINA
SOUTH DAKOTA
TENNESSEE
TEXAS
VIRGINIA
WASHINGTON
WEST VIRGINIA
WISCONSIN

The Bible course curriculum has been voted into 292 school districts in 35 states. 92% of school boards that have been approached with this to date, have voted to implement it. It is not just in the Bible belt, but it has been voted into school districts from Alaska and California, straight across the board to Pennsylvania and Florida. 170,000 students have already taken our course.

On its surface, this organization seems fairly sane. Hey, the Bible as Literature? We like literature, don't we? Click around--say, on the Links page--& you'll see they are deeply allied with the worst of the Dominionist stooges. Coming right up: Creationism.

[lebkuchen]

21. Which apparently goes to prove

that in an election, even the "lowliest" position up for office is worthy of a close credentials examination.

[Bridget Burke]

27. Last election--the one State School Board position was unopposed.

She was a Republican lady. No, I didn't research her history; it was too late by then.

But School Boards have been targets for Stealth Nutcases for some time now.

[lebkuchen]

37. Why aren't the educated running for these positions?

[BrendaStarr]

29. Take our outrage out to the mixed boards!

The rest of America needs to hear and feel our outrage.

We have made great inroads even with the depleted groups we have on the mixed boards.

Come help us out there where we're connecting with others.

Of course we will always need DU.

We come to collect news and views and have a break, but the real verbal war is outside these forums.

It's the one that will remind Americans of their true self interest.

[Kerrytravelers]

6. Oh, no, baby. Keep it comin'. I want a full-on theocracy.

[Flammable Materials]

86. Yes, I've had enough.

Check the link at the bottom of this message.

[Robeson]

91. How about them debating on whether or not to make it a History....

...Course!! So now, the Bible IS history. Well, I find that highly DEBATABLE!

[katty]

94. Americans will revolt when the damage is already done

[booksenkatz]

2. I vote YES on this, on three conditions:

1. The class would not be mandatory; and
2. The class is funded by some other source than taxpayer dollars; and
3. They shut down all the churches in Texas.
:crazy:

(This is one of the parts of Texas for which I am NOT homesick.)

[dhinojosa]

3. Make sure to add "understanding islam" course....

of course that would just drop the whole stupid idea in the first place.

[whistle]

10. In fact it should include ALL of the world's major religions....

...including atheism. Give our kids a good foundation and a real choice to decide:

<snip>
Major Religions of the World
Ranked by Number of Adherents

Christianity: 2.1 billion

Islam: 1.3 billion

Secular/Nonreligious/Agnostic/Atheist: 1.1 billion

Hinduism: 900 million

Chinese traditional religion: 394 million

Buddhism: 376 million

primal-indigenous: 300 million

African Traditional & Diasporic: 100 million

Sikhism: 23 million

Juche: 19 million

Spiritism: 15 million

Judaism: 14 million

Baha'i: 7 million

Jainism: 4.2 million

Shinto: 4 million

Zoroastrianism: 2.6 million

Tenrikyo: 2.4 million

Cao Dai: 2 million

Neo-Paganism: 1 million

Unitarian-Universalism: 800 thousand

Rastafarianism: 600 thousand

Scientology: 500 thousand

<more>
<link> http://www.adherents.com/Religions_By_Adherents.html

[davidinalameda]

22. There are more UUs than Rastas

take that you pot smoking dread-lock wearing freaks

wait a minute, some of them go to my church!

:bounce:

[Shallah Kali]

32. Exactly! They should be required to include all religions

How else are they doing to understand current world events much less their neighbors? If this was a requirement to let them have the bible class you can bet they would drop the class in a heart beat!

[Unions]

85. WTF are you talking about?

First of all do you realize how much time teaching all the worlds religions would take? What should we cut to make it possible? Some math classes? Maybe an english or chem class or two? And where will we get the people to do it? Do you have any idea how difficult it would be to staff all schools with people who can accurately educate every religion?

And why exactly should someone choose a religion and further why should the state be assisting in that? I've never given religion much thought in my life, and frankly I don't give a damn. You only live once and I'd rather not waste it on stories... many of which are written by someone either 1. On a good drug trip 2. Insane or 3. An uneducated farmer.

And why stop there? If I believe magical unicorns are controlling us from the moon do I get my belief taught? It has as much substance in reality as any religion. If not why? Do I have to have a certain number of people with me before the state adpots it? Will a petition do?

[Pirate Smile]

15. The comparative religions class which I took in my Catholic High School

was one of the best classes I've ever taken.

It gave a general overview of all the major religions, was respectful and pointed out that all the major religions are just seeking to answer the same questions - what happens after we die, why are we here, how should we live, etc.

It aimed for tolerance and understanding, not judgment.

[wryter2000]

64. That would be great

Comparative religion would be a very useful course.

[Walt Starr]

5. It's an elective course

It's also either a literature course or a history course. As a history course, it would present the effect the bible has had on history.

I see nothing wrong with this.

[Kerrytravelers]

7. What worries me is who will be teaching this? I can only imagine...

[burn the bush]

41. I'm going to get the job

hehe I'll teach em bout Jebus alright. hehe:rofl:

[StuckinBFE]

58. "Save me Jebus!!!"

You have to love the Simpsons

[enlightenment]

9. Would you have to be Christian to teach it?

I teach history in college, and I'm a freethinker. I suspect my take on the Bible is slightly different than a Christian's.

[booksenkatz]

LOL -- same here, enlightenment!

I remember learning about Greek and Roman mythology in English and History classes... why should Biblical mythology get special treatment?

And welcome to DU!
:hi:

[Walt Starr]

31. From the article, it's not the bible AS history

it's about the impact the Bible has had on history. Very different ideas, there.

The bible CANNOT be taught as history, because it isn't history. It's literature.

[Bridget Burke]

24. In theory, it's fine.

But the group behind the effort--the group supplying the curriculum--includes this gem on their site:

The Bible was the foundation and blueprint for our Constitution, Declaration of Independence, educational system, and our entire history until the last 20 to 30 years.

www.bibleinschools.net/sdm.asp?pg=found_father

Click around the site. Check out their Links--Creationism is next!

(Hey--my public schooling was 20 or 30 years ago. Semi-rural Texas, too. No Bible at all....)

[Bleacher Creature]

8. You are all thinking too logically.

Yes, it's an elective.

Yes, it's historical in nature.

Yes, in theory, it should be fine.

But ask yourself this -- is there ANY CHANCE it won't be abused???

[Massacure]

80. Of course it doesn't have to be abused.

I was taught the fundamentals of Christianity in history class in a public school in Wisconsin. I was also taught about Judaism, Islam, Hinduism and Buddhism. We were taught how they all related with each other, and studying the source of tensions between Christianity, Judaism, and Islam was interesting. There isn't anything wrong with me as a 16 year old now is there?

Edit: I should also say that the goals of the NCBCPS worries me. It only took me 2 seconds to figure out they were a crook of shit. Anyone half literate in history would know about the Treaty of Tripoli.

[librechik]

11. ok, how about a class on the Constitution then

to put the Bible larnin' in perspective.

[Solly Mack]

13. N C/ Bible Curriculum (You MUST read their web page - AGENDA)

http://www.bibleinschools.net/sdm.asp

Go read the Curriculum link from the site.

This Curriculum has been prepared using the KJV of the bible because of it's historic use as the legal and educational foundation of America


Keep reading ...


who they are endorsed by...just a few

Focus on the Family, February/March 2004
Family Research Council
Louisiana Family Forum
Southern Baptist Convention - Dr. James Merritt, former pres. of the Southern Baptist Convention
Eagle Forum
Concerned Women for America
Stephen Melchior – Attorney – representing Judge Roy Moore in the Ten Commandments Case.




Endorsement letter from:

Judge Darrell White, retired (click to view)

U.S. Senator Jesse Helms (click to view)

U.S House of Rep. Walter Jones (click to view)

U.S. House of Rep. J.C. Watts (click to view)

[Bridget Burke]

39. All the Usual Suspects....

By their website you should judge them.

(Especially the Links!)

[Solly Mack]

40. Exactly. The agenda of this program is not well hidden at all

[Fire Walk With Me]

63. Anytime I see the word "family" in their project names

I read it as "inarguable word used as smokescreen for rat-brained selfish agenda".

[Solly Mack]

69. lol! I like that..and you're right...it's a code word

[kwyjibo]

14. How about an Existentialism elective?

[shadowknows69]

19. "...The bible as a foundation document for society"

fuk that. my home is my society and the bible didn't build it. My wife, my dog and I do.

[merwin]

16. How can students understand Leonardo da Vinci's 'Last Supper' or Handel's

'Messiah' if they don't understand the reference from which they came?"

That's as absurd as: "How can people understand war without studying david and goliath?"

[Soth]

54. Wha...?

I don't think that's absurd at all. You can't fully (or even partially) understand either work of art unless you know what they're referencing, why they're referencing it, etc. etc.

In theory I find this class alright. It teaches the Bible has a historically important document that deserves study, not as fact. However, as has been previously brought up, the group behind it has some very shady allies, and thus I would be wary of it.

[merwin]

That is only the excuse they are using to get the class in. They're not

going to have it taught like a comparative religion class, they're going to teach it like a history class.

The proper way to go about it would be to teach it when it should be taught. IE: When studying 'last supper', go over a section on the meaning of it, and the biblical references.

[XemaSab]

75. You can be raised in a basically

atheist household and still understand the Biblical foundation for certain works of art, such as the Pieta, Bach's Mass in B Minor, and "Piss Christ."

Knowing the Bible is essential to being an educated citizen in America, but being familiar with it and believing it are two different things. I can read Shakespere's "Romeo and Juliet" and appreciate the huge amount of art and literature that have built upon the original story, but that doesn't mean I have to accept it as a historical document.

[StuckinBFE]

17. If I lived in that community I would push for religion classes in

Buddha, Islam, Atheist, etc.. I bet the people that sponsored this bill would not like those classes being offered. They should just have a general world history of religion class that would make more sense. But since when do christian fanatics make sense.

[cyberpj]

25. YES TO THAT! Teach comparative religion. eom.

[Horse with no Name]

65. You are talking Odessa, TX

Smack dab in the middle of Booooooooooooooosh country.
You won't have any objectors.:(


R George BUSH 27,502 76%

D John KERRY 8,579 24%

LB Michael BADNARIK 146 0%

*2004 election results

[mbperrin]

77. You'd be wrong about that. I teach in the social studies department

of one of the high schools here and NO ONE will touch it to teach, since an inquiry was made.

[Ratty]

18. It seems reasonable

On the surface. The Bible and Christianity play a HUGE role in Western history, just as they claim. I come from a religious background and the one saving grace in all that (was that a pun?) is that I have a lot of background knowledge. I'm amazed by people who don't know even the most basic things about the Bible or don't understand common biblical references (e.g., Daniel in the Lion's Den, etc.). They make it seem so reasonable and normally it would be.

But who will teach it? Christians only? How about the course sometimes being taught from a critical viewpoint? Would they tolerate somebody who taught that the tale of creation was metaphorical, that 6 days may not mean 6 literal 24 hour days? Would they tolerate somebody who pointed out how modern day conservative evangelical Christianity contradicts Christianity as it was taught by Jesus? I'm guessing this is supposed to be a vehicle to promote religion in the classroom. I hope there is ONE teacher at the school willing to take this on by volunteering to teach the course sometime with a more critical look at Christianity. Then we'll see.

[cyberpj]

23. No. It doesn't. If people want to learn about the bible they go to CHURCH

NOT SCHOOL.

Unless, of course, it's a Religious School.

[athenap]

82. I dunno...I'm surprised...

...at how many "Christians" only know the parts of the Bible their foamy preacher-man spouts out in relation to them Evil Gay People (TM) and their Agenda, and other nonsense. Maybe if more of these Jeebus-Freaks took a class on the Bible, they'd actually have to read the thing, and would see things like how Jesus mentioned helping the poor about a zillion times and mentioned gays, gay marriage, and abortion NONE.

However, the curriculum to me is suspect. How can someone objectively teach the Bible in a critical or analytical context unless they can separate their bias or need to believe that every word is true? Evangelical Christians, or those for whom their faith requires a belief of an inerrant Bible wouldn't be qualified to teach it.

[shadowknows69]

26. I hate to keep bringing this up

well ok no I don't but....CHRISTIANITY ISN'T EVEN THE MAJORITY RELIGON OF THE PLANET. Whether it is in the US or not is irrelevant.



No church/state hybrid ever!!!!

edit-ok according to a couple of the stat sites xtianity is the majority but personally I don't buy it.

[indie_voter]

35. I understand your point, however

"I'm amazed by people who don't know even the most basic things about the Bible or don't understand common biblical references (e.g., Daniel in the Lion's Den, etc.). They make it seem so reasonable and normally it would be."


Why? This is a very Judeo-Christian centric view. There are many different religions in this country, though Christianity is the majority religion.

However, it doesn't mean all of us have had exposure to the Bible.

A secular example : people are amazed I don't understand their Survivor conversations or other pop culture references of the moment.

Just because it pervades mainstream culture, doesn't make it relevant or important.

Granted, it is becoming more and more important to understand biblical references, otherwise it is hard to understand what the President is trying to say.

FWIW, I am amazed by people who can't figure out the tip at a restaurant. ;)

[elsiesummers]

46. A 39 YrO Athieist, I YESTERDAY learned Passover is Jewish, not Christian..

I found out because alternate side parking/street cleaning rules are suspended for passover.

I have also been exposed to the names of some Islamic holidays this way.

I have been known to praise both God and Allah, depending on the parking holiday.

So - this class, if it had no religious agenda, would be OK by me.

But, I found that World Religions was an incredibly difficult class in college because I had no foreknowledge of any religions.

Athieists are going to need a remedial religions class or they are just setting these kids up for failure (seriously) and giving the Christians an easy A.

[cyberpj]

20. Yup. Just when we're falling farther behind in Science and Math

let's cut funding for arts and phys ed - allow our kids to fall farther behind in Science and Math and - oh yeah! - ADD a Bible class!

PLEASE - AMERICA - HELP US STOP THIS NONSENSE!

[Shallah Kali]

Who needs math, science, art, and physical fitness when you have God?

It couldn't be that we were given brains to actually use them instead of instil blind obedience in our young? Nahhhhhh.

[Roland99]

28. What....the.....

"How can students understand Leonardo da Vinci's 'Last Supper' or Handel's 'Messiah' if they don't understand the reference from which they came?" Johnson said. The group's Web site says its curriculum has received backing in 292 school districts in 35 states.

I really don't have a problem if the class is a critical of the Bible based upon research done by Biblical scholars and archaeologists. But comments like that are INSANE!

I guess that mentality means the Qu'ran, Torah, Pyramid Texts, Nag Hammadi Library, and the four Vedas (among others) will all be added to the curriculae, too?

[theHandpuppet]

45. Oh, I get it now!

Da Vinci and Handel... let's throw in Michelangelo for the Sistine Chapel. And there you have just a few examples of GAY HISTORY AND ITS PLACE IN THE CHRISTIAN CHURCH.

Think that one will fly?

[Roland99]

49. Pope Rat will figure out some way to make it fly

[theHandpuppet]

50. On the contrary, I think...

... there won't be any mention that the historical figures referred to in the quote were, in fact, gay. That little part of "history" will never see the light of their classrooms.

[Roland99]

51. That's sorta what I meant but failed to express at all

:)

[reality based]

30. I hope this Bible course will clarify

whether da Vinci's Lord's Supper involves the actual blood and body of Christ.

[Coastie for Truth]

33. One of my lawyer friends told me they had a "Bible Elective"

at his (Roman Catholic - Holy Ghost Fathers) law school - a course in "Topics in Family Law" from Catholic and Presbyterian Canon Law, Jewish Talmudical Law, and Muslim Sharia perspectives - team taught by the respective lawyer-clergy. (The RC Prof later became a Cardinal, the Rabbi later became a Rosh Yeshiva).

He said it was a popular class - with a term paper that could not be from your own heritage.

[Bridget Burke]

36. Sounds like a good course.

But the group working to get Bible study in the public schools--the group that designs the curriculum--is not as free-thinking.

[wryter2000]

66. It sounds great

But that school could have any kind of religious instruction it wanted, anyway. It's a private school.

[Shallah Kali]

34. Make 'em include Comparative Religions and watch 'em dump this class

like a hot rock! Or at least make them use a variety of teachers from all the Christian sects from UU to Christian Scientists, Quakers to Shakers, Catholic to Baptist. I bet that would make pseudoChristian facist theocrats wish they had never brought it up! :evilgrin:

[Horse with no Name]

38. I think we should embrace it as a party

define it strictly to elective courses and under this agreement they can teach creationism in this class ONLY and leave the science to the mandatory mainstream courses.
We should frame the outline to prove that we are not unGODly and it would give us a platform to prove that, by offering this type of teaching to those who want it, but requiring a mainstream course to be available for those who believe in the Constitution.
As I said in another thread, we are going to have to show compromise in places that we would rather not, but this seems one of the best avenues for compromise IMHO.

[Richard Steele]

59. Absolutely not. You want to let them TEACH CREATIONISM there?

WTH?
This thread is not even ABOUT creationism; you are proposing a 'compromise' on a subject which is not even under discussion.

And, your 'compromise' is nothing of the sort. It is TOTAL SURRENDER.

Public schools should not teach religious ideas. That is a concept upon which NO free nation can allow ANY COMPROMISE!
.......................................................................

Now, as far as the CLASS being discussed, my thoughts are this:

1:It wouldn't be a bad idea, if those promoting it could be TRUSTED.

2:Those promoting it CANNOT be trusted.

3:Therefore, it IS a bad idea.

[Horse with no Name]

62. "They" are going to do it anyway

"They" are going to teach creationism."They" are going to put religion back in the schools. In Texas, each district can basically make their own rules and I am not sure how many school districts there are, but would feel comfortable saying there are hundreds here alone.
Now, we can lie down like good Democrats and protest, and in the end, they are going to do it anyway.
My suggestion was to merely try to find a compromise on the idea so that we can at least put some guidelines in to this.
We can't fight these tyrants on every single issue and like it or not, we are going to have to spread our legs every now and then so that we can save the ammunition for the big fights.
As things are today, unfortunately, that is just the way it is.
Whether I like or you like it.:shrug:

[Richard Steele]

68. Spread your OWN legs; don't presume to speak for mine or anyone elses.

Your entire POST is premised upon "They are going to do it anyway."

No one has ever succeeded in ANY struggle with that attitude.

Therefore, I won't be adopting it for my own use.

[Horse with no Name]

70. Yes by all means

Let's bog ourselves down on every small issue that we won't be able to change so that we don't have enough focus/manpower left to change the big things--like elections.
Right now, we HAVE to fight for fair elections with a paper trail otherwise NOTHING else we do matters.
When we can get back in power, THEN we can change all these other things that we were powerless to fight as a minority power under theocrats.
It's just the big picture is all.

[Richard Steele]

88. Third time's the CHARM, Horse-Meister! Thx for including POSITIVES!

Re: your concern for outlawing crooked election practices: I am with you %110! DAMN right that's IMPORTANT!

But we CANNOT ever again ignore the smaller issues; that's what got us in this mess!

The tiny 5% XtianTaliban in this nation has spent 30 years worming its way into positions of SMALL, LOCAL power...

When we were concerned with Senators and Presidents, they were running UNOPPOSED for 'Dogcatcher' and 'Schoolboard Member'....

And now, the MAJORITY of U.S. citizens are seeing their inalienable Rights dying the "death of a thousand cuts".
These fascists are attempting to wear us down with a "human wave" offense...
They know they can't LEGALLY force their wishes OPENLY upon a FREEDOM-LOVING NATION...They would be LAUGHED back into the Dark Ages they came from.

So, they instead attempt to wear down the Bill of Rights in a war of attrition... hundreds of tiny, LOCAL, fascist-enabling opinions, which must be defeated one at a time.

If there is any SINGLE lesson to be learned from these DARK Days, it is that we must always fight EVERY battle, large or small.

"ALL politics is LOCAL politics."
KnowhutImean, Vern?

There is no "bogging us down" if we express ourselves well...60 to 80% of U.S. Citizens AGREE with us on EVERY major issue...they just need to hear it!

[Horse with no Name]

89. Well said.

I stand corrected. Thank you.

[Massacure]

83. I disagree. If a student wants to learn about Christianity, let them.

If they want to learn about Judaism, let them. If they want to learn about Islam, Buddhism, or Hinduism, let them.

Evolution belongs in Biology. Religious courses belong in philosophy or their own electives.

That particular curriculum that was proposed might be really bad, but that doesn't mean religion shouldn't be an option.

[rocktivity]

42. As unconstitutional as hell

if you'll pardon the expression.

:evilgrin:
rocknation
(if you'll pardon the smiley)

[me b zola]

84. Of course it is unconstitutional

..but that doesn't stop them. The fact that they need to have an entire area to explain how 'legal' it is (just like the WH faith based initiatives website) is pretty telling.

From these nutjobs website in the "legality" section...
"In 1963, the Supreme Court made a ruling, not against the study of the bible, but against the devotional, religious use of the Bible. Supreme Court Justice Clark stated,

It might be well said that one's education is not complete without a study of comparative religion or the history of religion and its relationship to the advancement of civilization. It certainly may be said that the Bible is worthy of study for its literacy and historic qualities. Nothing we have said here indicates that such study of the Bible or of religion, when presented objectively as part of a secular program of education, may not be effected consistently with the First Amendment."

So they have made the case AGAINST themselves! Their own argument states that it must be a COMPARATIVE RELIGION class!!

I really can't stand these people.

[demo dutch]

43. That means Florida is next. Lawsuits will surface soon I 'm sure.

By now judges must be outraged and that will help the case along.

[bmbmd]

44. I took "The Bible as Literature" as a senior in

public high school. It was a great class, and I had a great teacher. I took New Testament Survey in college, then Old Testament and later Comparative Religion as an upper classman. I thought they were fabulous courses. I certainly never learned much about the Bible from Sunday School, church , and MYF.
I found each of these courses to be difficult, requiring a lot of reading and writing.

[lawladyprof]

47. People for the American Way examined this curriculum

and found it was unconstitutional (so did a couple of courts, I think). The materials (and no doubt the teacher himself or herself) gives a literal view of the Bible, that is, that is factually, historically true. Moses actually wrote the first five books of the Hebrew Scripture/Old Testament, Noah actually built the ark, etc.

[callous taoboy]

48. World religion class would be cool: Bible class noooooo!

A world religion class would be educational. Bible class just reeks of proselytizing.

[slackmaster]

76. The Bible is a book - no need to be inherently afraid of it

Bible class just reeks of proselytizing.

It sounds that way to me too, but if it's taught as literature or history (as noted in the article) or even a survey of Judeo-Christian religious teachings IMO it does not necessarily create any Constitutional problems.

Taking a Devil's Advocate view for a moment, look at the flip side - Would it be right to ban study of the Bible? Would that constitute censorship?

Just for clarity: I'm proud to be a third generation atheist or agnostic depending on how the terms are defined.

[cmkramer]

52. Actually

there is nothing that says you cannot teach a Bible course in a public school. What you cannot do is use that class as a sort of proselytizing tool. And, no, just teaching a course in the Bible is not considered proselytizing.

Obviously, one might wish to keep tabs on these courses to make sure no one crosses the line.

[Dark]

53. So what? It's an elective.

I'd be worried if it was a mandatory class, but if a student wants to waste an hour every day listening to that mumbo-jumbo, let em.

[Kathryn7]

55. Bible as literature or history makes sense to me.

I've seen secular college classes teach it.

[mbperrin]

56. Sorry, but the course is blasphemy. Religion does not

center around the Bible in Odessa, but around football! This is Friday Night Lights town, folks!

[Name removed]

57. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[Richard Steele]

60. Hello, cornfield. Enjoy your stay.

[mbperrin]

61. Excuse me, this is a town of 100,000 and no public vote

has been taken on this issue at all. It's certainly not a very religious town and I've lived here all my life - more bars than churches.

[Horse with no Name]

67. And there doesn't have to be

Most of the folks voted for Booosh.


R George BUSH 27,502 76%

D John KERRY 8,579 24%

LB Michael BADNARIK 146 0%

[Maat]

71. Religion doesn't scare me.

I believe in God, just not the Conservative Christian's idea of God.

And I do not want my child being taught that the Bible is a Holy Book.

It is not OUR sacred text.

A comparative religion class is acceptable; singling out one book as the basis for an entire class is inappropriate, in my humble opinion.

Only 3 posts? Hmmm ...

Didn't vote for Booosh, did you?

If PFAW took a look at the curriculum and found it unconstitutional, then that is what it is.

Because I am a recent law graduate, I take a look at the age of the typical student that will take the course. I have no problem with college-age kids taking that type of course (in general), and neither does the Supreme Court. Most high school kids are also mature enough to digest comparative religion (at least).

But elementary school students ... things get very tricky there. And the judiciary in this country knows that.

[Ilsa]

72. Hey, it's frackin' Odessa. Let them all fall behind in Math and Science,

the oil is running out anyway, so they'll be jobless and ignorant. Serves them right. (Various obscene nouns for them keep popping into my head.) As long as they keep their crappy curriculums for themselves.

[mbperrin]

79. Oil production peaked in 1972. School I teach in is 68%

Hispanic. Half the population over 25 has no high school diploma. DUI rate is 5 x the state average. And while it's true that a majority of those who voted voted for *, I didn't. And more than half of the registered voters didn't vote at all.

There is a small base of religious people from out of town who are pushing this. Most natives are just too laid back to oppose it. The only school board member not present at the meeting was also the only person to teach a course like this here in 1979, when it was cancelled for too many complaints from dueling factions. He has opposed the course being offered now, too.

This is the town of Friday Night Lights, and was also the Murder Capital of the US in 1981, as the oil boom was petering out. Please don't wish ill on my students - as graduating seniors, I find them terribly optimistic about the future and wanting to do something good.

No one on the faculty here will teach it - we've already been asked and all 175 members said no. Just something to think about....

[Ilsa]

87. No problem. And I don't wish ill on anyone.

But the people that are too laid back to speak up about this will have a price to pay down the road if they don't stop the commandeering of public funds for religious education.

[moobu2]

73. I'd support it if they taught the true history of Christianity

That Christianity was behind every low point in human history, from dark ages, the crusades, witch hunts, the inquisition, Nazism, the kKK etc... otherwise it would just be more Christian lies.

[jwirr]

74. One question will point up why there should be no

religious classes in public schools. WHAT DENOMINATION'S VERSION ARE THEY GOING TO TEACH? Many of our ancestors came here because they wanted to practice religion in their own fashion. So what is the official state line going to be?

[XemaSab]

78. I think they should start every class with a prayer

to the saints and the Blessed Virgin on behalf of the Pope, the whole Catholic church, all the nuns, the whole shebang.

Let's see how far THAT goes.

[jwirr]

81. OOPS! I can't do that! My religion says

I can't. Now if you are willing to teach it my way? (Sarcasm).

[UCLA Dem]

90. If its just a history class, they also need to teach the Koran and Torah.

And any other holy book and/or readings from all major religions.

They also need to teach the history of Hindus, Buddhists etc.

[Az_lefty]

92. They don't do Bible Study on Sunday mornings in Texas?

[katty]

93. Bible Class in Public Schools?!

why am i not surprised

[RightWingLeftist]

95. Huh???

You know, a Bible class don't scare me. Now if they decided to make the government based on the Law.....sheeesh... now thats a problem