What it was like growing up with a "gun nut" as a father

[Robyn66]

Last edited Sun Apr 28, 2013, 01:11 PM - Edit history (1)

I have posted this before, but sometimes I feel like we have people on here who should see this, so I post it again. Not for sympathy or "atta girl's" but because people need to see that there is another dimension to the gun problem in this country
Peace

----------------------------------------------------


The purpose of my posting this was to show that behind the facade of the "responsible gun owner" can be something all together different. There are a lot of survivors of abuse by gun nuts. Many people said that my father would have used a knife or something else if he didn't have guns, but that is just the point. He chose guns, he loves guns, guns give him power that nothing else gives him and that is intoxicating. You can hold a 16 year old girl by the back of the head by her hair and put a gun to her head just imagine the power of life and death you have. My father loves to be the hero to other people, I was in marching band in high school, and there were kids that didn't have parents come to the competitions or got sick or something and didn't have a parent there, well my father was there to be parent to everyone. Everyone told me what a great dad I had and I would see him comforting these teenage girls who were crying or whatever and he just loved being the hero but at home he was all together different and especially when he had his guns out.

So please, I hope other people see this and really look at it and don't say that he would have used other things to intimidate or abuse because he didn't. He didn't use a knife, he never beat me, he CHOSE to use a gun because that was what he was about.


My father has always been a gun nut.

I don't know how many guns he has now but I guarantee its enough to arm a small country and he has some pretty serious big weapons. I don't know what they are but they are big. I think he has an AK 47 among other assault rifles.

My father has guns of all sizes, he never leaves the house without one. He has a holster and a gun that will fit just about anywhere and he just needs them, he used to talk about "protection" he had his "going to Lowell" gun and his "going to Boston" gun but when he went to my wedding, my mother's funeral and my nephews baptism carrying a gun the reasoning wore thin.

When I was growing up it wasn't easy.

When I was a teenager, I actually never did anything or went anywhere but my parents always said I was "bad"

one day, after I refused to break up with a boyfriend they didn't like, I found myself being dragged in to the kitchen by my hair. My father was there and I suddenly had a gun in my face. I was told that if I didn't break up with the boy he would disappear.

There was another time when I was 16 that he kicked in the door of my room and unloaded an entire gun full of blanks at me, and he thought it was the funniest thing in the world. I ended up with PTSD.

I wanted to run away and thought about it and even planned it out a couple of times but I didn't want anything to happen to the people I would run to so that was what stopped me. Any time I got too close to someone or if it seemed I was going to run I would be told that people could always be "taken care" of.

Roughly 6 years after I got married my mother died at the age of 51 of lung cancer.

Then my father started to drink too.

I have two brothers who lived with him at the time, one still does.

He would get drunk and shoot bullets in to the floor and leave the casings around and think it was funny for my brothers to see it.

He would call me drunk and tell me he was "playing with his guns" to the point that when the phone would ring I would turn white start shaking and practically throw up.

Now you may be wondering why I didn't call the police on him. Well that's just the problem. He was a cop at the time, so there would be no way that would work out well.

We finally moved away, and my father remarried. I keep my kids away from him because he still drinks and plays with his guns but he tells everyone I am a real bitch to keep his granddaughters away from him.

My childhood was abusive in different ways but I think the gun thing was almost the worst. I have tried to talk to him about it and he alway says 'parents make mistakes' he has never acknowledged the damage he did and says I never could take a joke.

Now if you ask the other cops and a lot of people on the outside they would all say he is a "responsible gun owner" he locks them up and stores them correctly but he was not behaving in a responsible manner as far as I am concerned. But there it is.

A while ago I sent a friend an e-mail about how important it is for a girl to have a good father. I don't know if he knew all of this, but having a bad father is just about the worst thing in the world.

He is very ill now and I won't have him completely out of my life until he is gone. Fortunately I have an amazing husband, father in law and children not to mention friends who have helped me stay a loving person and not descend in to bitterness and anger but believe in love and be sure my children are raised knowing nothing but love and safety and how a woman should be treated

[MineralMan]

1. I'm very sorry that was your experience growing up.

That must have been awful, to say the least.

[aikoaiko]

2. I'm sorry to hear that your father terrified you like that.

I too seek to raise my son knowing nothing but love and safety and how a woman should be treated.

[femmocrat]

3. Thanks for sharing your painful experiences, Robyn.

You were indeed fortunate to turn out so well. He will pay in eternity.

[Mnemosyne]

4. Having a bad father is the worst, Robyn. I had two, one a gun nut and pervert, the other just

a cruel pervert that liked guns.

I allowed men to treat me the way my fathers had, because no one told me it was wrong. Finally figured it out, though rather late in life, and kicked all the abusers out of my life.

I'm alone too much now, but it sure beats walking on eggshells.

I hear you.

[Jenoch]

5. I am sorry your father treated you so badly.

However, he did not treat you badly because he owned guns. He treated you that way because he was a bad person.

[gussmith]

22. Please pay attention.

Please don't switch the message to what you want. The writer is saying that guns were an intimidating, horrific fact in her upbringing. She stresses that her father could have used any means but that he chose guns to threaten her. Guns.

[Jenoch]

28. Did you read the headline she wrote

for this thread? She seems to be blaming guns for much of her father's behavior. There are bad people out there, including bad people who are cops. This thread should be about bad people, not about guns.

[cui bono]

33. Did you read more than the headline? n/t

[Jenoch]

34. Yes.

[Freddie]

6. Similar experience growing up

Not with guns, but my father was a very well-liked, even beloved, person in the community--a teacher, the kind kids could talk to and parents loved and respected. At home he was a mean, verbally and occasionally physically abusive bully. This was in the 70's when you didn't talk about this kind of stuff to anyone, no one would believe you anyway. Now he's in his 90s with dementia; people often stop and ask about him and tell me how much they loved him.

[Robyn66]

19. Fun isnt it?

My father is very ill too. I hear a lot of the same things I try to do the things I should for him so when he dies I will be able to live with myself but when the son of a bitch dies it will be a big relief

[PatSeg]

23. That is part of the whole power thing

Make you look crazy, unstable, and ungrateful to the rest of the world. It is scary to imagine how such minds work.

[raccoon]

32. I feel your pain; I grew up in the 50s and 60s and you sure didn't talk about that

stuff then. And, as you said, nobody would believe you anyway.

[freshwest]

36. +1

[AverageJoe90]

47. Too many people just weren't willing to come to terms with that back then.

After all, this was, and still is, is something that only happens to a minority of people overall, as large in numbers(perhaps as many as around 10 million, I'd wager) as that minority may be.....just as AIDS, ASD, or Attention Deficit Disorder sufferers, or, African-Americans suffering under terrible, grinding poverty & institutional + social racism in the South. And that's perhaps the biggest reason it's taken so long.....that, and the fact that the media rarely ever had the bravery to bring to attention the worst of these abuse cases until maybe 20 years ago; same general lack of exposure happened with the suffering of African-Americans as well.

[raccoon]

60. Society was in a lot of denial back then about abuse within the family. The women's movement

had a lot to do with that stuff coming out in the open.

[OwnedByCats]

61. I have an ex that was like that

He actually worked as a victim support counselor at a police department, which was pretty ironic considering how badly he treated me. One of his pet names for me was the "c" word. He was verbally and emotionally abusive. He was controlling - I couldn't talk to other men, I couldn't even have girlfriends. He was extremely jealous and dictated to me about what I could and could not do - such as what I wore - even though I was already a pretty conservative dresser, nothing skimpy but of course that wasn't good enough. He would not let me wear make up even though I hardly used any to begin with. He tried to control everything, all the while treating me like crap, calling me every name in the book and everything was always about him. Pure narcissist through and through. I had never been treated like that by any other man before him or since so it was hard for me to blame myself. I did my best to not get him riled up but it became impossible. I loved him but eventually he killed it. Weirdly enough, he didn't own any guns and wasn't a fan of them. However that is probably because one of his ex's tried to kill him with a gun. Gee, I wonder why. Luckily I got out before I lost that much of my mind.

However, seeing him do his job - you'd never know he was such a tremendous dickhead abuser. He was great. That was one of the reasons I fell for him. He treated me well at first and progressively he got worse and worse. I only wished he treated me even just a little, the way he treated perfect strangers.

[Lizzie Poppet]

7. Booze + guns = bad situation.

So very glad you made it through!

[appal_jack]

8. The abuse you suffered was unconscionable.

Sorry for your pain, Robyn. The abuse you suffered was unconscionable.

I've posted plenty of pro-RKBA perspectives here at DU, so maybe you consider me a 'gun-nut.' All I will say here though is that any of us who aspire to truly be responsible gun owners must do much, much better than the example your father set. None of the behaviors you describe can be described as responsible.

Whether there are guns in our homes or not, staying a loving person, not descending into bitterness or anger, and raising our children with love & safety are worthy ideals for us all.

-app

[Robyn66]

12. The people I think are gun nuts,

Are people who think that ANY kind of regulation or record keeping or screeing is unconstitutional and that feel they NEED to have a gun with them at all times. My father is a coward who uses the potential deadly force a gun gives him to make him feel BIG and tough. So can you BLAME the gun? No, a gun is an inanimate object. But to some degree having so many guns available to be in the home contributed to his abusive nature. If as a cop he had to keep his weapons at the station he may have not had the balls to be an out and out abuser. Knowing him the way I do, he is a pretty miserable human being UNTIL the guns come up. Then its like they are majic. He touches them and his eyes light up, and not in a good way. It is a fact I cant get through to people. They think I blame the guns. I blame what the guns do to him and someone like him shouldnt have guns in his home. And there are more people like that than you think. People who accumulate massive piles of guns have the potential to be like that. I am not making accusations all I can say with my experience is there were never enough guns, never big enough guns, never destructive enough guns.

[appal_jack]

35. Sounds like neither of us thinks the other is a nut.

Sounds like neither of us thinks the other is a nut.





-app

[Robyn66]

41. thanks!

[Skittles]

52. YOU KNOW IT, ROBYN

I commiserate with you and hear you

[nolabear]

9. You could be describing my mother's father, including being a cop. It scarred her badly.

In fact the legacy lives on. When I was a little girl we were badly frightened by an episode on a visit, and I refused to ever see them again. He died not too many years after so I managed to keep that vow.

It's true a bad man is a bad man, and might use fists or knives or whatever on the truly helpless around him, but it's also true that guns extend the reach of a coward, so they can comfortably belive they can get to you but you can't get to them. It makes acting out a lot easier. And in my opinion, whether everyone has the right under law to own a gun, there are people who should not ever, ever have access to them. It's a problem with no solution under American law, and I have no suggestions except that we should provide access to help for girls like the one you were and no stigma about reporting it and trying to help everyone involved.

I'm terribly sorry for what you went through. I'm glad you have people. My mother's family didn't, and the depth of the repercussions was awful.

Peace to you, Robyn

[Robyn66]

18. There was no safety for someone like me

If I had run away or gone to another police department, my parents would have either been arrested (which I never would have wanted, which is typical for abused kids) plus we wouldn't have anywhere to go so we would have ended up in foster care. OR which is more likely, my father's police connections would fix it because I was "a liar who was looking for attention and Oh how they have trouble with me".

I would be picked up and my mother would be crying and my father would be silent because he would be furious. I would be threatened with being sent to juvenile jail as a delinquent.

My mother would cry and tell me what a whore, a disappointment, a liar I was and I had humiliated her to the whole town. We would get home, she would tear every picture of me off of the wall and throw it in the trash. Someone would grab me by the hair and they would start yelling at me about how none of that ever happened and how had they raised such a liar and that I was disgusting. My father would say (as he had in the past) I could run away but I could only take with me what I came in to this world with. Which meant I would have to strip naked to leave and would never be allowed to come back. My mother would still be screaming and crying about what I had done to her and how she couldn't hold her head up I was a whore failure a flop a disappointment and she wished i was never born. Nothing I ever will do will be any good because only good people do good things.

(BTW, the paragraph from my mother on down, after the "juvenile delinquent thing" is real. THis routinely happened to me if I got a bad report card, if they found out I was planning on running away, or after my guidance councilor found out I wanted to kill myself. I never told my parents I got raped because I figured I would really get it then and I was too afraid.)

So If I was lucky, that would about end it and I would only have the silent treatment from my mother for a couple of months and I would just hide from my father. I would have to sneak to the library for any contact with friends.


So unless there would be a way to truly get that kid OUT and AWAY its better to survive where you are than cause trouble.

[nolabear]

38. That's the lack of help and the stigma I was addressing.

I'm not at all saying that you didn't do what seemed, and might have been, the only choice you had. It was a terrible one, but I understand it was what you could do. I'm not shocked, but am deeply saddened by what you went through. You had to have been a strong and resourceful girl to have survived it.

[Robyn66]

42. Thank you

ANd that isnt how I took it at all. I just wish with all my heart there was a way or a place for someone to run to but unfortunately a kid in my situation was screwed. I really appreciate your kind words.

[timdog44]

10. Thanks for the post.

I am sorry for your experience. It takes a lifetime to overcome this kind of trauma, if ever.

Also sorry for the response of the person who denies that guns played a roll. A bad person + guns = more than just a bad person. I would say you are fortunate to still be alive.

[Robyn66]

83. Thank you!

I feel very fortunate to be alive. I have realized that I am a very strong person and one hell of a survivor and if I teach my daughters nothing else its to have self resepct and demand it of the men in their lives. I want my girls to grow up strong. I am so glad they arent going to grow up damaged.

[Pelican]

11. Sad... His defining characteristic is not gun owner...

... but rather abusive asshole who also is a bad gun owner.

[liberalmuse]

13. Thank you for sharing.

Just reading your story made my stomach drop. I'm so sorry that you had to go through this. The episode where your father unloaded blanks at you is terrifying. A child should feel safe, and when they don't, it causes so many lifelong issues - like PTSD. It's even worse because your dad was using his fixation with guns to frighten and manipulate you. I'm glad you have the support of friends and family now.

Gun enthusiasts don't like to blame guns, but I think nolabear's post up above explains things beautifully.

[spanone]

14. k&r...

[Maraya1969]

15. Thank you for telling your story. I am so sorry you had a father like that.

My father was abusive in a different way but I can identify with waiting for them to die. I was relieved when my father died. It took about 10 years before I could start to miss the good parts of him, (and there were many good parts). After my father's death I remember one of my friend's telling me that he did not have one single enemy and I thought, (yea, except in his own family)

[freshwest]

37. +1

[zeemike]

16. What a horrible way to grow up.

I am so sorry...
My childhood was not all sweetness and light ether...but nothing like that.
But my father and everyone in my family had a gun...everyone I knew had a gun...growing up in Montana in the 50s it was as common as a hammer.
But no one I knew fit the description of a gun nut....most had one gun they used for hunting...My father had one gun...it was a 1903 Springfield that he carried as a Marine in WW1...as far as I know it was the only gun he used for hunting.
I never saw him or my brothers ever play with their guns...usually they stayed in the back of the closet until time to hunt.

So it is interesting to me to wonder where did this gun nuttery come from and more importantly WHY.
Because it is a dangerous sickness and we should find out what caused it....it is the first step when you want to cure an illness.

[Robyn66]

21. And I am not anti-gun at all

My beloved falther in law has guns for hunting as does my husband. But the difference is, they are tools not objects that grant power.

[PeaceNikki]

40. VERY well said... "they are tools not objects that grant power".

ex. actly.

Thanks for sharing your story. I'm sorry you had to go through that and glad that you're happy and have support and love now.

[OwnedByCats]

62. I wrote a message

but I deleted it because I think it came out wrong. I said it wasn't the guns, that he was just crazy and that's why he, at least the impression I'm getting, was obsessed with them, which I think is part of the crazy factor. He could have just as easily been a knife collector. After having read your further comments, I can now see that your overall view is not as simplistic as saying they are primarily the reason your father behaved that way.

I'm sorry that happened to you. My mother grew up in the 50's and 60's with an alcoholic mother. There didn't seem to be any help for kids in those days.

[heaven05]

17. I

know the scary feeling a child has in not knowing what the mood of the parent will be as he/she was returning from school, or that parent in coming home from work. I do understand your pain. There was always a gun in our house that we were reminded constantly that it could "take us out of here", my sister and myself. May you keep healing.

[Faygo Kid]

20. Wow.

My father was an abusive drunk who thankfully left the family when I was 10. I saw him once more, at 22. Then he died. Long story, but I can relate to your experience with your miserable excuse for a father.

P.S.: Mom was a saint. So very sorry your mother was a miserable human being. Take care.

[BlancheSplanchnik]

24. I feel you. No guns in my house, growing up, but the sickness was there---so many similarities--

only my mother was the twisted one.

I can only say, "I identified very much with your story"

I know about PTSD and a life of not knowing what's going to happen next, but it will probably be catastrophic, not knowing what's ok, what's normal, and fear fear fear all the time.....and it doesn't disappear once you're grown up.

We deserve medals for working so hard all our lives, determined to become decent, capable human beings, don't we?

And, I gotta ask--HOW did you manage to find a good partner????? I've been trying for 40 years and I still keep falling for biiiiiig mistakes! Now I'm alone, and I AM getting bitter.

[Robyn66]

43. I will explain :)

When my husband and I met we were both 18. I know there are people who are atheists here and I dont mean to offend anyone, but God or something brought him in to my life. There is nothing else I can say to explain. He loved me in spite of my wierdness and worked through my crying at night and terror of certain things and stuck with me in spite of the times I tried to break up with him and divorce him. His family is as normal as a normal family can be and his father is the kind of father eveyone should have. I ADORE his father. My husband and I have been together 28 years total, 22 of those married.

I dont know what brought him in to my life. But I thank my lucky stars. I also had years and years of therapy to make sure I didnt continue the cycle of abuse. I hope you can meet someone who will love you the same way my husband loves me.

[OwnedByCats]

63. Well no matter who or what brought him

to you, it was time you got something good out of life. Perhaps it was God's plan to give you something great after enduring such a traumatic childhood.

[Oakenshield]

65. God's Plan?!

I'm so sick of hearing this garbage. No God worth venerating would tolerate the kind of abusive childhood like Robyn66 suffered. Period. To Robyn, I can only say how sorry I am for the terrible hardships you endured growing up.

[OwnedByCats]

75. Get a grip

She mentioned "God or something" brought her husband to her. She even said she meant no offense by saying that - and then you have to rudely barge in over a comment from me to her that wasn't meant for you. I wouldn't dream of mentioning God to someone out of the blue to anyone I didn't know because quite frankly, some athiests can be downright nasty to anyone who dares to invoke God in reference to their own beliefs - and you just displayed perfectly what I mean. I couldn't give a shit less if you don't believe in God, that's your business and I wasn't talking to you anyway. I don't go around here trying to get people into religion or lash out at athiests for what they believe. You believe what you want - I just don't care. Oh and this isn't a criticism of your beliefs btw, it's about how you conducted yourself in a subject matter where it doesn't belong. Start your own thread about how "I'm sick of hearing this garbage" if you feel the need to vent.

You have every right to believe or not believe, it makes absolutey no difference to me, but have the same courteousy to afford that right to others also.

[DrDan]

76. well said . . .

I am not a believer, but am often stunned by how self-absorbed many in this group can be. Always about them and their beliefs without showing any respect to the beliefs of others. Some here feel it their mission in life to lead others down the true path of non-belief.

[OwnedByCats]

80. Thank you

I most appreciate your understanding. Reasonable people can disagree about religion and still be respectful. Much appreciated!

[AndyA]

25. I guess most times I assume gun crazy parents raise gun crazy children

At least, in most cases. Do you mind me asking how your brothers feel about guns?

I find it very disturbing to see small children posing for pictures with a gun. Obviously, guns consume the parents lives, and they're teaching their children to be just like them. Adoration of a thing designed to inflict death.

I'm very sorry to hear about the fear and abuse you went through growing up, but I'm glad you're keeping your children out of that situation as much as possible.

My Mother was killed in our home when I was 17. The person who killed her was also highly thought of in the community, went to church, knew the local law enforcement, etc., but when they had a gun they were a different person. Add excessive drinking to that scenario, and it's a bad situation.

Having good parents was something I took for granted growing up. There was never any abuse in our home, and both of my parents were very loving and interested in seeing that my brother and I had a balanced, happy childhood. I never knew abuse even existed, and for that I'm very grateful.

Thanks for sharing your story, Robyn66.

[Robyn66]

30. Good question about my brothers

My youngest brother whos is an incredibe father and nurturer wants nothing to do with guns. He didnt have much directed at him. I am the oldest, he is 9 years younger than me. I went off to college during my brother's growing up time. Both of them screwed up worse than I did grade wise, yet they went through nothing like I did.-Go figure.

The Middle child is a Sword-nut. He still lives with my father. He is going to kill someone some day. He is undiagnosed Aspergers and is incapable of taking care of himself. My father and his wife (only 5 years older than me, how creepy is THAT) havent gotten him the help he needs. He is a horder and simply isnt able to care for himself. I absolutely cant intervene. I have an intense job that I love, plus a daughter with Aspergers and another with ADHD so I cant take on one more responsibility.

But Middle brother takes out his Katana swords and just swings them around and one day he is going to kill someone. THose swords also make him feel like a Big Man. I am not sure weapons of ANY kind should be purchased without background checks of somekind or mental health checks but that is another argument.

But the three of use have formed a very strong bond and I love them and they love me and we all love our children. We all protect our children fiercely and have made sure the cycle of abuse stopped. And I cant say enough about my husband who has been amazing and the reason I am alive today.

[99Forever]

26. K&R

[CarrieLynne]

27. Background checks arent enough, we need drug and alchohol testing and license renewals....

I understand your pain....my STB ex hubby passed the background check of cource, but was an alchoholic and would get drunk several times a week and turn into Billy BadAss...put the loaded glock in the back of his pants and wander the house getting drunker talking shit about nearly everyone and how he was gonna 'fuck em up' if they fuck with him....
One day at 7am he had been up drinking all night, certain that the roommates stole some tools from him the day before....I went down into the garage to do some laundry and found the gun painted in my face....he thought I was someone else I guess....but it goes to show u how easy it can be to make a mistake while intoxicated....
I left two weeks later....soon after that he shot a hole thru the bedroom cause he was trying to clear the chamber and didnt think it had anything in there....brilliant...

I think handling firearms while intoxicated should be a crime....like DUI is....

[Taitertots]

29. We need to imprison and/or treat dangerous maniacs.

Arbitrary and capricious regulations on the 99.9% of gun owners that are not drunk losers won't stop people like your Ex from hurting their friends and neighbors.

An important question that I'd like to ask is: How many times did you witness your Ex breaking the law and how many time did you call in to report these violations?

In Michigan it is already illegal to handle a firearm while intoxicated.

[CarrieLynne]

44. it never occurred to me that what he was doing was breaking the law, since we were at home...

[itsrobert]

31. First step in gun ownership recovery is admit to being Emotionally Unstable.

These people who cling to their guns need professional help.

[Thinkingabout]

39. Thanks for sharing, your defination is the same as mine. When someone becomes a different

Person when they get a gun in hand, this is a gun nut. My father had guns for hunting though he would probably used them in defense of his family and always stressed safety with guns. He was not a fighter but liked to settle differences diplomatically and then be able to be the good citizen he lived to be. The gun nuts apparently do not have the capability of negotiating civilly.

[rl6214]

45. The problem with your father isn't guns

The problem is he's just mentally unstable.

[badtoworse]

46. Your father was not a responsible gun owner; he was a bad person that owned guns.

The key point here is that he chose to intimidate you instead of loving you and respecting you. The way he chose to do it is of secondary importance - a good father would not have done that.

I'm sorry that you had to deal with that growing up. I was blessed with a wonderful father, who, unfortunately, has passed on. I wish you could have been as lucky as I was.

[Pale Blue Dot]

50. I doubt you would say "the way he chose to do it is of secondary importance"

If he was holding a gun to your head.

[badtoworse]

56. You're right. A razor at her throat would have been much better.

Last edited Mon Apr 29, 2013, 08:33 AM - Edit history (1)

ETA: He was threatening her life with a lethal weapon. That is atrocious conduct for anyone, let alone a father doing it to his daughter. What difference does it make what weapon he used?

[AverageJoe90]

48. I had a bit of a dysfunctional family growing up.....

....and I have some issues of my own.....but nothing quite nearly as bad as what you went thru.

My god, Robyn, I am so, so, sorry. To be perfectly honest, I can't imagine going thru all that intact and I fear that if I had, I might have snapped a long time ago.
You are certainly stronger than I am, IMO, without a doubt.

But, at least you have a loving family(and great friends!) now.....

[olivelove]

49. What a monster!

sucky because you only get 1 father.

[hrmjustin]

71. Welcome to DU my friend!

[Robyn66]

73. Welcome to DU!!

That is why I value my Father in law so much. He is the epitome of what a father is supposed to be and he is just amazing. I also had a grand-uncle who I adored. You can only imagine how pissed my father was when he heard my eulogy for my uncle when I described him as "my hero". He was BULLSHIT! But he has absolutely no self awareness of what he did.

[flvegan]

53. How much of this is really about guns?

Sorry to be blunt.

[dogknob]

54. Guns are a symptom of a larger problem in the OP

I had an abusive gun nut (and alcoholic) father. The man was a racist; a conservative, despite being snuffed out of his career by younger conservatives; and a homophobe.

He pulled strings so I could go to high school in another district with more white kids... and the joke was on him when I began dating Jewish girls.

When my mother finally left him in 1994, I hadn't had much contact with him. He came over to my house and we spent a few hours together... "no I don't know where she's [my mom] staying..."

Then he pulled out a 9mm pistol and shot himself in the head in my living room.

He had been marginalized. His beliefs were irrelevant. He needed to be in power (and fearsome [= respect in his mind]) one last time.

I know why the shooters are shooting. I know why they do it. I've seen it and lived.

We're just gonna have more and more of this as more and more men begin to feel marginalized and irrelevant.

[Robyn66]

57. Boy that is pretty close to my father!

Maybe its just me but I cant see how anyone can see that it isnt about the guns. I know I am too close to it (obviously) but remember he COULD have beat me, he COULD have threatened me with a knife but he didnt And let me assure you it is much more terrifying to be a 16year old girl with someone grabbing you by the hair with a gun to your head.

My father threatened to shoot himself several times yet never did.

[treestar]

67. Having a gun pointed in your face is not about guns?

The guy would have been a jerk without guns, but the guns made his jerk-dom scarier.

The one about shooting the blanks at her - that had to be terrifying. That was about the gun.

[TampaAnimusVortex]

68. I guess the gun jumped up and pointed itself at her?

Quit trying to take the responsibility off where it belongs fully. The father owns it. No one, or no thing else.

[treestar]

69. But the father used guns, which are specifically scary

And used to kill or main or injure, with relatively little effort on the part of the holder of the gun.

[pipi_k]

72. So are

fists.

And beer bottles slammed into someone's face, breaking that person's jaw.

And hands wrapped around a person's neck so tightly they leave huge purple bruises.

And a car speeding down a parkway when your drunk father stomps on the gas pedal because he's pissed that your mom isn't driving fast enough.

That person's father used a gun to terrorize, but the problem wasn't the gun, any more than the problem in my house was a beer bottle...or a car...or a pair of fists...or whatever else happened to be lying around close at hand.

Literally anything can be...and no doubt, has been...used as a weapon at some point.

Whether someone has a gun to my head or a knife to my throat, the level of fear is going to be the same.

[treestar]

74. The guy had guns around the house

If he had fists or cars that's something used for other things. He specifically used guns to terrorize his daughter. And guns have only one use.

[TampaAnimusVortex]

82. So would that apply to swords and maces?

What about catapults? Crossbows? Certainly not the dreaded Nunchaku?

If your only definition here is that you are going to make things illegal because they only can be used for killing or maiming, your going to have a much larger fight on your hand then just people who enjoy owning guns.

[treestar]

84. Maybe, but those things all require some effort, too

Way more than shooting people does.

[Robyn66]

85. Why are people not getting what I am saying

Its the easy AVAILABILITY of guns that contributed to what I went through. He COULD have hit me he COULD have done lots of things but he didnt he USED a gun.

He has been maintainiong the facade of the "responsible gun owner" but he just isnt.

I dont't know I guess I give up. I am just saying there are lots and lots of people who have access to high powered weapons and large numbers of guns, they get them legaly, they look like they are responsible and they arent and maybe if you didnt have military weapons around or maybe track how many guns some one has and QUESTION WHY they might have 30 or 40 guns there might be some good somewhere.

[treestar]

86. It is crazy

Someone who comes and hits you, you could survive. Or a stabbing. But someone pointing a gun at you can kill you. You would have been way more aware of that than if someone is coming towards you with anything else. I am sorry for what you went through. It must have been terrifying.

[nikto]

55. The only answer for many gun nuts...

A foolproof penile enlargement system.

Hangup cured.

[lunatica]

59. Thank you for sharing this

I know how hard it is to share our childhood traumas, but there is always someone out there that is benefited by it. And it goes a long way towards making people understand.

[marble falls]

64. He would have been as bad without the guns. My father wasn't to the degree yours was....

he finally made some serious change literally overnight in his fifties. He stopped drinking in one day. It was very hard to learn not to allow him to steal my joy and I left home at 17. And there was an eight year period we did not speak a word.

[pipi_k]

66. Except for the gun

your childhood sounds pretty similar to mine.

My father was an alcoholic. His problem was exacerbated by prescription meds, and a work schedule that rotated on a regular basis (swing shift) so that he never got proper sleep, and had to resort to his assortment of pills to help him cope.

If I merely told the things he did, people would think he was a monster as well, but he wasn't.

His mom left him when he was five years old. He did get a stepmom soon after, and while she was a very nice lady, she wasn't his mom. His father was an alcoholic who would just as soon backhand one of the kids as try to reason with them.

He grew up during the Depression era. The family was poor.

And he spent some horrifying years in Belgium during WWII. He said very little about his time there. I know it traumatized him.

He was a man of honor, truly he was. He was intelligent. He could be incredibly funny at times.

But he terrorized us for years until my parents divorced when I was 13.

He didn't use a gun, but the damage was just as traumatizing.

I spent my childhood (and lots of years afterward) walking on eggshells around people, never knowing how to act. Being afraid that I would say or do something that would cause someone to hit me.

People who live with abuse...they might not die physically, but they do die spiritually.

[FairWinds]

70. Thanks Ms. Robyn

You were quite correct to make the connection between mental illness and attraction to weapons.
I am a Vietnam vet, and I have family members who use firearms on their farms for hunting and varmints.
But nonetheless, I can tell you that on some level guns are for cowards - and so are nuclear weapons, Abrams tanks, and killer drones - for starters.
Not all gun owners are mentally ill, but a WHOLE LOT of mentally ill folks are attracted to guns.
I'd also suggest that Robyn re-work the post into a newspaper Op-ed. Her views deserve wider circulation.

[Robyn66]

79. You hit that one on the head

My father is a Vietnam Era Vet. He was in Germany. ( I was born in Germany) I have pictures of my parents actually happy and I was the base princess when I was born.

He never went to Viet Nam he was sent to Georgia after I was born when the rest of his unit(I am not sure of the right word) went to Viet Nam and he always said he wished he could have gone. But who knows he is a pretty bad liar too. I know he was a failure at it.( I found disciplinary letters in his army stuff when I was looking for his discharge papers to use to help apply for a scholarship.)

So thank you for being a good father. You have done more good than you know!

[liberal N proud]

77. What a horrible experience

As a father, it tears me up to hear stories where other fathers have not treated their daughters with respect and held them up as their princesses.

Every girl deserves to be treated like a princess by their father, where he makes them as happy as he can and showers them with praise and does everything he can to boost their esteem.

I would hate for my girls to be afraid that I was calling them. My relationship with them is too valuable as is their welfare.

[Robyn66]

78. I would hate to tell you my memories

Cowering my room being screamed at, I was raped at 14 and didn't DARE tell my parents because I KNEW it was my fault some how. I could tell you things that would make your blood run cold. I am so glad you are a good father. Good fathers are so incredibly important in the life of a girl. I don't know how I wound up with my husband. I was so blessed. The boys I dated were shit (thus the rape) A father teaches his daughter how she should be treated by the men in her life in personal AND professional relationships. If you are raised to believe you are shit you believe it so completely that you don't even realize what you are putting up with until someone on the outside sees it happening and confronts you and tells you its wrong.

[smirkymonkey]

81. How horrible! I am so sorry for your experience.

You did not deserve to be treated that way. He is a very sick man. I am so glad that things are so much better for you now.

[Robyn66]

87. Seems like every day

more gun nuts more death. Now a 2 year old little girl because of gun nut parents. "They thought the gun was in a safe place" and now the 5 year old has to live with killing his sister.