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malthaussen

(17,065 posts)
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 11:31 AM Apr 2016

Never trust an author

I'm sure this is only of interest to those who suffer from a terminal case of OCD, but I learned something today.

I've read a number of seafaring novels by authors who insist that sailors serve "in" a ship, not "on" a ship. Robert Heinlein comes particularly to mind, because he made a big deal about it and was himself a former serving officer in the U.S. navy, so presumably he knows what he's talking about, eh?

Except I was just reading a novel about the Asiatic Fleet by a gentleman who eventually rose to the rank of Vice Admiral and command of the U.S. 7th Fleet, and he speaks of sailors serving "on" the ship. Presumably, he knows what he's talking about, too.

So who's right? Fortunately, Google is there for us; alas for Mr Heinlein, it appears that according to the official style guide of the U.S. Navy, one serves "on" a ship:

http://www.navy.mil/tools/view_styleguide_all.asp

"Also, a Sailor is stationed "on," "at," "is serving with" or "is assigned to" a ship. A Sailor does not serve "in" a ship."

Since VADM Mack and ex-lieutenant Heinlein are also near-contemporaries, one cannot even conjecture that there is some temporal change to account for the discrepancy. Although maybe some writers of British naval fiction use a different style guide. In any event, here I have thought for some 50 years that one served "in" a ship. How too bloody embarrassing.

-- Mal

6 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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Never trust an author (Original Post) malthaussen Apr 2016 OP
could the difference be between ships and submarines? OriginalGeek Apr 2016 #1
I think it may be another case where the usage is divided by nationality catnhatnh Apr 2016 #2
I think so as well... malthaussen Apr 2016 #3
Never trust Robert Heinlein. Paladin Apr 2016 #4
Check out a few GD gun threads SwankyXomb Apr 2016 #6
One must simply grok Heinlein. In_The_Wind Apr 2016 #5

OriginalGeek

(12,132 posts)
1. could the difference be between ships and submarines?
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 11:43 AM
Apr 2016

Just taking a wild guess - never served anywhere past cub scouts/Webelos.

Heinlein's books were mostly in space so those ships might equate to submarines more than a surface ship might?

catnhatnh

(8,976 posts)
2. I think it may be another case where the usage is divided by nationality
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 01:22 PM
Apr 2016

I believe serving "in" is more a UK usage. Proof...not really but the WW2 movie "In which we serve".

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0034891/

malthaussen

(17,065 posts)
3. I think so as well...
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 02:11 PM
Apr 2016

... at least, every British author of sea stories I know uses "in" the ship. But that doesn't explain why American authors would use it, unless perhaps it's some kind of snobbery.

-- Mal

Paladin

(28,202 posts)
4. Never trust Robert Heinlein.
Wed Apr 6, 2016, 02:32 PM
Apr 2016

Isn't he to blame for that hyper-moronic "An armed society is a polite society" quote? Not even the pro-gun militants use that one, anymore......

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