Bush is losing support on right

[UpInArms]

http://www.startribune.com/stories/587/4108353.html

The criticisms of President Bush aren't surprising: He's bungling the war in Iraq; his budget deficits are disastrous; he's trampling civil liberties; his spending plans are misguided.

But the source of those criticisms is: They're increasingly coming from conservatives.

<snip>

One of those voices belongs to Daniel Cragg, a college student from Eagan who in June launched a Web site called conservativesagainstbush.com "to propound the conservative principals this administration has forsaken."

...more...

[GreenGreenLimaBean]

1. Awesome!!!

Now conservatives won't come out and vote democratic, but maybe they
just won't come out and vote period...

[AndyTiedye]

21. Some May Vote Libertarian

[Spirochete]

28. I think maybe some of them will vote Democratic

figuring a Democratic president will do less damage and be easier to get rid of in 2008, than if W-A were to get a second term to get a tighter stranglehold on the country.

[Barrett808]

2. Visit conservativesagainstbush.com

Advocating drug legalization:
http://conservativesagainstbush.com/16july.html

[Brucey]

3. As soon as it hits their pocketbooks...

When we're killing people, obstructing civil rights, pushing people into poverty, etc., the conservatives are big supporters of the policies. When asked for money, then their tune changes! Odd thing, despite the rotten economy since Chimpy took office (yes, took!), the wealthiest of the wealthy have increased their incomes! Surprise, surprise.

[newsguyatl]

6. EXACTLY!

[diplomats]

15. What's really ironic is

there were so many stories about how Chimpy's advisers were going out of their way not to repeat the mistakes of Poppy (ie alineating the conservative base) and it looks as though they're beginning to do just that.

[ozone_man]

35. Conservatives starting to realize that Bush is an extremist.

They don't want that brand of conservatism. Bush will lose the Libertarian wing of the party and much of the liberal Republican vote.

[Tatiana]

4. Conservatives are waking up.

Not even generous tax cuts for the wealthy will save Bush in this economy. A falling dollar, high gas and lumber prices, high unemployment rates, increased corporate greed... and a steadily climbing budget deficit on top of that! No decent economist or fiscal conservative could logically support such an idiot.

[UpInArms]

5. look at this one too

http://atlblogs.com/republicansfordean/

More From Cudahy

He's at it again. Michael Cudahy has written another superb article about how Americans can take back their country from the neo- conservatives who are currently running the country. Maybe his most important words in this latest writ, are these:

Where is it written that Republicans and Democrats must treat each
other with suspicion and contempt? Where is it ordained that differences in philosophy should be grounds for despicable and contemptuous political media?

Indeed. Politics in recent memory has become a full contact sport with people looking at others who hold a different ideology as the enemy. I may disagree with my liberal friends, but they are my friends not my enemy. George Bush came to Washington saying that he wanted to be a uniter, not a divider. Some of that did come true in the days and weeks after 9/11, but not anymore. The neo-cons that hold important spots in his Administration have sought to divide this country accross many lines going as far to paint anyone that may disagree with the President as unpatriotic. This is rubbish. We are a diverse country of different hues, ethnicities, and religions. Out of that cacphony of difference, we are united by the democratic themes of liberty, freedom and equality. We are E pluralbis unum, out of the many, one. We may disagree at times, but we are united and unity should not mean conformity. Bush has had his chance to united the country and I believe he has failed. It's time for someone who does not simply united us, but spur us as Americans to come together. I believe that Howard Dean is that man.

...more...

[bearfan454]

16. I believe that too. But I did want Kerry originally.

I think it is between these two. Does it even matter with the electronic vote stealing ? If you know Microsoft access you know this can happen. Really.

http://www.blackboxvoting.org

http://www.blackboxvoting.com

[GinaMaria]

19. Well said and

:hi: Long time no see.

Glad to see you again.
G

[Tatiana]

37. Well HELLO there!

:hi: Missed being around. With things heating up in the primaries, I had to make a trip back to my favorite left-leaning board.

[rocktivity]

7. It's called "repeating your history because you didn't know it"

Nixon's handlers stuck with him until it got to the point that they appeared to be stuck TO him. And that's the point at which he had no choice but to resign. If longtime loyal conservative voters are even admitting that they're getting aintsy, you can just imagine how moderate Repubs are feeling--their jobs are literally on the line.

A Star Tribune Minnesota Poll this month found that 31 percent of self-described conservatives gave Bush a thumbs down for the way he's doing his job...up from 9 percent who disapproved...after the fall of Baghdad...(D)ispleasure has been growing nationally too. A recent ABC News poll found that 23 percent of conservatives nationwide disapprove of the job Bush is doing, up from 14 percent...
Yum!


rocknation

[DemoVet]

9. Those who don't know history are doomed to repeat it, BUT...

Those of us who DO know history are condemned to watch the reruns...nice quote I heard on here awhile back.

[HawkerHurricane]

14. History repeats itself:

What they don't tell you is that the first time it's as a tragedy;
The second time it's as a farce.

(History does not repeat itself. Historians repeat each other.)

[priller]

8. Another funny quote:

Cato Institute president Edward Crane fumed to the New York Times this summer that Bush's "fiscal record is appalling -- spending is out of control. The fiscal record of the Bush administration makes Clinton look downright responsible."

Er, well, Clinton *WAS* financially responsible.

[Skittles]

10. they just cannot admit it, priller

because they are conservative assholes

[cliss]

11. I agree, Tatiana.

Even if the top 1% has gotten wealthier, that doesn't mean that the rest of them will. If this economy goes to hell, you can count on businesses folding, too.

If there are people standing in line for food, guess how Marriott, Embassy Suites, Holiday Inn will be doing? The Republican base is more than just the top tier of voters. It's lots of businessmen, and many will get nailed because of these reckless policies.

They know the US dollar is weak and is getting weaker. Look out! It's Mr. Toad's Wild Ride.

[Tatiana]

38. Bingo

If this economy goes to hell, you can count on businesses folding, too.

If there are people standing in line for food, guess how Marriott, Embassy Suites, Holiday Inn will be doing? The Republican base is more than just the top tier of voters. It's lots of businessmen, and many will get nailed because of these reckless policies.

That's it in a nutshell. Clinton raised taxes on the wealthy, but the economy did so well, there were so many consumers of goods, the market reached over 10K that they were still able to maintain their status and increase their income without feeling the pain of higher taxes. Now that the economy isn't as good, the wealthy are feeling the pain -- hence the tax cuts to pacify the increasing anger over Bush's bungling of the economy. Once Bush loses the business sector, and I'm not talkin about the huge corporate base, but the mom and pop store owners, entrepreneurs, and small business owners, then we will really be sitting pretty.

Drip, drip, drip.....

[gristy]

12. You know the scene in Airplane, where all the passengers

are lining up to beat the shit out of a hysterical passenger up front? That's what this article feels like near the end:

Assessing Bush's record, conservative columnist Andrew Sullivan recently wrote: "The Bush administration is actually a big government liberal administration on fiscal policy. It likes spending money; it takes on big projects; it's quite content to borrow 'til the fiscal cows come home."

Some conservatives have blasted Bush for his quiet acquiescence in the wake of the Supreme Court's recent ratifications of affirmative action and gay rights. Others have complained that he has not attempted to restrict the number of abortions performed in the United States.

Conservatives of a libertarian bent have railed against the Patriot Act and what they see as its threat to trample civil liberties. And conservatives with isolationist beliefs have blasted the war and occupation of Iraq.

Prominent among these is erstwhile Republican and former presidential candidate Pat Buchanan. Now editor of the American Conservative magazine, his lead editorial in the current issue concludes that "the Bush administration's prosecution of the war on terror has gone terribly, terribly wrong."

And finally, the kick-ass LOL kicker:

Twin Cities talk show host Jason Lewis has occasionally gotten an earful from conservatives fed up with one or another of Bush's policies. "It's uneasiness, not open revolt," he said. "There's a limit to conservatives' patience, but I don't think it's going to be a huge problem in the election."

Yeah, right, Jason.

[catzies]

39. But, you see, he's right, because they all fall in line.

They always do unless they have somewhere else to go. And mostly they don't.

[Jack Rabbit]

13. Conservative vs. Right Wing

There is a difference. A sober conservative really has more in common with a liberal Democrat than with the yuppie fascists in the Bush junta. The rule of law is important to a conservative; law is something to be trampled on for the right wing. A conservative believes in fiscal responsibility. Taxes should be as low as possible and government programs should get results; frankly, as a progressive, I don't disagree with that in principle. However, a right winger wants to bankrupt government in order to make it difficult or impossible to fund government programs, even some that are necessary or worthwhile; we're not just talking about some welfare program that might actually be dubious, but about funding public education. Consequently, instead of fiscal repsonsibility, the right wing pushes irresponsible tax cuts.

This isn't to say that sober conservatives and liberals and progressives see eye-to-eye on everything. That's nonsense. However, these different people can at least talk about issues like when are taxes too high and when is a specific government program being ineffective.

There can be no such dialog with Grover Norquist or Tom DeLay or John Ashcroft. What we have with them is an ideology that stands outside the traditions of American democracy.

Granted, for reasons that are mostly practical, conservatives have made an alliance with the right wing. The right wing offered them lower taxes and a more favorable business climate than some liberals would offer. However, the right wing threatens all of us. The bastardized use of the September 11 attacks to erode civil liberties, bankrupt the government and start colonial wars that have nothing to do with the pronounced aims of the conflict is something that should concern everybody who has read the Federalist Papers and who feels the words of the Bill of Rights flowing in his veins. It is time for conservatives to reconsider their alliance with the far right.

Consequently, we should invite real conservatives to join us in the quest to depose the Bush junta. We can go back to discussing our differences civilly afterwards. For now, we have a common foe who would take away our freedom and our right to choose our leaders and our representatives. We should unite and defeat the enemy that is the Bush junta.

[calimary]

18. Either that, or, maybe we should encourage them to break away.

If they splinter off, there goes a big chunk of true believers AWAY from the rethug party. They can take enough of the bushies votes with them to lock in a win for the Dems. Maybe we should encourage ol Pat to run again.

[Jack Rabbit]

20. Pat Buchanan is not a sober conservative

Buchanan is a racist and an anti-Semite. His differences with Bush are that Bush is too moderate for him.

McCain is more the kind of person I have in mind.

This is also where the DLC might be useful. In a sense, this is a sober conservative group that already exists in the Democatic Party. Of course, like many DUers, I resent the arrogance of Al From and Bruce Reed and bristle every time they try to tell progressives to sit down, shut up and support centrists and expect nothing in return. However, if somebody in the DLC can try to work with the Democratic Party's base instead of calling it a bunch of nasty names while making an appeal to consevatives disenchanted with the yuppie fascist dominance of the GOP, we might be able to bury the so-called "neoconservative" movement with a stake through its heart in 2004.

[Resistance Is Futile]

32. McCain has ties to PNAC and was nailed for corruption

[TomNickell]

26. Very good points...

JR,
Think of all the small business owners, members of mainstream churches, middle managers, who consider themselves 'conservative' and feel the traditional Republican party represents their views and economic interests.

These folks have nothing whatever in common with the lunatic fringes that have controlled the R party over the last decade.

The great mystery is, How did the R leadership manage to take so little criticism for consorting with the lunatic fringe? Perhaps the tide is finally turning.

[Resistance Is Futile]

33. You're being too kind.

The likes of Grover Norquist, Tom DeLay and John Ashcroft stand outside the basic set of values that are shared by most of humanity. These people are not human by anything more than the most technical of measures. They are sociopathic monsters.

[snippy]

36. Very good post.

[Liberator_Rev]

17. The place to post this is on CONSERVATIVE Forums, so

why not pile on here :
http://forums.about.com/ab-usconservatv/messages?msg=3468.7
where I have started the ball rolling ?


at http://www.LiberalsLikeChrist.Org .

See what Christ might say about the "Christian Coalition" & "Religious Right" imposters.

[cliss]

22. Actually, Stan Goff said the Republican party

is of the white people, for the white people, and by the white people.

I quote: "The Republicans are White Supremacists". According to him, that's the real, underlying basis of that party. Everything else is just secondary.

That's why they've become so aggressive, domineering and hostile these past few years. The fundamentals of the party itself have changed. They're not necessarily for "low government spending, low taxation" anymore.

They just want to reign supreme. Period.

[Noon_Blue_Apples]

23. You know you suck when...

.

[bluestateguy]

24. Bush is not for small government at all

Government has only gotten bigger and bigger and bigger. But, please, let's be cautious about alliances with right wing critics of the Administration.

[quilp]

25. Conservatives are afraid they are going to lose their tax cuts.

The only thing they worry about Bush "forsaking" is the "principle" of shifting the tax burden from the rich to the poor.

[truthisfreedom]

27. although i agree with the kid, the writer should be flogged. principals?

come on... principles. schmuck.

[I Lean Left]

29. Any chance of a primary challenge?

Any chance that 'traditional' conservative decides to run in the primaries a la Buchanan in '92? How low do his numbers have to get? How far does the highjacking of their party by the neo-cons have to go before the oldtimers try to wrestle control back? If someone did, would Bush have to debate him?

And, finally, who would you most like to see challenge Bush in the Repug primaries?

[jiacinto]

31. I doubt it

Only Buchanan could do it and I doubt he will.

[jiacinto]

30. Cragg sounds like a Libetarian more than a Republican

But that's how I see it.

[Ignis]

34. But will anti-Bush conservatives vote for a Democrat?

I'm afraid that they won't, particularly because of the long-held (and often misguided) belief by conservatives that any Democratic candidate is a 'big gubmint' candidate.

So just as we progressives will hold our noses and vote ABB, I fear that many conservatives/libertarians will vote Bush because they're really voting ABADemocrat, sadly. I have spoken with several conservatives/libertarians who cannot bring themselves to vote for a Democrat, despite how much they've come to hate Bush. If you actually grill them on the particulars of the current administration and the bills being shoved through Congress by neo-cons, they can't stand them. But that's not enough to make them vote against Bush.

I think it would be lovely to see the party make a move to actually _explain_ to these people that the platform of the Democratic party is not solely a mantra of 'big gubmint', higher taxes, gun control, etc. If the time/effort/money were spent in this direction, I think you could see the con/lib equivalent of the Reagan Democrat phenomenon in the 2004 elections.

[suegeo]

40. God damn it!

The article mentions Vin Weber, which means I feel the overwhelming urge to take a long, hot shower to wash away that scummy feeling I get whenever I hear Vin's name.

SNIP

"I hate to say they've got nowhere else to go, but I think most conservatives will stick with the president," said former Rep. Vin Weber, who is co-chair of Bush's reelection campaign in Minnesota and four other states. "Conservative voters across the country will conclude backing the president is imperative. Of course, it's impossible not to have a few dissident voices."