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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe Myth of America's Tech-Talent Shortage
by JORDAN WEISSMANN
So it turns out the United States is not, in fact, the educational wasteland tech industry lobbyists would have you think.
Companies like Microsoft often claim that America is suffering from an economically hobbling shortage of science, math, and computer talent. The solution, they argue, is to let employers fill their hiring gaps by importing tens of thousands of educated guest workers beyond what the law currently allows. Much as farmers want to bring in field workers from Mexico on short-term visas, software developers desperately want to bring in more coders from India.
The Senate's current immigration bill would grant their wish. As written, it vastly increases the annual limit on H1-B visas, which allow corporations to bring employees with a bachelor's degree to the U.S. from overseas for up to six years. Roughly half the guest workers who currently arrive through the program come for computer-related jobs. When Facebook CEO Mark Zuckerberg announced earlier this month that he was forming a political action group to back the reform effort, it was in part seen as a move to ensure that the H1-B provision would make it to President Obama's desk intact.
There's just one problem. That whole skills shortage? It's a myth, as was amply illustrated (yet again) in a report written by researchers from Rutgers, Georgetown, and American University, and issued by the Economic Policy Institute. It still might be the case that tech companies are having trouble finding specific skill sets in certain niches (think cloud software development, or Android programming), but there simply aren't any signs pointing to a broad dearth of talent.
Our Programmer Surplus
Colleges, for instance, are already minting far more programmers and engineers than the job market is absorbing. Roughly twice as many American undergraduates earn degrees in science, technology, engineering, and math disciplines than go on to work in those fields. As shown in the EPI graph below, in 2009 less than two thirds of employed computer science grads were working in the IT sector a year after graduation.
more
http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2013/04/the-myth-of-americas-tech-talent-shortage/275319/
femmocrat
(28,394 posts)Who doesn't know an unemployed engineer or tech-type person?
antigop
(12,778 posts)dembotoz
(16,786 posts)Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)Partisanship at its finest.
The shortage is absolutely real. The numbers in the OP are bullshit.
Um... no. Though it's true the IT sector is saturated, it's saturated with graduates at a time when IT in every sector is cutting back. The abysmal economy was rough on every sector, but far less so in engineering and other high-tech fields. Six years ago, every engineering graduate had multiple job offers, and firms needing engineers were struggling. Roughly 75% of the engineering grads had jobs when averaged over the past 4 years, and the demand is increasing again.
So, if you want to believe the rightwing bullshit aimed at cutting off immigration of talent into the US, feel free. Just recognize the flavor of the crap you're swallowing.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)If you have a problem with the author of this article's statistical analysis then where is your link to statistics that refute him? Instead you personally attack the OP and the Source plus other DU members who post here.
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)I really don't care what revered institution delivered this crap.
KoKo
(84,711 posts)Do you hear yourself? Do you read what you post?
uponit7771
(90,304 posts)n2doc
(47,953 posts)Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)Too bad.
malthaussen
(17,175 posts)Anybody can make stuff up.
-- Mal
ljm2002
(10,751 posts)...that means that roughly 25% of engineering grads did not have jobs.
That does not suggest to me that we need to import yet more techies from other countries to fill the available positions.
I am not against having some provision for foreign born talent to work here. But the tech companies are lying when they say they cannot find qualified Americans for most of their jobs. The tech lobbyists are pushing for more H1Bs so they can hire from out of country at a lower rate of pay.
Yes, I know they are supposed to offer the exact same rate of pay to both foreign born and American workers. However, given the current job market, what you have is the perfect means by which to depress the overall rate of pay: foreign workers will accept less and the companies can offer less than what they offered before, and American workers will take it too rather than have no job at all. It is a boon for tech employers and a sad reality for American workers.
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)Only read the stuff that supports your pre-conceived notions.
In the meantime, DU continues to joyfully carry the water for the rightwing. Mission accomplished.
ljm2002
(10,751 posts)...in support of your position. How is that cherry picking???
BTW, I've been a hiring manager, and have managed (and hired) H1Bs as well as American citizens. You?
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)"In 2005, George Bush stated, 'I am President of the United States.'" You would only read that I claimed that GWB was still president.
We're done here.
ljm2002
(10,751 posts)...you replied that I was "cherry picking" and that "in the meantime, DU continues to joyfully support right wing opinions".
Now first of all: I responded to a specific point, and you have not responded to the point I made, other than to object to my making it. Then you make a sweeping generalization about DU, laughably insinuating that the position against an increase in the number of H1B visas is a right wing position.
I responded by pointing out that my position is not taken out of ignorance of the matter. Now it is true, the fact that I've seen the issue up close and personal does not in itself make my position a correct one. It does, however, mean that you cannot simply dismiss my opinion as being taken out of mere ignorance.
But you're right about one thing: we're done here.
Arctic Dave
(13,812 posts)Declare a "shortage" then saturate the job market with foriegn graduates as to lower the salaries in the given field.
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)Arctic Dave
(13,812 posts)But that doesn't stop them from bringing in foriegn workers to saturate the job markets.
This has decimated the tech industry payscale and corporations are now adopting this strategy in other fields in the US.
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)Wow.
Arctic Dave
(13,812 posts)Maybe by the government but more people are in debt with loans for higher education. True story.
Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)Try to keep the conversation in the context of the OP.
uponit7771
(90,304 posts)...our own STEM base
Regards
uponit7771
(90,304 posts)Buzz Clik
(38,437 posts)There's a lot of argument on this thread for the sake of argument with no point whatsoever.
reformist2
(9,841 posts)reformist2
(9,841 posts)Wanna bet the numbers will be even lower??
Egalitarian Thug
(12,448 posts)because they don't want too many people learning how their game really works.
uponit7771
(90,304 posts)...be absorbed...1 year belies the shortage myth no?
tia
dawg
(10,621 posts)who will work 60 hours a week for $28,000.
I was all ready to type out a "what are you talking about" response, too!
Taverner
(55,476 posts)See Chinese and American Railroads for a lesson in Capitalism after slavery is outlawed
KoKo
(84,711 posts)we had to be more competitive with the global market and it wasn't fair that Grad Students from other countries come here to get educated but go back to their own country to work. He felt that it was important for there to be opportunity for them to stay here so we can be competitive. That was code for "they will work for less here...because it's more than they make in their own country" and drive down our own Educated Work force salaries because of the competition from those willing to work for less.
He also said Liberal Arts degree isn't helpful when we need those who can do the jobs of High Tech like Coding and Programming. So sounded to me like all us Liberal Arts grads should just turn ourselves into math whizzes and retrain into coding and programming or we will be working at Burger King if we are lucky enough to get a job there.
His view of the world is interesting.
Manifestor_of_Light
(21,046 posts)One, a B.A. in biology back in 1980. I went to a liberal arts college that did not offer the BS degree at the time. I interviewed for a job with some idiot that implied that a BA was less than a BS.
I informed him that the college I graduated from did not offer the BS. He ignored me, like all bosses and authority figures have, over the course of my entire life.
Second useless degree, a Juris Doctor back in 1985. Never got a job as a paralegal or anything else, except a crappy temp job.
I had a database entry job once where we had to go through ancient gas leases and enter the information. You had to have either a bachelor's degree or a law degree to understand what you were inputting. It was a weird combination of using legal knowledge and utter drudgery. I was barely able to stand it. It lasted about three months.
Basically, I feel like I wasted all the years I spent earning those two degrees. They don't hire physics/math majors either.
They told baby boomers we needed to earn science degrees because of the space program, and beating the Russians. However, they did not hire us after we became the best-educated generation in American history. They waste us and toss us out.