US security chief does not rule out torture (Tom Ridge)

[Crackingham]

Outgoing US Homeland Security chief Tom Ridge said that torture could be used to extract information from terror suspects in extreme cases to prevent huge loss of life.

He told the BBC in an interview that the United States did not condone the use of torture, but said it could happen "under an extreme set of circumstances" such as the threat of a nuclear holocaust.

In such a case "you would try to exhaust potentially every means you could to extract the information to save hundreds and thousands of people," he told the BBC's HARDTalk programme.

"But by and large, as a matter of policy, we need to state over and over again: we do not condone the use of torture to extract information from terrorists."


http://www.nzherald.co.nz/index.cfm?c_id=2&ObjectID=10006719

[daleo]

1. In an extreme case like this, the legal defense of necessity would work

There is no need to claim that they need to have a "torture loophole" for these extreme hypothetical cases. Anyone who was tried in a case like this (e.g. preventing a nuclear detonation) would doubtless get off anyway.

They just want to maintain a torture loophole, with a very elastic opening, that will be used for things far short of nuclear terrorism.

[Occulus]

4. the problem is, the information you get from torture

is always questionable at best. There does come a point when one will say or do anything to stop the pain. They call it 'being broken'.

[daleo]

5. I agree, this hypothetical is wrong in both law and fact.

Even this hypothetical that everyone talks about might just get investigators tracking down false leads due to torture information that was not accurate.

The "stop a nuclear bomb" scenario is wrong in both its legal reasoning and its factual assumptions. It is just a debating point to normalize torture. The Nazis probably gave similar excuses when they used torture (obviously not nuclear bombs, but similar scenarios).

[teryang]

6. Right

Bad facts make bad law.

[teryang]

2. Just looking at Ridge, you know he believes in torture

...and wouldn't hesitate to screw anyone if it advances his interests.

[aquart]

3. Almost as much as he believes in Hawaiian conferences.

[TaleWgnDg]

7. I don't *get it!* On the other hand, what's there to *get?* . . .

Gonzales and others in the Executive Branch do dances around legal memos while using condescending language in same, then such is "retracted" just days b4 he's due for congressional testimony regarding his nomination by Bush as AG. However, Gonzales dances and dodges direct questions thereof while smiling into the camera and microphone.

And now Ridge in a wholly other administrative agency steps into the quagmire too?

:wtf: ?? Were we all just beamed onto Mars? Or shall we send out signals "Earth to Dumbya, Earth to Dumbya!?? Are you there, Dumbya?! Hello?"

.