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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsObama's Fault
Last edited Sat Apr 27, 2013, 03:48 PM - Edit history (2)
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Liberal Librarian ?@Lib_Librarian 1h
So the ENTIRE FUCKING SENATE votes for FAA bill, and yet, of course, it's Obama's fault. Yes, paragon Bernie Sanders (Elizabeth Warren) acquiesced to the bill.
related:
No benefit in Obama vetoing furlough fix of FAA employees
http://bobcesca.thedailybanter.com/blog-archives/2013/04/faa-suspends-all-furloughs.html?utm_source=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_campaign=faa-suspends-all-furloughs&utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=twitterfeed
Skittles
(153,111 posts)the point is, there will be EXCEPTIONS for the cuts that affect the wealthy
Response to Skittles (Reply #1)
Post removed
AnotherMcIntosh
(11,064 posts)Lady Freedom Returns
(14,120 posts)But it is Obama's fault...
"But he could veto it!"
But the Congress would just override it. But it is Obama's fault...
Ya know, it would be a big help if more people would start calling/e-mailing their reps and make sure they know where we stand. The other side has got their people doing it all the time. And we all know that it is the squeakiest wheel that get's the most oil.
Our work STARTS at the ballot box, not ends.
Skittles
(153,111 posts)helps much more to have BIG MONEY
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/04/24/opinion/budget-cuts-minus-the-inconvenience.html?ref=todayspaper&_r=1&
Lady Freedom Returns
(14,120 posts)The best and cheapest way the Big Money does what they do is to get people out here to call on their reps. on their behalf.
We need to start doing more in mass. Those that are calling/e-mailing can't do it alone.
In truth those that do back the Big Money is a small number, but they are louder. They are always at it, due to the pressure/fear indoctrination of the big money.
We can, if we gather our numbers again, make those fearful voices of the minority. We can do it, we have the numbers, but to many have given up. We must get the word, the fever, out their again.
Big Money is counting on us not calling/e-mailing so their small numbers will be able to keep looking like the majority. I say we start disappointing Big Money and get our voices loud again!
Whisp
(24,096 posts)that's why the teabaggers and their minions keep on crossing the lines - they are not threatened.
Sorry to be such a pessimist - but if public opinion on better gun laws was so high and the shits don't care about That - that just tells you they are not afraid of 'the people'. They have it in the bag, another way has to be found.
Skittles
(153,111 posts)people get tired of seeing no results for their efforts
Cha
(296,840 posts)the President does.
From the link..
Both sides are the same is a terrible message to present at a time like this.
Fuddnik
(8,846 posts)Translation: They were all meeting with donors somewhere else, and they didn't even take a vote.
If one. Just one Senator had objected, it's a fail, and they would have to discuss and vote on it.
So, Obama doesn't get ALL the blame. He could have still vetoed it, and they would have to really vote on it. The totally dysfunctional Senate shares some of the blame with Obama.
Cha
(296,840 posts)As for the idea that President Obama should veto a bill that would end the furlough of FAA employees there would be no benefit to doing so.
The bill passed with a solid, veto-proof super-majority, so even if the president felt inclined to veto the bill in the interest of negotiating a broader deal, he would have nothing to show for it other than weeks of bad press. And make no mistake the effects of FAA furloughs on the press almost certainly played a role in how quickly they were averted.
thanks for the link, bigtree.. It wasn't just getting the planes on time. There are Safety Issues, too.
In one case, it said several flights headed for Long Island MacArthur Airport in New York were diverted on Wednesday when a piece of equipment failed. "While the policy for this equipment is immediate restoral, due to sequestration and furloughs it was changed to next-day restoral," the union said.
http://news.yahoo.com/senate-passes-bill-ease-faa-furloughs-005441034--politics.html
freshwest
(53,661 posts)Last edited Sat Apr 27, 2013, 04:59 PM - Edit history (1)
The price of gas just went down in my area:treestar
(82,383 posts)Cha
(296,840 posts)"This is a one-off case, if you will," he said, adding "the sequester itself cannot be finessed. It is having negative consequences around the country."
http://www.politico.com/politico44/2013/04/wh-warns-against-piecemeal-sequester-fixes-162731.html
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)a damn thing about it. Explain being "firmly against" while signing such a bill?
Seems that the often used rationalization that the "GOP made him do it" wont work in this case. Seems the Democrats made him do it.
And the "he had to sign" because there was a veto proof majority is bullshit. He could at least show the America people that he is looking out for us. It would have been a good lesson for Congress to delay their vacation flights to override his veto.
Seem the buck doesnt stop at Pres Obama's desk.
Cha
(296,840 posts)for a reason. Looking at the WHOLE PICTURE of the FAA. Good for them.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)hurt by sequestration and maybe we could get something done. How naive. I will tell you about the WHOLE PICTURE, the 99% are getting screwed. And either the Democrats are complicit or they're being played like a Stradivarius.
I wonder if the airline industry will send the checks to the Congress-critters homes or their offices.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)And, if he wanted it to pass he wouldn't have been held to blame when it did.
Cha
(296,840 posts)It wouldn't have been worth it,
The only ones who are "blaming him" are the ones who aren't looking at the whole picture.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)He could have vetoed it and avoided the "blame".
Cha
(296,840 posts)reallocated. It wasn't just travelers who were affected.. there were Safety Issues, too.
The "left" can blame him all they want. I don't really give a shite. Blame away.
bvar22
(39,909 posts)The RICH can BUY exceptions to The Sequester so that they don't have to suffer the slightest inconvenience, while The Rest of Us pay the bill.
The Whole Point of The Sequester is that Everybody Suffers!
Making special exceptions for the RICH kinda trashes the whole thing, doesn't it?
[font size=4]Its "The Uniquely American Solution"!!![/font]
You will know them by their WORKS,
not by their excuses.
[font size=5 color=green]Solidarity99![/font][font size=2 color=green]
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Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)Why don't you throw Bernie under the bus too, at least be fair.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)Why did Bernie and Elizabeth Warren cave? And if they are for it, why aren't the DU progressives OK with it?
They must be thrown under the bus too.
Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)I have no idea why they caved. Politics-as-usual would be my guess.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Tierra_y_Libertad
(50,414 posts)woo me with science
(32,139 posts)No wonder your eyes are spinning.
When you spend your time trying to create a cult of personality around individual politicians, of course it throws your argument off when someone insists on focusing on the merits of issues instead, and rejects a third grade rhetorical attempt to suggest that they have been trapped or embarrassed if they don't approve of every single thing that politician ever does or says.
You see, that just made your argument look foolish, and juvenile. Just like the cult of personality.
Fuddnik
(8,846 posts)He's not a REAL Democrat you know?
Bernie didn't vote for it, he probably threw up and said "fuck it". There was never an actual vote taken. It was done the cowardly way. Unanimous Consent. That way every one can blame everyone else.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Why is it such a bad idea, if Bernie was OK with it?
IMO it is a shallow reaction to simply condemn it. There are a lot of reasons for airports to remain functioning.
Fuddnik
(8,846 posts)Talk about shallow cults of personality.
treestar
(82,383 posts)It's not about where I stand, it is about where Bernie stands. There must be some reason the airports are fundamental to the economy.
Fuddnik
(8,846 posts)SammyWinstonJack
(44,129 posts)AnotherMcIntosh
(11,064 posts)what Obama is doing, then we can respond similarily.
This it's-somebody-else's-fault or someone-else-did-it should stop. Truman wouldn't have passed the buck to someone else.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Though I think Truman is wrong in that. We should not allow the presidency that much power and it doesn't have it under the Constitution.
Why should Obama veto it if he thinks it is the right thing to do? The argument here is about whether it is the right thing to do. When the usual bellwethers of all that is Truly Progressive don't have a problem with it, then maybe there is no problem with it? Maybe it's not just to benefit the rich, or why would not Elizabeth Warren speak out? As Senator she can afford to do so more easily than the President. Same for Bernie.
AnotherMcIntosh
(11,064 posts)Since when, if ever, has the Obama-is-the-greatest camp ever admitted any error that can be laid at the doorstep of Obama?
Obama did not close Gitmo? Oh, that's the Republicans' fault.
Obama participated in giving hundreds of billions of dollars to the banksters? Bush did that before Obama took office.
We are mired down in Middle-East wars and occupations? It started with Bush.
Even with the planned cuts to Social Security. The Republicans wanted to do this first.
For some, nothing is ever his fault. For some, the buck never stops at his desk.
treestar
(82,383 posts)But about the fact that apparently the Doyens of all that is Progressive Agree with him in this instance.
So we could as easily say those who blame Obama for everything and find him wrong every time. can't stop doing it even when he and Progressive Icons have the same opinion.
Number23
(24,544 posts)Obama is so wrong so often that even when Sts Bernie and Elizabeth agree with him, he STILL has to get the fucking blame for doing something wrong. Even if no one knows precisely what the something wrong is, that damned Obama MUST be blamed for it.
treestar
(82,383 posts)It must be necessary.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)has no responsibility here? I find that very interesting. He admits that we shouldnt let Congress fix the sequestration piecemeal but apparently isnt going to do much about it. This is exactly what the GOP wants, once again. Funny that.
"Dont look at the President signing the bill, look over there at Sen Sanders and Sen Warren. Blame them, blame someone."
Cha
(296,840 posts)Dems were on the same page.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)Complicit is the word. We're fucked.
Cha
(296,840 posts)treestar
(82,383 posts)But for those who are, why should not every Senator be "blamed" too?
And people who think Elizabeth Warren is their White Knight, what do they have to say about it?
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)Piecemeal fixing the sequestration is the Republican Dream and now the DEmocrats bought into it.
The whole purpose of the sequestration was to spread the hurt around hoping that hurting the 1% would force the Repubs hand. But the Democrats screwed themselves. Sure it was necessary to fix the FAA. But how are you going to help Grandma? School children? Vets?
I expect the president to lead the party and stand up against the GOP. Pointing out that Sen Warren made a mistake doesnt reduce the president's responsibility.
treestar
(82,383 posts)that's the shallow, knee jerk thinking. The economy must keep cranking, especially due to the sequester. Some things are pivotal and safe air traffic is one of them.
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)We must keep the corporations making profits or it will hurt the 99%. That is the number one goal of Congress. You think that is a little knee jerky, well that's what deniers have been saying for the last 30 years. Compromise, compromise, this is better than something worse. And now look where we are.
It's just about time for another bank bailout. I cant wait to see how the deniers rationalize that. "It's not just for the 1%."
Our democracy is crashing and the deniers are saying, "it could be worse, it's not Obama's fault, it could be worse." I hate to tell them that someday it wont be able to be worse and the revolution is going to happen with or without them.
treestar
(82,383 posts)Of course all businesses have to make a profit, or they close and hire nobody. What compromises would you not make to stop people starving in the streets? There comes a point where the 1% can have all the crap they want, so long as others are not suffering. You're the obverse of the people who can't stand to see anyone get a penny they didn't earn in relief.
SammyWinstonJack
(44,129 posts)He is the ultimate victim.
How sad is that?
Either for him or his ever faithful supporters.
It's getting ridiculous.
Cha
(296,840 posts)Elizabeth, Bernie, and all the others Dems are in agreement on this.
I take their word this is the best way and it makes sense to me.
From the OP's link
Both sides are the same is a terrible message to present at a time like this.
ProSense
(116,464 posts)why some refuse to call out Congress, especially given the level of outrage some of these votes spark.
Unanimous Consent-- If Not Courageous
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022763819
Congress votes to reduce or repeal the estate tax (something the President has been trying to fix), but it's Obama's fault.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&pid=2757685
It's great that members of Congress speak up on key issues, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be held accountable.
I mean, some key Democrats are trying to repeal the medical device tax that in part funds the health care law. They're not even putting forward closing a loophole or other tax to replace it.
freshwest
(53,661 posts)Media is paid to push all the buttons of low information voters and build up some as heroes and tear down others as villains. They are never going to go to the final tally, intentions and compromises to be made.
And the big picture, never. Each of these actions are part of big picture of making government work and the media is not about showing how government works. More like showing every flaw, as their owners believe. If they don't find something real, they will push conspiracies, but it all has the same effect. The strategy is to portray government as an alien entity, against the people, when it is not.
That takes time and reflection and morevoer, good faith. Not a sound bite delivered between commercials to a public used to instant gratification and going with a short attention span.
Their scripts are written against progressives. It wasn't just CNN who declared Obamacare dead before the USSC said otherwise. FOX also went with that script. They parroted the thinking of their billionaire owners. They were sure they had it in the bag, just as they were sure Obama was going to lose the election.
So a public who is looking for a fast answer, picks Obama as the target of all that goes wrong. It's quicker and easier to equate our elected officials with 'them' and corporations and lobbyists for those who haven't worked in these processes.
We can all get into a group and lobby. But we have to organize, commit to spending time and making meetings and friends, and not shout our heads off online or run away. That's what media is telling us to do. If we don't get what we want as fast as the news cycle turns, some of us just give up. And we know exactly who that serves.
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)need this information!
Fuddnik
(8,846 posts)The same one from Florida, who aided by Bill (DINO) Nelson pushed through a new Florida Democratic Party Chair, who used to be a lobbyist for ChoicePoint, and her husband was on the Bush legal team during Bush v Gore.
That leader of the Democratic Party? Debbie Whasername Schlitz?
MannyGoldstein
(34,589 posts)The most influential Democrat of all?
rhett o rick
(55,981 posts)Fuddnik
(8,846 posts)It's a pretty big pile.
Oh! That other guy!
n2doc
(47,953 posts)Anyone who thinks this can be placed only on the Repubs heads is fooling themselves. The way this went down meant that congress and both parties get the blame. Obama at least complained in his address today that the sequester should be entirely dealt with, not just a piece.
Everyone who does pay attention to these things sees that CONgress can work swiftly, and efficiently, and in a bipartisan manner. But only when it is something that directly affects them. Everyone else, especially the powerless and poor, gets the slow shaft.