Jewish Atrocities At Palestinian Village Of Deir Yassin, 65 Years Ago…And Today

[Purveyor]

--CLIP
The messy story that the President would not engage is that it was a tale of colonialism, nationalism, military gangs, and “Compulsory transfer”, what today we would call Ethnic Cleansing.

Palestine was ethnically cleansed of half of its indigenous population, who were made refugees in 1948. That population was replaced by Jewish immigrants from Europe, Russia, and Middle East. Kick out the Palestinian indigenous people, replace them with Jewish immigrants, to create a Jewish majority. This is the horror of 1948.

That fundamental injustice remains un-atoned, un-accounted for, and un-just. It also remain, largely unheard, in the American media.

Palestinians, and human rights activists remember. The annual calendar serves to remind them, and us, of atrocities that were inflicted on a defenseless population by Zionist terrorist organizations that were directly involved in the creation of the state of Israel. This is the origin of America’s “closest ally” in the region, this is the foundation of “the only real democracy”—so we are told—in the region. The origin is a tale of ethnic cleansing and murder.

MORE...

http://omidsafi.religionnews.com/2013/04/09/zionist/

[RedstDem]

1. the pro israel bots will be doing their best to rebuke this in

3..2..1

[Shaktimaan]

4. You mean the educated?

Why fear us so?

[cali]

9. fuck. I wish people would stop calling people who disagree with them

names. It's childish. It's dumb. It's inaccurate and in no way does it contribute to the debate here.

[GitRDun]

2. It is ironic

that a people who suffered at the hands of those who would exterminate them would employ the very same tactics to achieve their own state goals.

It is equally tragic that our media is incapable of telling the story from a broad perspective, rather than from a sensationalist view.

Great post!

[Shaktimaan]

3. Is truth important?

You think that any of the critical events recounted in the op are true? Is half true ok? How about all true but removed from context that greatly changes the event's meaning?

After all, didn't we gun down scores of helpless people in the past. By the thousands? Context: they were shooting at us. Important info to you? Maybe not.

that a people who suffered at the hands of those who would exterminate them would employ the very same tactics to achieve their own state goals

.


The same tactics? Like using guns and sneaking around and stuff?

How's that ironic? It was a war. It's not like there was overlap in nazi shoa techniques and Hagana war actions.

[GitRDun]

5. Context does matter

Let's get this straight, I hate BOTH sides! But spare me the context in this case.

No context can account for the stacked bodies, on either side...they are despicable!

I have no patience for either Israeli or Palestinian apologists...a pox on both your houses!

They come on this board and post all this long winded historical context that is nothing more than an excuse to either maintain the status quo or keep shooting at each other.

If neither side ever takes a chance on peace, you'll get what you have coming! More stacked bodies and more blathering about historical context!

Save it for someone who can't see the big picture...

[Shaktimaan]

6. The big picture, huh?

Wow. So you get the big picture without even needing to wade through all that boring-assed history garbage.

Very impressive!

So.. Dying to know. WHAT is the big picture?!?! And how'd you figure it out?

[GitRDun]

7. I figured out a long time ago

that the killing does not stop until we take a chance on peace, try to stop hating each other, learn something about your neighbor....non violent protests...reconciliation...Abe Lincoln knew all about reconciliation. As did Nelson Mandela post apartheid.

The Palestinians and Israelis are both fools...neither will get peace unless they change, from the bottom up.

Self righteous blathering about who is responsible for stacks of dead bodies advances the cause for no one.

[Shaktimaan]

8. Solet's see if I got it...

Before the killing can end, we have to cease being violent to each other.

If we can stop killing one another, only then is peace attainable.

And a path to less hate starts with getting to know one another. Learning about each other might lead to everyone hating others less.

How'm I doing? 'Cuz I have questions.

Abe Lincoln knew all about reconciliation

Didn't Lincoln impose his own will upon half a continent by starting a war and then staying the course until he won, despite the enormous bloodshed? That sounds different than your suggestion.

Should he have refrained? Then the black people would still be enslaved though. Surely you're not embracing that?! So what's the big picture there? Massive amounts of blood were spilled, but to attain freedom for the enslaved. Should the North instead have tried to get to know more about southern culture as they seceded from the Union?

Basically, why do you assume that the ultimate goal for anyone involved is peace?

If the Israelis and Palestinians wanted peace, then they would be pursuing fucking peace. Clearly peace isn't the goal.

And context and accuracy aren't just important. It's everything in these discussions. You just held up Lincoln as a man who quelled violence through understanding... which must be anti-Lincoln or something. Cuz real Lincoln started a war against his own fucking country.

And you called an OP that was riddled with lies and hateful propaganda, "a great post!" because you either didn't know that it was fictional or you didn't care. Either way, it's clearthat the only reason you can afford to preach "peace through learning about each other" is because you don't have a stake in this conflict. Details are only unimportant when they are details that only affect other people... as long as your dad getting shot or your house getting smooshed or your farm getting taken away or your jaw broken by a stone, are someone else's details, you can safely ignore them. But I'd love to see you sit there learning about someone in a barfight who has just broken your girl... no, your daughter's nose. What would your first nonviolent question be? And would you also deserve the bullet wound he might give you for acting less than non-violently? (As all the Israelis and Palestinians deserve what they get I mean, according to you anyway.)

And I'll tell you what REALLY is ironic to boot... that you're convinced that the key to attaining peace is for each side to learn more about the other, while you clearly can't be bothered to learn doodly-squat about either side. If you did, you'd know that we already DO know AAALLLL about one another. It's one of the reasons WHY this conflict continues.

Also, peace can't be attained without non-violence? Hahahahahahah! well, DUH professor!

[GitRDun]

10. Enjoy your hate

You are part of the problem.

[parkia00]

11. No shit.

And the Palestinian version of him. The first step to peace is to firstly see the opposite side as a people and not as an "it" or entity.

[Shaktimaan]

12. I don't even understand that comment.

Of course they are people. Beyond that I'm pro-Palestinian and I support their fight for a state and self-determination.

If you are unable to discern the differences between being realistic and being hateful then this may not be the conflict for you to delve into.

[GitRDun]

15. Realistic =

Status quo, more dead bodies...

[Shaktimaan]

13. Thank you.

But I have no idea what you're talking about.
Enjoy your ignorance however.

I find it interesting how whenever I challenge people's oversimplified ideologies with real life situations they label me racist or hateful or whatever. But pointing out the obvious fact that your ideas have no application to real life is not a hateful act. I'm merely educating you, which some can find difficult as it often forces them to re-examine long held constructs. But then, one can never grow if not through discomfort.

You openly shun education and then call me hateful for pointing out that you failed to grasp the entire point of the conflict. In that you fail to see either forest or trees. Merely your own outsized arrogance that YOU know the answer to the mideast conflict... without even studying it!

[GitRDun]

14. You are exactly the kind of commenter on this board I am taking about

It is not ignorant or an oversimplified ideal to believe that people can, if they want, put down the history and reconcile, move ahead together as people.

It is ignorant to feel that wrapping one's self in layers and layers of historical "he did this" and "therefore that" will solve anything.

I do grasp the entire point of the conflict...stacks of dead bodies, terror, fear, humiliation, anguish, and longing for something different. The Israeli's and Palestinians would serve themselves well if they understood this...

[Shaktimaan]

16. Woah...

It is not ignorant or an oversimplified ideal to believe that people can, if they want, put down the history and reconcile, move ahead together as people.

No. It's ignorant to believe that peace can possibly be achieved without acknowledging the entirety of that history. The purpose of history is not, as you seem to think, merely to justify unethical acts or bloodshed.

You mentioned Mandela but failed to note that a key aspect of his reconciliation program hinged upon revealing and acknowledging the wrongs previously wrought.

It is ignorant to feel that wrapping one's self in layers and layers of historical "he did this" and "therefore that" will solve anything.

It is far more ignorant if you think you could ever solve anything without using said history. Wrapping history pages around you seldom solves a thing. But reading them... that is the key to solving everything.

I do grasp the entire point of the conflict...stacks of dead bodies, terror, fear, humiliation, anguish, and longing for something different. The Israeli's and Palestinians would serve themselves well if they understood this...

So the Palestinians and the Israelis would be better off if they understood the point of the conflict they've been in for 75+ years. A point that evades all those involved, but you, somehow, possess. And it turns out the key was the avoidance of learning anything about the conflict beforehand.

And the point is... stacks of dead bodies?

Why does anyone want stacks of dead bodies? And if that's the whole point, then why aren't they making any of them? Comparatively, this conflict has very low casualties, hence, very, very few body stacks. Can you expand on this contradiction?

Oh, but the conflict's point is also stuff like anguish, terror and longing for change. Those are actually just emotions, none represent a cogent "point" that explains the reason for the conflict's origins or it's endurance.

That's like saying the point of the Vietnam war was negativity and boisterous. Hell, you'd probably agree with that assessment.

[GitRDun]

17. I won't comment further on your rant because you really aren't hearing me.

What I will say is that your aggressive words, right-fighting style, do nothing to advance your point.

Enjoy the day.

[Shaktimaan]

19. That's OK...

Because I know that the true point of your article is that I am totally awesome, good looking and you clearly wish to be much more like me.

Now, if only you were able to truly grasp the point of the post you wrote as well. Oh well, if you are eventually able to it might benefit you. You know, just like the Palestinians and the Israelis. (Sort of, anyway. Because I at least bothered to read your post before informing you what it's point truly was.)

[GitRDun]

20. Congratulations

Your ungracious response just got you on ignore list.

[Shaktimaan]

21. Cool debating style

Provoke folks by posting that they're full of hate or another provocation. When they respond by showing you how foolish your ideas are, shut your ears and eyes up tight, take yr ball and go home.

Consider this though. If you are unable to handle my mildly critical post without shutting down not just THIS thread, but ignore all FUTURE posts I might ever present EVAR, then you've really got no right advising the Israelis and Palestinians on how to best negotiate their lunch order, let alone peace.

Not to say I'm surprised. Lots of people seem to know the answer to a problem until they bother to learn a bit about it.

[LeftishBrit]

18. Did you actually read Shaktmaan's post?

What 'hate' did he express?

Basically, he claimed that the actions of both Israelis and Palestinians are at odds with the view that what they want most of all is peace; and implied that the same is often true of others in a war. Whether you agree with the post or not, I don't see how it amounts to 'hate'.

[Shaktimaan]

22. I admit. I just don't get it.

Was the actual Deir Yassin not atrocious enough? Why the need to invent an entirely false narrative in service of further demonizing Israelis? I honestly don't see the benefit in having supporters who are badly educated on hateful propaganda. They'll read this and when they later try and discuss it they'll perpetuate the stereotype that being pro-Palestinian means you know little about the actual conflict, and what you do know is mostly wrong, having been based on a false anti-Semitic narrative.

So tell me. What's the point of an article like this? Is the real massacre not bad enough unless they 'punch it up' first?

[shira]

23. There's nothing to get. It just is.

Not a Mistake, Misunderstanding, or Well-Intended Criticism But a Deliberate Campaign to Bash Israel



The first, most important thing to understand about the Western and especially American debate on Israel is this:

Never before in history has there been such a concerted, systematic, and vicious campaign to discredit and demonize Israel, especially seeking to undermine its support in the Jewish community.

Without comprehending this fact, the massive attacks from academia, mass media, groups, and even in mainstream political and intellectual debate cannot be understood. We aren’t dealing with lots of mistakes but with the mass production of hate speech.

Obviously, one should always judge based on the specific people and places involved. Yet a good point to keep in mind is this:

Don't believe that they may have gotten it right this particular time. Many of them aren't trying to get it right; most of them are incapable of getting it right.

These assaults cannot be taken in isolation and with naivete as if this time a wild accusation is accurate. Some are obviously outrageous—the British politician accusing Israel of genocide; a cartoon showing Ariel Sharon eating Palestinian children; Egypt’s president calling Jews sub-humans; the Swedish newspaper claiming Israel murders Palestinians to steal their organs—but even better-constructed items are equally fallacious....

...Not all are aware, of course, of what they are doing, especially those originating or spreading the more "moderate" hate speech. There are dupes as well as demonizers, though dupes often seem all too credulous to be wholly innocent.

Here are two more aspects:

Once having been defined as the "bad guy," Israel can be accused of anything, as in a film narrative in which the villain is, well, always villainous.

Second, Israel is one of the few categories that can be attacked with unbridled vituperation, though some limits still apply in American political life at least. You cannot say the slightest thing against other nations or nationalities, as well as races, religions, or genders. One wrong word, even if uttered carelessly, and the person's career is finished. With Israel, the bile can flow unbridled.

Equally, there are so many lies—new ones appear each day--and so many facts to counter them with that it is partly a waste of time to counter each offensive in itself. What’s necessary is to understand that this is all based on lies, ignorance, and conscious bad faith.

The categories include, but are not limited to, falsification of photographs and fabrication of events; distortion of history; making up of quotes; publishing disproportionate numbers of anti-Israel books and articles; indoctrination in schools; refusal to mainstream Israeli views and overwhelming emphasis of radical, critical ones; excessive credibility to hostile sources for outlandish tales (a worldwide story on an alleged, since proven false massacre in Jenin based on a single mysterious informant is just one example).

more...
http://rubinreports.blogspot.co.il/2013/02/not-mistake-misunderstanding-or-well.html