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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsMy Two Guys At A Golf Course - Obama Taking My Social Security Meme.
What I was relaying in that post was the fact that I hear that kind of chatter all the time. These guys have not been the only people that I hear saying such a thing. What gets my attention is how so many crazy memes stick in the heads of voters that are not true.
Now it is hard to be sure what the hell Obama is up to with his rhetoric and his proposals. We can see how his Social Security adjustment before 2010 went over. Even though what he did was positive for Social Security the fact that the GOP so distorted the rhetoric that the Dems got their clocks cleaned in that cycle. The $700 Billion savings in Medicare ended up being called a cut. Obama and the Dems seemed to stay flatfooted rhetorically on the issue. They never seemed to aggressively correct the media on the issue. They just seemed to believe that "seniors would understand". Well they didn't and the GOP controlled and directed the rhetoric and created a meme that stuck in the minds of seniors and other voters.
The CPI suggestion that he made in his budget is worse and can be more easily twisted. And we see that the GOP is already doing it. Triangulation and supposed three dimensional chess is bullshit. Saying what you really mean is more important.
I have not seen Obama say unequivocally and unconditionally come out and say he does not support raising the Medicare eligibility or even touching Social Security as a non starter. His rhetoric seems weak to me or he seems ambiguous. Even
suggesting any support of reform that even approaches anything ever suggested by the GOP is a problem.
The only reform he should even mention is raising the cap on Social Security taxes to $250,000 or more. And the only thing he should support is fully funding Medicare or even proposing Medicare for all. Playing this centrist bullshit is a nonstarter.
A lot of seniors understand that Obama has been on their side but those that do now must wonder since he says we need chained CPI. That is a damned cut. Obama did not get the majority of the senior vote in 2008 or 2012. Many did not get it that the GOP has been the villain.
A lot of younger people believe Social Security and Medicare will not be for them. Obama needs assure them it will be their and propose policies that will guarantee it.
This "mamby pambyism" and bipartisanship has been a loser and it compromises Dems in general.
My post is more than just about two golfer I know personally expressing their sentiment about Social Security. Obama is allowing the GOP to control the conversation and the Dems are not a lot better.
These destructive memes continue to thrive. And it is much harder to defend Obama on some of these matters when he seems to confuse things by his actions and rhetoric. He is like Clinton in that he keeps giving the GOP ammunition on Social Security and other matters.
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bullwinkle428
(20,629 posts)memes that have absolutely not even a tiny shred of credibility, knowing that some if not most of their followers are ever-willing to latch onto the most desperate little snippet of trash. However, when the President chooses to be somewhat ambiguous, the argument becomes that much easier to lend credence to, and the mouth-breathers are now totally "fired up and ready to go", leading to something like what we saw in 2010.
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)2010 because not enough Dems bothered to vote.
TheMastersNemesis
(10,602 posts)When Rahm Emmanuel said, "Fuck the progressives they have no where else to go", he pissed off a lot of Democratic voters who wanted the public option in ACA. When the White House pretty much said the progressives were irrelevant and you don't get everything you want the it was demeaning. So people sat out. When you go out of the way to say fuck your base your you hurt the entire process. Without progressive votes Obama could have never won.
Trashing you base is stupid and idiotic. The "third way" strategy is just plain crap. It is a loser first last and always. Perhaps it worked for Clinton, but he ended up passing NAFTA and signing a lot o GOP legislation that has pretty much wrecked everything. Because of Clinton Gore lost. Had Gore been able to run the campaign he needed the vote would not have been close enough to steal in the first place.
Too many Dems are still running like GOP lite. And if the public does not see the value in progressive labor and economic polidies, they they will work for nothing and deserve to. Conservative economics only favors the super rich.
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)right now I am pissed at the Chained CPI idea and the drone war. But by not voting do we get all the shit Dems can drop on you you add all the shit the newly elected Repubs now drop on you. It's called cutting off your nose to spite your face.
Life is not about getting your way it's about playing the best game you can with the hand you are dealt
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)They got their clocks cleaned because millions of 2008 first-timers realized that "change" wasn't forthcoming, and thus decided that they'd go back to not voting. If the president and the Dem Congress (we had both houses in those two years) had completely repudiated the Repukes instead of adopting their policies and "meeting them half way", we'd have had those millions of votes locked up for a decade at least. Record numbers turned out in 2008 to put a halt to what had happened in 2000-2008. Lots of them figured out before 2010 that the current Dem party had no intention of taking the program away from the baggers.
upaloopa
(11,417 posts)That less people voted Dem in 2010 than in 2008?
I know why less voted but that doesn't make it a lie to say many Dems didn't bother to vote in 2010.
randome
(34,845 posts)The positions you list are sensible and would likely be supported by the general public. But they would fail in the House. All of them. For better or worse, you do not push policies that you know will fail.
Proud Liberal Dem
(24,399 posts)Until Gallup or other organizations start polling people and getting results showing that large amounts of people believe this, I'll start worrying. I don't know these two people but did they *ever* support President Obama or do they just listen to Faux News all day and regurgitate their talking points? Did they buy into that whole ACA "Medicare cuts" lie that the Republicans pushed in the last election? Other than talking about slowing the COLA (which didn't exist for the first 40 or so years of SS BTW), what else has he specifically proposed/agreed to that would irreparably harm Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid (which ACA expands)? Has he supported privatization? Has he talked about raising the age limit? Has he talked about doing ANYTHING on the level that that Republicans actually support or at least talk about supporting (but lack the cajones to actually propose)? Some people here act as though he's proposed something that will shred the program and/or that he is practically lusting for a chance to cut all of these programs, a hair brained idea if there ever was one IMHO.
Doctor_J
(36,392 posts)he should have stood behind Candidate Obama who declared there would be no benefit cuts.
SalviaBlue
(2,914 posts)"so many crazy memes stick in the heads of voters that are not true" is because so many people consume talk radio.
I am sitting in my office in an office complex with my door open. In the last 2 hours, I have heard at least 4 four cars come in with Rush Limbaugh blaring.
I think people like to think they are up to date on what's going on and right wing talk is always there to fill you in. In my town there is no other talk radio available... only right wing, and its available on more than one station.
No matter what Obama does, they will spin it as a negative.
PS: I'm not saying Obama has not made mistakes in his handling of some important issues, just that it wouldn't matter as far as how talk radio portrays him.
