Why is the feminist movement in an identity crisis? Just look at the back of your jeans.

[redqueen]

In the past several months, American women have been engaged in intense, public hand-wringing dialogues with themselves over whether they should “lean in” to be more aggressive careerists; whether it is okay to even mention a woman’s gender when writing about her scientific accomplishments; whether an obituary can discuss the deceased woman’s domestic skills (and in which paragraph such information belongs); whether women at Ivy League schools should seize the opportunity to find husbands among their intellectually equal classmates (or whether this is a deeply regressive anti-feminist impulse); and whether a woman CEO is betraying the sisterhood if she outlaws telecommuting.

As a man, I have been happy to sit back and let the ladies thrash these things out among themselves. But a question has been gnawing at me, and I decided to respectfully address it to All Women at Once, in the person of my professional feminist academic friend Gina Barreca, whom I have on the phone. Gina, why is the feminist movement, now well into its dignified middle age, still in the throes of an adolescent identity crisis?

Gina: Take off your pants.

...

Gene: You have completely changed the subject.

Gina: I have not. Bear with me. When men go shopping, they look for clothes that fit them. When women go shopping, we look to fit into clothes. It sounds the same, but it isn’t. Men are entering a place that is tailored for them; women aren’t. The clothes industry is notoriously indifferent to how we really look and what we really want. But when we can’t fit, we blame ourselves. Worse, we shop with prescriptive guilt. “I need to be a size 8 by Marcia’s daughter’s bat mitzvah.” Have any men ever thought, “I need to be a 42 short for the holidays”? The point is, as long as we keep trying to fit ourselves into what’s out there, constantly trying to figure out what is wrong with us, we’re doomed to live in an existential angst — or, as you put it, an adolescent identity crisis. Same with the workplace and our roles as professionals, lovers and mothers. What we need to do is grab the existing fabric of society, rip out the seams and sew it back together in a way that fits us.

...

http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2013-04-24/lifestyle/38857678_1_gina-barreca-gene-bat-mitzvah

Love this analogy.

We really do need to rip society apart at the seams and remake it.

[riqster]

1. Damn straight.

Perfect analogy and course of action. K & R.

[ismnotwasm]

2. I like this

However, My comment on The "adolescent identity crisis" is this;


Whats happening is more a product of more POV's than white, straight, Western culture middle-class women having a voice. Instead of the death toll of feminism, we have feminists everywhere-- speaking their minds. I see no reason for everyone to agree on every topic. There is no stepford feminism. While the philosophy and the movement as a whole gets--- infiltrated lets call it---by people with no idea what feminism is at its core, or what it's accomplished, and caution is in order, there are healthy debates ringing through. I'm glad to hear it. I'm proud to be a part of it, I'm happy to teach and and proud to learn.

This women did an excellent job at using an analogy to some guy with he considered a 'respectful' question. I don't find the question respectful or knowledgable, but the reply was powerful enough to make this man THINK--and that's very powerful.

[TalkingDog]

3. Your comment's first line nails it.

Rather than starting a brouhaha, I'll decline to comment further.

[Laelth]

4. I definitely need to lose weight before I put on a bathing suit this Summer.

Ms. Barreca is deluding herself if she believes that men do not also feel the pressure to lose weight, to look good, and to be attractive. We're just not allowed, in this society, to express the degree to which we are dissatisfied with our bodies.

For what that's worth ...

-Laelth

[redqueen]

5. I'm positive she does know men feel similar pressure.

I'm equally positive that she, like thoughtful people everywhere, recognizes that the amount of pressure on women is exponentially greater.

Also, just wanted to make note of the fact that this pressure was part of an analogy and not the actual point of this OP.

[Laelth]

6. Thank you for the response.

As usual, I am adequately silenced and regret even engaging in this discussion.

-Laelth

[redqueen]

7. Perhaps you might reflect on why you'd not only ignore the focus of the analogy,

but also respond with the idea that she would be ignorant of the pressure men face.

"Ms. Barreca is deluding herself if she believes..."

You didn't even bother to state it diplomatically.

That said, you didn't make a flat out assertion, at least. So there is that.

[Skittles]

8. I AM CONFUSED

does he need his ass kicked or not?

[ismnotwasm]

9. Kinda

Lets Give him the benefit of a doubt for writing an interesting article

[seabeyond]

11. lmFao. cute. nt

[Sekhmets Daughter]

10. The question is why do women accept it?

At what point do we stop blaming those who pressure us, and simply start rejecting the pressure to perform or look or whatever according to some ill-defined concept of the ideal?

Have you ever thought about who trained you to accept such pressure?

[seabeyond]

12. yes. you know,

i read a study where it is the mother that was most influential of teaching the sexism in sons. and i do get it.

you are right. as women we must recognize and reject and teach our children well. for the health and balance in their own lives, either gender.

it is learned for all of us. it does not come naturally for any of us.

[Sekhmets Daughter]

13. It was my mother who insisted

men don't like intelligent women... Or men like this... Or ladies never do that! yada yada yada.

I think sons learn best from example. If mom commands respect, sons will grow to respect women. If mom stands for sexism within the home, sons think it is natural and acceptable. Ours daughters as well...

[redqueen]

15. No. Some daughters rebel against whatever the mother does, no matter her style.

This habit of blaming mothers is bullshit. Nothing is that simple.

[seabeyond]

19. I think it has much more to do with the mothers influence, time, role

Than blaming women or a mother. In most all family units it is the mother that has the dominate position in parenting and would be the most influential

[redqueen]

14. Are you honestly under the impression it is down to one or even a few influential figures?

Look at society. These messages are everywhere. Literally.

Who trained me ... I seriously can't believe you asked that.

[Sekhmets Daughter]

16. Someone had to...when you were still too young to get messages from anywhere else....

I am NOT denying anything stated in the article. I am simply thinking about how it starts in all of our lives.

Personally, I don't think you can change men or society until you change the female response to the bullshit out there.

I suspect we have the same goals, we merely come at them from different directions. I had two daughters and a son to raise... I spent a hell of a lot of time countering the effects, particularly for my daughters, of the nonsense spewed by the mothers of their friends.

[redqueen]

17. No, it just isn't that simple.

A parent (I refuse to reflexively refer to the mother as the sole responsible parent) can refuse barbies, brats, cartoons with sexualized characters, movies with those same messages, turn off tvs during ads, blindfold the kids in public so they won't see billboards or other ads, and those Kidd would STILL eventually have to step out into the world, and decide for themselves what is more fun, valuable, rewarding, etc.

Not only that, but during adolescence kids are developmentally far more likely to value their peers' opinions and judgment than their parents'.

We didn't attack racism by addressing parenting choices, we addressed society. That is the only way to make widespread, meaningful change.

[Sekhmets Daughter]

18. Oh and we have been so very successful in eliminating racism?

We shall have to agree to disagree... as you seem to think there is a unilateral approach and I think there is a multilateral one.

[redqueen]

20. We have been far more succesdful than we have in eliminating sexism.

But no, I don't think there is only one way to fight this. I simply think we have focused more on individual choices more than we have societal messages. It seems to me that these societal messages are simply accepted as unavoidable, and women told their only available choice is to ignore it or participate, and I think that is a huge problem at the moment.

This is why the message in the OP resonates with me. This is not just about teaching our daughters to eschew patriarchal beauty standards.

This is about the workplace being set up with the idea of childless parents or parents with stay at home caregivers available, and the lack of focus on quality affordable daycare for that same reason.

It is about a medical research bias that assumes the male default and only later focuses on female physiology and female health needs.

I could make a long list but I'm sure you see what I mean. We definitely need a multifaceted approach. However IMO what has been sorely lacking and what needs immense intensification now is an emphasis on the need for societal change. We need to end the patriarchy.

[Sekhmets Daughter]

21. I understand and agree with the need to end the patriarchy.

However, if history teaches us nothing else, it teaches that power, or control, is never ceded...it must be seized. It took Gandhi, showing the way to reject their presence, to get the Brits out of India. It took Rosa Parks and MLK,Jr. guiding African Americans to demand their rights. It will take the voices of millions of women, saying "take your patriarchy and shove it, we will make our won clothing, start our own companies, buy our own products" ... In the US, 'markets' have the power. Want to change the power structure...change the markets. Boycott products sold on the basis of sex appeal for starters. It has become too easy for those with power to dismiss us as harridans... Women need to make it painful for them to do so.

I am reminded of Martha Stewart who made it on Wall St., in a man's world, before becoming a "homemaker, par excellence" When she was sent to prison, for crimes regularly committed by men who go unpunished...there were few female voices speaking in her defense. I have often considered that a major failure of the feminist movement and women everywhere. Oh there were a few who spoke out, but no real hue and cry....

Societal change comes about when a majority of the individual members of that society change... and not one moment before...imho

[redqueen]

22. I think we must be talking past each other.

At the moment most people in society don't even know what the patriarchy is, much less how it manifests.

[Sekhmets Daughter]

23. To some extent, I think we are....

And maybe that's the best place to start.... Teaching just what patriarchy IS and its effects...without affixing blame, which only serves to build resistance. I don't know....I am still working my way through the issue of WHY have we made so little progress?

I may be older than you, 65...I was coming of age just as the birth control pill was becoming readily available. Frankly, I was delighted that men were put on notice 'to perform'. But that was the beginning of the gender wars. I think everything that has gone on since has, at its root, the basic sexual tension caused by that notice. I believe that much of the repressive legislation that we see and many of the regressive policies are not 'proactive' but reactive. Why don't we have quality, affordable child care for working women? Because that would give women too much control over their own lives. Patriarchy at its worst. But why shouldn't we have control over our own lives?
Because then we might go in search of something better!

[redqueen]

24. Ha, I completely agree :)

Why don't we have quality, affordable child care for working women? Because that would give women too much control over their own lives. Patriarchy at its worst. But why shouldn't we have control over our own lives? Because then we might go in search of something better!

[Sekhmets Daughter]

25. I knew we weren't that far apart!

[ismnotwasm]

26. Now THAT exchange was badass.

And fun and informative to read; thank you SD and RQ.

[Sekhmets Daughter]

27. I don't come here often...

I think, perhaps, I should visit more regularly. You're welcome, I'm sure.