GOP leaders weigh new Social Security plan(without personal accounts)

[Algorem]

http://www.cleveland.com/newsflash/washington/index.ssf?/base/politics-5/1112911022119850.xml&storylist=washington
4/7/2005, 6:01 p.m. ET
By DAVID ESPO
The Associated Press

WASHINGTON (AP) — Senate Republican leaders are considering whether to seek Democratic support for Social Security legislation without the personal accounts sought by President Bush, aiming to restore them later, officials said Thursday.

Any such move would mark a tactical shift and could anger the White House, which is in the midst of an intensive 60-day campaign to sell Bush's approach to the public.

The internal discussions among top Senate Republicans come at a time when the drive to overhaul Social Security — the centerpiece of Bush's agenda — appears stalled. Democrats routinely attack his proposed accounts as privatization, and adamantly resist the idea of including them in any legislation designed to shore up the program's finances.

With public opinion polls showing modest support at best for Bush's plan, Republicans have yet to coalesce behind a proposal of their own...

[EVDebs]

1. A new 'plan' ? You mean outright deception isn't working ??? eom

[Pirate Smile]

5. Guess not - New deception - "aiming to restore them later"

Dems, you've been smart so far, don't blow it!

[KansDem]

6. Don't worry. Bush won't be able to explain this one either...(nt)

[MichiganVote]

2. Yup, they're debating how much more they can screw Americans

who somehow don't own a private jet, boat or tax shelters. Shouldn't take them long to figure out how to coach this as a 'culture of life' issue for the wealthy.

[AlCzervik]

3. I will never trust them, it's important we look at bills

they will debate and see if they sneek personal accounts into a line item on unrelated bills much the way they got through some provisions of the patriot act.

[shanti]

8. that's how they do it

and we DO have to watch these bills closely. they ALWAYS sneak some kind of horror into seemingly innocuous bills.

[nadinbrzezinski]

4. Has Luntz lost his magic?

Oh and is Rove loosing control of the boys?

[grytpype]

7. "aiming to restore them later" ???????

Yeah. I have two words for the GOP and their new plan:

FUCK YOU CHARLIE!

Ok that's three words.

[Al-CIAda]

9. This is so screwed up its unbelievable.

I'm glad the dems are listening to Dean so far (or in agreement with his suggestion). That this is a total sham, their playing with the numbers to create a crisis, and we have real pressing problems elsewhere that needs adressing.

Stand strong jellyfish, but I suspect eventual capitulation by the sell-outs is ahead. Can you blame me? This could be the final blow to the Dems.

[sadiesworld]

11. The whole SS business has had a bit of a surreal, theater quality to it.

Has there been another plan (or at least an acceptable Plan B) all along? Whatever it is, I doubt it is going to involve rolling back the massive tax cuts for the wealthy.

Yep, this could be the final blow for the dems if they cave.

I'll be watching VERY closely.

[central scrutinizer]

10. predictable

I went to a public forum a week ago with my rep - Peter DeFazio - and he predicted this would happen. He says it will all be a scam to get something moving on this so they would have a talking point for re-election and still be able to start chipping away at social security. The same way they are weakening abortion rights.

[UCLA Dem]

12. They never had a plan in the first place.

Losers. :freak:

[truthisfreedom]

13. they were just hoping to "mandate" the bushco "plan" down our throats.

[Skip Intro]

14. We should delcare ANY plan repukes put forth D.O.A

We should recoil in disgust and anger at anything they put forth - and yell in unison to every camera around that the "radical republicans" are trying to kick old and poor people off Social Securty.

"They're trying it KILL it! They're trying to KILL it!" (catchy phrase with a "life issue word" included).

Let the people know in black and white who's with them, and who's against them. Who'll protect them and their parents.

I'll say it again, we can decimate the repukes with this issue. We can define them, and hammer this issue from now thru 2008. Agressively and incessantly.

They have no where to go if we do this.

Any and every plan the lead pigs in the repuke party put forth - DOA.

[creeksneakers2]

15. The GOP is in trouble and they want the Dems to help

bail them out.

[grilled onions]

16. They Must Be Watched

I still feel the "50-Fight" the main idea to strip those right at the full benefits for those born 1950 and up needs to be more important right now then the ones at the other end of the retirement spectrum. We will get hit first and many of us are unable to work now leaving us no way to "save more" for our future.

[Kansas Wyatt]

17. Republicans: 'Since the Democrats did not want the American people...

To OWN personal accounts instead of this Government owned Social Security, we have determined that the Democrats alternative will have to require adjustments to the current system in place. Starting immediately, payroll taxes will have to be doubled under the Democrat alternative, but we Republicans will give back this increase by reducing the payroll tax cap to offset this increase. With this proposal, we will continue to enjoy the George W. Bush income tax cuts with this small balanced adjustment to the payroll tax.'

Republican values mean that most people will be getting screwed, unless they are watched closely.

[EVDebs]

18. I guess the 'new plan' is totally opening up the Mexican border

and 'insourcing' all the new illegal immigrants with phony SS#. Then the employers will say 'oh, I didn't know I was hiring an illegal immigrant'---but it will be too late. Later on they will have to break it to the illegal immigrants that they aren't entitled to Social Security, despite having paid into the system.

This is how Republicans are 'fixing' social security. Eventually someone is going to have to provide healthcare etc. for these illegal immigrants. And Taxes will have to be raised to do it. The only justice is that we will know that BUSINESS TAXES are going to have to rise since they are the ones most responsible for this mess.

[Kimber Scott]

19. Democrats routinely attack his proposed accounts as privatization...

Are his proposed private accounts not "privatization?" The wording in this piece is a little suspect, to say the least. Maybe, I'm just becoming too cynical.

[Moderator]

20. kick to combine

[Inland]

21. Senate GOP mulls shift on Soc.l Sec.---drop personal accounts temporarily

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/7426012/

WASHINGTON - Senate Republican leaders are considering whether to seek Democratic support for Social Security legislation without the personal accounts sought by President Bush, aiming to restore them later, officials said Thursday.

Any such move would mark a tactical shift and could anger the White House, which is in the midst of an intensive 60-day campaign to sell Bush’s approach to the public.

***********

What legislation? Repug senators, put your tax hike or benefit cut bill up for consideration first.

[papau]

22. How does GOP "shift" on SS when they have no official plan to "shift" from

???????????

:-)

The media would not allow this language if it were a "possible idea" from the Dems.

[Moderator]

23. kick to combine

[oxbow]

24. Good News Everyone!: Private accounts might be put on hold (CNN)

http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/04/08/social.security.ap/index.html

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Senate Republicans are considering temporarily sidetracking President Bush's plan for personal investment accounts under Social Security, hoping Democrats will then join compromise talks on legislation to restore the program's solvency.

Several GOP officials said Thursday that Republican leaders discussed the possibility privately this week, recognizing that unified Democratic opposition to the accounts has so far stalled efforts to advance the president's top domestic priority.

At the same time, these officials said GOP leaders were wary of leaving the impression they intend to abandon the president's proposal to allow younger workers to invest a portion of their payroll taxes independently.

In the end, leaders remain determined to deliver what Bush wants, they added.
(more)

They fail to mention that the public is overwhelmingly against private accounts though. In the end, its "delivering what Bush wants" that matters, of course.

Still, the forces of reason are winning out! So take a breath, take heart and then, lets keep the heat up and going. They are hoping that letting everyone cool off on SS will work to their favor, so its up to the people to keep pressure up and inform others about what private accounts mean and why King George is really doing this. Lets work with Democrats, AARP and other concerned citizens to save our benefits from big business interests!

[BillZBubb]

25. Democrats need to keep holding the line.

No Compromise! No "temporary" anything. Don't throw the bastards a life-line. Make them introduce THEIR bill, with NO Democratic support.

[wakeme2008]

26. Dems need to just say NO...

The Repugs are making it CLEAR, pass this piece today, and tomorrow we WILL BE BACK with private accounts.... Grrrr they are not even hiding that.

[oxbow]

30. We are winning

Democrats need to hold the line because they have the public behind them, and because 2006 is not too far away. I guarantee that if they continue opposing this, they will gain seats in the next election.

Any DNC people lurking here, go tell your bosses to NOT GIVE A SINGLE INCH ON THIS, OR YOU WILL BE SORRY!

[Warpy]

33. They don't have enough PUBBIE votes for this one

It's a harebrained scheme, and even the faithful are saying so, and no amount of bullying by Delay is going to get them enough votes to get this stinker through Congress.

[saltpoint]

27. The Democrats are the minority party in Congress now --

-- but they had the Social Security issue nailed smackdab from the beginning.

I say let the GOP twist in the wind a while before we return to the bargaining table, and in the compromise, we get a higher percentage of judges for upcoming appointments.

[creeksneakers2]

28. Its a trick

As long as Bush doesn't swear off private accounts, they can bring the issue back up anytime.

[Robbien]

39. Yep. The "hold" is only on until the Dems give an inch, then the "hold" is

swept away. All systems go.

[candy331]

40. Agreeeee, it is nothing but a trick, don't fall for it Dems the repugs

are nothing but liars and slight of hand tricksters. Don't fall for it just say no,SS can wait, fix Medicaid which truly is in crisis. Bush wants to tear down SS so it can be his legacy to himself and his neocon friends, let his legacy be Iraq. Seems like democracy in the ME was his goal but changed horses in the middle of the stream to SS since he had yucked up Iraq. Just say No, it can wait till he is out of office.

[KamaAina]

29. Quit saying private accounts! *Personal* accounts may be put on hold!

Personal accounts! Personal! Not private! Never say private! Rove told us not to!!

:sarcasm:

[The_Casual_Observer]

31. "on legislation to restore the program's solvency"

So the program is insolvent????

I hope to hell if they sink it this time it will stay sunk!

[MichiganVote]

32. Stock market is sliding. Oil prices.

[rodeodance]

37. 'compromise"=private accounts+dems desire. It is a trick!

.....Senate Republicans are considering temporarily sidetracking President Bush's plan for personal investment accounts under Social Security, hoping Democrats will then join compromise talks on legislation to restore the program's solvency.

[Skip Intro]

34. No compromise!

UNITY!

[Bush_Eats_Beef]

35. Good. Next step, the "National Sales Tax" proposal needs to be put on hold

...PERMANENTLY.

Hastert was calling for this to happen earlier in the week.

It must NOT happen.

[mikehiggins]

36. One would hope the Dems will hold strong

Almost impossible to beleive BUT one can still hope

[Malva Zebrina]

38. Democrats should hold to their line

and NOT present anything at all that is an alternative, nor should they present "their" plan.

Bush has NOT got a plan and has NOT presented a plan. He waited around for the Democrats to present a plan, so he could either mock them or take as his own plan that which the Democrats would have presented.

I have to say, that letting him go on his very expensive tour to present a NON PLAN without a democrat to bash, was the right tack to follow.

Bush is now left with nothing.

He does not have a plan that he willing to reveal to the American people, other than his false accusations and lies, and he does not have a Democrat plan by which he can attack to take up the slack.

He has been hoist on his own petard.

I believe he has lost big time. The only thing he has left, while he continues to spend our money on his 60 city snake oil travelling snake oil show, traveling about on AF I, amounting to millions of dollars, while he has failed to sell his snake oil is to use his executive privelege and he may very well do that and should he do that, I think that will be his final downfall and the downfall of the Republican party. He may not want to risk that--on the other hand, he may just go for broke since he has nothing to lose at this point.

[oxbow]

43. I really hope he does use executive privelege

drop his approval ratings 10 more points and impeach the son of a gun.

[americanstranger]

41. What is this? A 'stupid test' for Dems?

Josh Marshall has a pretty good take on this.

"So given that privatization now seems dead in the water, these senate Republicans want to enlist Democratic support for enacting what will no doubt be highly popular benefit cuts and tax increases because this will smooth the way for them to partially phase out Social Security with private accounts, as part of a two step gambit.

And to structure the experiment so as to get a clear read on whether we're talking about mere substandard intelligence or some more profound sort of incapacitation they're telling the reporter from the Associated Press that this is their plan.

Setting aside this foolery, why would any Democrats agree to do anything on Social Security before getting agreement from Republicans -- embodied, where appropriate, in legislation -- that phase-out is off the table for good and that the Treasury notes in the Social Security Trust Fund will be repaid in full."

http://www.talkingpointsmemo.com/archives/week_2005_04_03.php#005379

Would Democrats actually be stupid enough to sign on to this? I sure as hell hope not.

-as

[kliljedahl]

42. Private accounts? Did I miss the talking points memo?

I thought it was "Personal Accounts".

My bad, sorry.


http://www.kliljedahl.net

[slackmaster]

44. Arrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!

Wait, wasn't this thread about "Pirate Accounts"?

:dunce: