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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsSun is setting on California's Daylight Saving's Time...
Bill to end daylight saving time passes California committee
With little debate, a bill to end Californias observance of daylight saving time cleared its first committee on Monday.
Assembly Bill 385 could make California the third state not to observe daylight saving time, in addition to Hawaii and Arizona. If approved by a two-thirds majority of both houses of the Legislature and signed by Gov. Jerry Brown, it would put a measure on the ballot asking voters whether or not the state should eliminate the practice.
Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article83558137.html#storylink=cpy
http://www.sacbee.com/news/politics-government/capitol-alert/article83558137.html
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I applaud this (and actually wrote my senator and congressperson a couple years ago about stopping DST), but I hope they consider keeping the set time in the DST hours: I don't look forward to a 4:40am sunrise in June (DST makes it 5:40am).
SunSeeker
(51,378 posts)Messing with my clocks all over the house every 6 months is a pain; and it's depressing how early it was getting dark in the winter.
nolabels
(13,133 posts)Or something like that. Anyway sometimes i don't set all of mine back or forward, whichever the case might be. Yea it's the pain in the ass factor but it also keeps me thinking and remembering, is that one on daylight savings time or not. On a side note, the clock in the Civic is twenty-three minutes fast. I leave it that way to help keep me being on time for my job. It's been that way for a couple years now
pokerfan
(27,677 posts)Just leave them clocks alone.
Tarheel_Dem
(31,211 posts)Travis_0004
(5,417 posts)I would love year round dst, but would be against getting rid of dst.
C Moon
(12,188 posts)etherealtruth
(22,165 posts)Its an antiquated concept serving no useful purpose in today's world
montana_hazeleyes
(3,424 posts)I guess I'm in the minority, but I love DST!
BlueMTexpat
(15,349 posts)wcast
(595 posts)Plus it is only 4 months of standard time here in PA, November to March. I say go the other way, keep DST and get rid of standard time.
Dark n Stormy Knight
(9,760 posts)I love it too! I much prefer to have more daylight at the end of the day than at the beginning. I'd be happy to have it year-round.
There are points for an against it, which vary from person to person, but I hate when people act like the previously standard non-Daylight-Saving-Time system was somehow more "natural" than DST. It's all a man-made construct.
moose65
(3,164 posts)Maybe I'm weird or something, but I've never understood people who claim that DST "messes with them" or something similar. Time is arbitrary anyway...at some point Standard Time was created by humans. The time on a clock isn't a natural thing. I prefer DST myself. I love those long summer evenings!
C Moon
(12,188 posts)The issue is adjusting to the the damn clock twice per yearlosing an hour of sleep every spring.
http://www.cnn.com/2016/03/11/health/daylight-saving-time-health-effects/
Plus, my dog is confused by it.
moose65
(3,164 posts)There is really no time lost - just the artificial time on a clock. I just don't understand it, I guess, since the time change has never really affected me. I just go to bed an hour earlier!
C Moon
(12,188 posts)Dems2002
(509 posts)I absolutely do not want to lose DST. I'm more than happy to keep it all year round, but I do not want to lose my 8pm light in the summer. I love it. I'd actually enjoy moving someplace even further north where it stays light after 9pm or 10pm.
Jim Beard
(2,535 posts)discntnt_irny_srcsm
(18,470 posts)According to the Solar vs Time Zone map, its about 2 hours behind what solar time would be during standard time which makes it about 3 hours back during DST. It's not that hot either.
Here's a pic of the airport:
Vattel
(9,289 posts)Dems2002
(509 posts)I was in Norway last year for the very first day of the midnight sun. And I was in Alaska a few years ago on the solstice. Love it. I am a night owl so it's amazing.
Jim Beard
(2,535 posts)If they vote against DST, the time will stay at the original settings year round.
There are so many more variables. I live on the western edge of the Central time zone on the long N/S Texas New Mexico Border where by geography and the Time Zone borders, the southern border of the Central Time zone is so much longer, it is almost 2 hours long. I add that most of that area is flatter than Kansas so there is no physical obstruction to make it it dark earlier.
If you live in a heavily wooded area mountainous area, the time darkness could be the same on both edges of the time zone.
Maybe we should just use our cell phones with a superdooper app that will calculate what time it is where I am standing.
BTW, I hat and always have hated DST
" target="_blank">Time Zones
BumRushDaShow
(127,317 posts)Ditto! I want my hour back and keep it that way!
MicaelS
(8,747 posts)Death to DST.
1939
(1,683 posts)was developed by the railroad industry. Prior to that, each locality set their own time by solar observation. Some agreed authority would determine high noon and set the "master clock" for the town and everybody would adjust their watches and clocks by that time. Early short railroads would decide which clock on their route was the "regulating" clock and set their schedule accordingly. The "railroad time" for arrivals and departures from Podunk might vary several minutes from the local Podunk time. A longer railroad journey which required several changes of rail lines en route required a detailed mastery of the concept of longitude. The railroads finally got together and developed the idea of dividing the US into four standard time zones. A lot of fundy preachers at the time would fulminate against the use of "railroad time" versus "God's time".
Jim Beard
(2,535 posts)Time Zones.
SleeplessinSoCal
(8,998 posts)Outdoor living is paramount in CA and taking away daylight hours after work is a negative. My sister will be extremely pissed off.
TreasonousBastard
(43,049 posts)for farmers years ago and they don't need it any more.
rurallib
(62,346 posts)sure doesn't jibe with my memories of farmers refusing to change clocks and screaming every Memorial Day when we changed time in Iowa. "God's Time" was a frequently used phrase around here.
TreasonousBastard
(43,049 posts)I thought I remembered something about harveting during daylight.
rurallib
(62,346 posts)Maybe the varieties of products in a California for instance would lend itself to DST better than the midwest.
We are kind of monoculture out here - we grow corn and soybeans for the most part and raise some beef, chicken, lot of pork and turkeys. So not a lot of variety that probably lends itself to a conformity on issues.
When I was young, we had county choice on DST, so we had different counties on DST - mostly along the Mississippi - and different start and stop dates. Man that was a hoot and a half.
At that time our legislature was mostly farmers and they kept trying to kill DST totally. I am kind of surprised we have it now to be frank.
Glassunion
(10,201 posts)inconsequential. We simply started working about an hour before sunrise, and would finish up just before dinner. Our schedule followed the sun, not the time on the clock.
BumRushDaShow
(127,317 posts)It was widely taught because that is the bull I always heard in school and while growing up too -
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/five-myths-about-daylight-saving-time/2015/03/06/970092d4-c2c1-11e4-9271-610273846239_story.html?utm_term=.f7707abf8d7e
And I was a junior high victim of the brief but ridiculous change to DST to start in January (1974), where as a city kid, I had no yellow school bus to pick me up at my door and had to catch public transit (a regional rail train and then a transit bus) to get to school and needed a flashlight to walk to the train station every morning. The street lighting back then was no where like you see today (which is often iffy at times too).
kcr
(15,300 posts)Like the one about school summer vacations.
BumRushDaShow
(127,317 posts)said that the biggest pushers of this were the Chamber of Commerces and retailers. Surprise surprise!
kcr
(15,300 posts)Now that almost never turns out to be a myth. You can pretty much count on that for a reason
1939
(1,683 posts)The origin of DST was to save electricity generating coal and was initiated during the two world wars. Factory workers found that they really enjoyed the extra hour of daylight in the summer and pushed for its continuance after WWII.
OnDoutside
(19,908 posts)former9thward
(31,805 posts)They don't need to wait for CA. AZ never had DST.
gratuitous
(82,849 posts)Or so I would hope.
When I was (ahem) younger, the changeover didn't affect me in any noticeable way. One day was pretty much like another. But as I've gotten to later life, that one hour of difference seems to have a terrible effect on my circadian rhythms for days. It might also be the difference in growing up just south of the 45th parallel and now living just north of it. As the days lengthen or shorten at the time of the solstices, I'm more aware of the time added to daylight or darkness day by day.
TDale313
(7,820 posts)That the rest of the country observed DST we'd actually be four hours earlier than the East Coast? That'd be weird too.
LWolf
(46,179 posts)messing with my body clock twice a year and pick a single time to abide by. I personally prefer DST, but I'd embrace either, if we could just stop switching.
The switch to standard time in the fall is the death of light for the rest of the year. It's dark when I leave for work either way for 6 months out of the year, but on DST, I get a bit of light when I get home, at least until December. On standard time, I only see my home in the light on weekends.
hunter
(38,264 posts)It would make more sense for any workplaces that benefit from DST to change their hours. Changing everyone's clocks for the benefit of a few is not fair.
NightWatcher
(39,343 posts)Travis_0004
(5,417 posts)In fact, since the sun rises later, farmers are more likely to work in the dark, or they have to get up later.
DST saves electricity, and allows for more daylight hours after work and school, which allows people to be more active.
BumRushDaShow
(127,317 posts)Congress passed the Energy Policy Act which extended DST by a month in 2005, ostensibly to save four more weeks worth of energy. An annual rite of spring, daylight saving time is also a matter of energy conservation. By having a little more natural daylight at our disposal, we can help keep daily energy costs down for families and businesses, Rep. Fred Upton (R-Mich.), who co-sponsored the legislation along with then-Rep. Markey, said in a 2013 statement.
But in a follow-up study on the effects of the extension, the California Energy Commission found the energy savings to be a paltry 0.18 percent at best. Other studies have indicated that people may use less of some kinds of energy, such as electric lights, but more of others. More productive daylight hours might be meant to get you off the couch and recreating outside, but theyre just as likely to lead to increased air-conditioner use if you stay home and gas guzzling if you dont.
A study in Indiana actually found a slight increase in energy use after the entire state adopted DST (for years, only some counties followed it), costing the states residents about $9 million; the researchers believed that more air conditioning in the evening was largely to blame. Thats a far cry from the $7 million that Indiana state representatives had hoped residents would save in electricity costs.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/five-myths-about-daylight-saving-time/2015/03/06/970092d4-c2c1-11e4-9271-610273846239_story.html?utm_term=.f97b977f6d77
The Indiana study is an interesting indicator given that they were one of the few that didn't fully adopt DST (and when it did, it was only recently - just 10 years ago).
With it being darker in the morning, there is this fantasy that people are sleeping in and no one is up using lights. You just shifted the light usage from the afternoon to the morning.
1939
(1,683 posts)You get up in the dark bedroom and stagger into the bathroom using only the little light over the sink. You go into the kitchen and use only the light there. Then you go to work. In the evening, you have lights on all over the house.
BumRushDaShow
(127,317 posts)I use the same amount of light day after day because I have used lamp timers for decades. And anyone living in a densely populated urban area or in an apartment with little access to sunlight, is going to put lights on regardless of whether it is standard or daylight savings time.
The bigger issue, which has somewhat been brought up in this thread, is that the outdoor light availability is not only going to vary depending on where you are in a timezone region, but also your latitude. For those who live in the furthest north of the CONUS, the amount of daylight can approach 20 hours in summer and only 4 in winter (where I live in Philly, the longest day length is about 15 hours in summer and only 9 in winter). I remember a couple of trips to Detroit in the summer (which is on the western edge of ET) and was surprised to see the sun setting at like 9:30pm, where here in Philly, it was setting almost an hour earlier. I think this may have been a similar issue with Indiana being on that western edge of ET too. And in places like Hawai'i, which is closer to the equator than the CONUS, the day length varies very little, which is probably why they don't use DST.
There has been much written about "SAD" (Seasonable Affective Disorder), where "light therapy" is often suggested, so you have some people using high intensity lights in fall through winter and into spring.
So wholesale ascribing some "benefit" to continually changing the time and messing up sleep routines, is disingenuous when you look at all the variables!
kestrel91316
(51,666 posts)that is no small problem.
The2ndWheel
(7,947 posts)Do away with those, and you don't have to worry about DST or not.
Ex Lurker
(3,808 posts)tritsofme
(17,325 posts)I'd take the extra hour of light at night in a heartbeat.
DST is great for the summer nights where it stays light until around 9pm.
At least in this part of the country, I think DST is great.
When people complain, it seems like it's about standard time, not DST.
Love to see the sun at 8:00~9:00 p.m. still poking around.
Makes Summer special...
Tikki
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)I live in the far west of the Eastern zone, and from September to April is dark when I wake up. Permanent DST would mean the sun doesn't come up until after 8 AM for nearly 3 months out of the year. Ugh.
Warpy
(110,913 posts)which is what happened in Boston. Standard time was brutal there and is through most of the northern part of the country.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)It's the getting out of bed in the dark that bugs me.
Goddammed seasons.
Adrahil
(13,340 posts)taught_me_patience
(5,477 posts)where they get home at 7:30. Yeah... I like the extra hour of sunlight when I get home so that I can play with the kids a bit.
Xithras
(16,191 posts)No DST means that the sun will rise earlier in the morning and set earlier in the evening. Daylight is generally more useful in the evening (in the morning you're typically getting ready for work, so you can't really make use of it).
Warpy
(110,913 posts)I hate the time change in the winter even though I can largely ignore it since I'm retired. It sill gives me fewer hours of afternoon daylight during which I can drive and do errands. I can drive at night in an emergency, I just don't like it since I don't see well enough.
Standard Time is fucking depressing, it feels like entering a long, dark tunnel that lasts for months. There is no earthly reason to change back to it. Just realize the time zones as set up were completely arbitrary and keep DST year round.
C Moon
(12,188 posts)LanternWaste
(37,748 posts)I suppose one imaginary measure of time is just as valid as another... or just as valid as separating it into two (or more) blocks. Or just as invalid.
It's all magical thinking regardless, and no doubt-- our personal (rather than collective) biases are formed more by individual conveniences than any practical consideration in the case of DST.
moose65
(3,164 posts)Split the difference. At the next time change, we fall back 30 minutes and leave it that way all the time.
That would be interesting.
DemonGoddess
(4,640 posts)can revert back to no DST, like it was for most of the state for a very long time. I HATE DST. Really screws me up.
JustABozoOnThisBus
(23,283 posts)All the advantages of DST (later sunset), without the semiannual jet lag.
C Moon
(12,188 posts)I just wrote Governor Brown and told him this.
I plan on writing the authors of the bill, as well.
It's doubtful it will do any good, but what the hell.