My two cents on the Elijah Cummings thing

[Chitown Kev]

Look...

For decades on end, black folks have had to listen to white folks explain to us what the issues are and what our issues are (for the benefit of white folks of course).

For the most part, we listened to what white folks had to say and if we dissented...well, we kept a lot of that dissent to ourselves, our media (black newspapers and radio stations); critiques most white people did not listen to or think was worth the time.

Now POC are in elected office at the highest levels and they are deserving of the same respect that POC(for the most part) have always given to white speakers...

So all that black folks are really saying about the heckling of Elijah Cummings is to give us (and black politicians, generally) the same respect that we have almost always given white politicians.

After all, POC are now the base of the Democratic Party...you need us to win and...yes, we need you to win.

So yes, this type of disrespect hurts you as well as us...

Or you can always go over to the party that had all of 18 black delegates out of thousands.

Because the Democratic Party belongs to all of us and all of our concerns...

I did not see and will not look at the heckling of Elijah Cummings earlier today at the Democratic Convention....and from what I have heard about it, I find it preferable not to watch it at this point.

[InAbLuEsTaTe]

1. Post of the day IMHO.

[Lady_Chat]

2. The boos, the heckling, the disrespect shown to him, was totally classless

It broke my heart. He has fought for so much in his lifetime, for the good of others. I doubt any one of those hecklers has done an iota of helping people the way he has. They acted like a bunch of spoiled babies that didn't get their way. Classless, stupid, and embarrassing.

I saw it live and it made me cry, never want to see that again.

[KT2000]

5. Why did they do it?

What were they saying? I missed that.

[JI7]

6. because he was talking about civil rights which is a side issue

[KT2000]

7. thanks for the info

that is disgusting. They have to be GOP plants to do something like that. In any case they don't belong in a Democratic convention.

[Wounded Bear]

9. civil rights is no side issue to me...

it is key.

[BainsBane]

15. Booing indicates hostility

Not just lack of concern.

[brer cat]

24. +1

Failure to recognize that is disconcerting to say the least.

[Petrushka]

8. "What were they saying?" It sppears they were holding up signs and chanting "No TPP". . .

. . . In reply to your question "Why did they do it?": I can only speculate that it was because
Cummings was in charge of drafting the platform and it doesn't include opposition to TPP.


Edited to add:
Here's a link to a video of his speech ---> http://www.pbs.org/video/2365810554/

[Chitown Kev]

10. Thing is, this signals a deeper problem

that we have talked about here many times.

For the most part, white liberals and black folks agree on a lot of issues. They don't agree on how those issues are prioritized.

Which is fine except when white liberals approach it with a lack of couth and shout down a man who is speaking about issues important to him and those that he represents.

The optics on that are not good at all.

and with that...I'm going to bed but will check back in the morning.

[Hortensis]

19. But Chitown, if the "white liberals" in that arena had

shouted down anyone, the noise would have blasted the roof off.

This was a minority of Bernie supporters, not even most of them. We don't know how many of those were liberals, but given the confrontational, grievance behavior it seems probable most were from the farther/radical left, but also even perhaps some from one of the party's conservative factions. His movement is also a populist grievance movement after all.

And, yes, they were completely wrapped up in their own priorities and resentments, which could be a working definition of extremist behavior. Like these.

“This unity platform is ridiculous… It is a disgrace and I reject this platform entirely.” “If I were to be moved into that meeting blindfolded, I could not tell you if that was a Democratic platform committee meeting or a Republican platform committee meeting,” he continued.

“she took issue with many aspects of the platform, calling it “orchestrated” and saying that Sanders supporters didn’t have enough influence. “They threw a few crumbs out, but not enough.”

"would be voting down the platform because it makes no mention that Israel is “occupying the Palestinian territories.”

"she couldn’t approve a platform that doesn’t explicitly ban fracking. “We’re giving her the power to destroy this planet that we all share,” she said."

[Squinch]

25. They did it because, as always, they think economic issues that affect them are MUCH more important

than the civil rights issues that affect everyone else.

Same old same old. They never listened, and they never learned a thing. And they are the generation of "medals for participation" and no one ever told them before that they couldn't have what they want just because they want it real bad.

[Armstead]

30. No they are "economic issues" that affect EVERYONE, minorities especially

I won't defend the booing -- but at least get your facts right as to what motivates Sanders's supporters....as well as how Sanbders message is PRO the interests of everyone who is not rich and powerful.

[Squinch]

35. At that moment, something else was being discussed. Civil rights were being discussed.

The Trump trolls disrespected that. Like always.

To all but a few white men, that is a very strong statement of disrespect and disregard. It says, "Only my issues can be discussed, and if you talk about other things, I'll derail the conversation." And then others will come along and defend that disrespect as being something honorable. It is not honorable.

Same as it ever was. And my facts are plenty straight, thanks.

[Armstead]

36. I'm not going to defend the booing because I don't agree with it

But I just will not sit still for the perpetuation of the meme that progressive economic issues are just some ego game for privileged white people who are aggrieved because they no longer the only race at the table.

The ones who fall into that category are members of the GOP and/or supporters of Trump.

[Squinch]

37. Well there we agree. Only Trump supporters would boo when a black man is talking about

civil rights, because they can't stand that anyone will talk about anything other than their pet issue.

And of course you can sit still or squirm, whichever you choose. But those people were showing that they were privileged ignorant trolls who have no respect for issues that do not affect them directly, but that affect others profoundly.

[Armstead]

38. The behavior of individuals does not represent a whole movement

I basically agree with those who were chanting against the TPP. But I would not have chanted during his speech, and I might have told them to shut the fuck up during the speech if I had been there in person.

Political movements -- and parties -- are made up of individuals. Just like in any group of more than one person, even if they agree on many things, there will be people who are rude and obnoxious, and others who are polite and respectful as individuals.

[Squinch]

40. I never said it did. That is why I am careful to accurately name them Trump trolls.

But those people are disgusting to me. Just like anyone else who is actively working to elect a fascist.

AND PS: They are obviously a very small percentage of Bernie supporters. If the Bernie campaign had quashed these guys early in the process, and had disavowed behavior that disrespected people who are not like these Trump trolls, it is my belief that Bernie would have won the primary. And if the campaign had disavowed that behavior of this trollish fringe, I would have been fine with a Bernie win.

[tallahasseedem]

52. +1

[Petrushka]

47. FWIW: The chanting began at the moment he mentioned being "...proud that our party's platform . . .

. . . will help not the wealthy, not the one percent...."

So, yes, as you said "...something else was being discussed." but, at that moment, it wasn't civil rights; it was our party's platform, a platform he was in charge of drafting, a platform that does not include opposition to the TPP.

For that reason, in my opinion, the anti-TPP delegates believe our party's platform will help the wealthy and the one percent.

[Squinch]

48. Nice try. Look again. Here's what they were derailing by booing and chanting over:

"... We enact a living wage. It envisions a nation in which we eliminate the death penalty because we as Democrats, we value every life, black, white, Asian, every life. It envisions a nation where we do not have to choose between protecting the environment and creating jobs." And on from there.

There was nothing about that booing that was not entitled and disgusting.

[Chitown Kev]

49. POC understand this quite well...

It's not as if Cummings (or any other POC) is throwing the issue out there simply as a distraction...and ieven if they were, so what?

White people don't see the utter disrespect as being an issue

[Armstead]

59. I don't condone the booing.

I just don't like to see the motivations being mischaracterized.

Suppose Black Lives Matter had gone into the convention and protested? Would you have the same standards for civility for their behavior?

[emulatorloo]

62. False equivalency.

White people shouting down a civil rights icon talking about civil rights is nothing like BLM shouting down white politicians in power.

I'm sure if you think about it a little more you'll understand the difference.

I understand the impulse to justify the actions of the CA delegation and discredit DU'ers who find their tactics yesterday ineffective.

But I'm afraid you are at the point where you've dug yourself into a hole.

[Armstead]

67. No you are engaging in a double. Stsndard

Suppose BLM felt that some speaker, msybe Clibton, did not live up to their principles.and they got into the convention and started booing her and yelling slogans during her acceptance speech? ...You would consider that acceptable protest if you agree with them? But the Bernie supporters are just rude troublemakers if you don't agree with them?

Only hole I can see I'd the hypocrisy of selective rules of.good or bad behavior.

I already said I don't condone the booing.even though I agree with their frustration and snger....so my conscience is clear on that score.

[emulatorloo]

69. Sorry, You're calling DU'ers hypocrites based on an event that hasn't occurred

You've got a hypothetical future event that hasn't occurred , and you got hypothetical hypocrisy that hasn't occurred.

If it actually happens then we'll see how our fellow DU'ers react.

You hypothetically accuse me of a 'double standard' when I've always pushed back on those who try to smear and discredit BLM.

i never said your conscience wasn't clear, I said you were drawing a false equivalency between white people shouting down a civil rights leader and AA activists shouting down white politicians. The dynamic is not at all the same. I stand by that statement.

That's not an attack on you personally, that's pointing out what IMHO is a logical flaw.

We've had several exchanges over the years where we've had minor disagreements over tactics, strategies, viewpoints on events.

We agree on many more things than we disagree on. This is apparently gonna be one of those things we're gonna disagree on.

Take care and atriot:

[Chitown Kev]

66. It would have depended on who they booed and the overall situation

for example, former mayor of Baltimore, Stephanie Rawlings-Blake gaveled in in place of DWS. I was a little surprised that she wasn't booed.

That wouldn't have made me angry at all.

[Armstead]

68. If you acknowledge your biased, at least that is honest

If you don't agree with the priorities of the Bern supporters, okay. But I am just saying that the same standards of behavior should be used across the board...and also that the motivations should not be misrepresented.

[Skittles]

14. because they are sore loser ASSHOLES

[tallahasseedem]

51. +1

I was going to put that and then didn't. I'm glad to see someone did!

[tallahasseedem]

50. I don't know...

Lots of Bernie chanting, the others I couldn't make out. It just goes to show these people are rude assholes that don't respect anyone.

[Control-Z]

12. I'm so glad I didn't see it.

I'm tearing up just reading your post.

[DemonGoddess]

3. K&R!

VERY well said!

[JaneyVee]

4. I love you.

[BainsBane]

11. That PoC are the base of the party is precisely what pisses them off

and that is likely why they targeted Cummings. It's hardly an accident that the worst of their wrath is directed toward women and people of color.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

33. Exactly! Still upset that most of us voted for HRC.

[Starry Messenger]

41. Bingo.

[SunSeeker]

13. K & R

[Beacool]

16. I didn't know that this happened.

Disgusting behavior!!!! I bet it wasn't the Hillary delegates who booed him.

[unc70]

23. There appeared to be some Clinton anti-TPP hecklers

Opposition to TPP was stronger among Sanders supporters, but there were many No TPP signs among the Clinton delegates. The boos were not about race or civil rights, but about the platform.

[giftedgirl77]

29. Lol

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

32. Bullshit! Most Democrats are opposed to the TPP including HRC. The disrespect was about race!!

[unc70]

45. Not everything is about race

Too many things are. But in this case, Cummings was who had blocked the anti TPP plank in the platform committee. If he had been white, he would have received the same treatment from those opposed to TPP. The chanting was rude, but it was not racist. They chanted through various other speeches.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

46. No, not everything is about race, but THIS WAS!

[Hissyspit]

74. Rep. Cummings didn't think so. He said today he understood the protesters and their anger, and

equated it to his own youthful protesting.

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

75. He's going to be diplomatic of course.

[sheshe2]

73. His speech was about black lives, not TPP.

There is a time and a place for everything. This speech was not a place for booing. It showed complete lack of respect for BLM. They need to focus. It was inappropriate and disrespectful.

Also I saw some here today saying all speeches were booed. I heard from a member on the floor, they said only black people were booed.

[lillypaddle]

17. Great post n/t

[treestar]

18. +1

They should not have heckled him and would not have if they were real liberals/progressives.

[lovemydog]

20. k & r

[BumRushDaShow]

21. WORD.

I am STILL livid. It was a fucking disgrace. This, a man, who single-handedly took on the lunatics Issa and Gowdy as ranking member of the House Oversight Committee, and elegantly destroyed their kangaroo court proceedings. This is the man who battled on to speak when Issa was captured in this infamous pose-



For this fucking white privilege move-

There is no difference between the disgrace of the above and this -

FUCKING DISGRACE.

[CentralMass]

34. +1k

[BlueCaliDem]

60. + 2k. Disgraceful. eom

[RapSoDee]

22. Well said

[brer cat]

26. K&R

[Squinch]

27. As always Chitown Kev:

[liberal N proud]

28. Booing reflected more on the people doing that who they booed

They are a classless, despicable crowd and should have their credentials pulled at the DNC.

[La Lioness Priyanka]

39. Yup

[Liberal_Stalwart71]

31. Thank you because sadly too many people here at DU aren't getting it...or they're pretending not to.

[aikoaiko]

42. FWIW -- the chanting of No TPP begins when Cummings talks about the platform.

Cummings was the platform committee chair and he voted down opposition to the TPP because of the political reason that he didn't want to undermine President Obama.

The booing and chanting at this convention is to express disappointment about issues and goals. They booed Sanders for the same reason.

Having said that I understand why Black Americans would be distressed to see him interrupted with chanting or booed.

[Renaissance Man]

53. I'm an African-American, and I'm not distressed.

This is democracy, and honestly, what happened last night to Elijah Cummings is a result of 20+ years of triangulating and moving the party to pro-corporate positions to get Democrats elected. It was an open rebuke of the party's platform, which includes support for the Trans Pacific Partnership.

Unfortunately, our party's track record (vis a vis NAFTA, CAFTA, and a TPP in the balance) hasn't been favorable for working and working poor people, and this has caused a rift in some supporters who have no faith in Hillary Clinton because of her public support for these same trade deals (whether she was serving in elected office or not).

So, while I think that the optics were bad, I'm not going to be distressed over it, because party officials earned it.

[emulatorloo]

61. If I'm not mistaken platform is neutral on TPP. We know HRC Platfom/policy is anti-TPP

I listened to interviews with some of the CA delegation after the gavel. They seemed misinformed about several issues. I am sure they aren't representative of every Bernie delegate in CA delegation.

That being said I believe the Optics are important than you believe they are.

Attempting to shout down Cummings while he spoke about civil rights and BLM just does not reflect well on CA delegation.

To me it was a huge strategic blunder. That's not how you rally people to your cause, that's how you alienate people. They shot themselves in the foot.

[Renaissance Man]

63. I just reviewed the party's position on TPP in the platform.

You are correct. The party's position on TPP in the platform is neutral, but it wasn't that way for the party's nominee/standard bearer and the current Democratic president prior to the primary.

That also raises an issue of trustworthiness and honesty (of which our nominee is currently hovering at 67% of Americans view her as untrustworthy and dishonest), but I'm not trying to refight the primaries. That's what we'll just have to deal with this election.

[emulatorloo]

64. No interest in refighting primary either

Other than to note Sanders finds her trustworthy enough. Warren as well.

He was my primary pick, tend to believe him.

Take care and have a great afternoon.

[emulatorloo]

55. He was talking about civil rights and BLM

I understand the impulse to defend the CA delegation. I am glad you recognize how bad the optics were to see white people shitting on Cummings while he talked about civil rights.

[Chitown Kev]

56. Boo Cummings? Fair game

After all, he is a public official...

and in spite of the fact that, yes, Sanders and especially Elizabeth Warren was heckled, people notice (esp. when the TV cameras play it up) that most of those that were heckled were woman and POC...so it's not Cummings alone.

(Personally, I didn't mind the booing all that much after a while...at east the Dems were allowing the issues to be raised like the GOP and it did give the first night of the convention a feel of old-time conventions...some of the scripted choreography of more recent conventions made them quite boring...I am simply explaining why POC have a right to be upset).

[BumRushDaShow]

65. Is this black minister who gave the invocation a "public official"?

Did she deserve the bullshit? She was heckled by scum shouting "Bernie" through the latter half of her remarks.

She even commented to one of our local black papers before the convention, about the problem of racism and a "war on black people"... and those POC who went on first at the convention last night proved her point.

http://www.philasun.com/local/rev-cynthia-hale-dnc-war-black-people/

[Chitown Kev]

70. I never suggested that she deserved it....

I will say, however, that I am also partial to the idea that this is a democracy and democracies get ugly sometimes....I have no problem with pointing out that their booing of her (or Cummings) had a racist tinge to it and I have no problem with pointing that out...

I do have a little bit of a problem with people who think that a political convention should be all hunky dory and that some people should be untouchable...the purpose of this post was to explain at least part of the reason why black folks (and I am black, FWIW) feel the way that they do about the optics here.

You can't put yourself in the political spotlight for any reason and NOT expect some criticism.

[BumRushDaShow]

71. Understand the absolute zoo of these conventions

It is part and parcel of the sausage-making of our political process. However many of us remember the ugly and unfortunate imagery of the 1980 election and given the rancor during the campaign with respect to POC issues, it only goes to reinforce the divide.

[Starry Messenger]

43. I am livid.

I will never forget this, and white progressives who pugnaciously defend this behavior deserve to be marginalized forever.

[DemocratSinceBirth]

44. There are three predominately white parties

The Green party
The Libertarian party
The Republican party


It is actually good for us if those parties dilute their vote.

[sarae]

54. K&R

[wildeyed]

57. Sadly, I got to watch that in real time.

It felt like a kick to the stomach.

[kestrel91316]

58. It made me SICK. And I'm as white as they come.

They were an embarrassment like none I have ever seen before.

[lupinella]

72. K&R