Mini-spit air conditioner and heat pump

[madokie]

http://www.senvilleminisplits.com/Senville_18000_Btu_19_Seer_Inverter_Mini_Split_Heat_Pump_AC_220v___Energy_Star/p911931_6397040.aspx

We've installed this unit and we're trying it out as a heat source. We're hoping this will cut our wood pellet use enough for it to pay for itself in savings in a few years. It uses inverter technology, meaning the compressor slows or speeds up as the demand for more or less heat or cool is called for. Rather than the conventional which cuts the compressor in or out as needed.
20 plus years ago, 1991, we purchased a wood pellet stove to heat with which has saved us a ton of money over the other options we have for heat, propane or resistance. This mini-split unit should save us even more. I just turned 65 and am disabled so my work days are finished, my wife is 60 and hoping she can make it for another 5 years before she retires. We have been working for the day she retires by upgrading our home,
(windows to low E, roof to metal, increasing attic insulation,) and all new appliances for that day. Soon we plan to purchase a new ford focus as it should carry us well into retirement. It will save us some as presently her auto is an explorer AWD that gets around 18 mpg. We plan to keep the explorer as it is excellent in snow and ice conditions. I'll just keep it up on blocks during the off season to keep the tires off the ground and I'll keep it covered so we'll be able to use it when the need arises
Working for the day when we're both retired. Planning to spend a lot of time fishing. We both like to fish and we both like to eat fish. We have a pumped back lake near here that we will be doing most of our fishing in. It is good clean water, straight out of a clear running stream that has no manufacturing in its watershed so the fish should be good and healthy.
Heading into retirement with eyes wide open. Hoping for the best, health wise. I have the VA she has the Cherokee heath system for her to start using when that time comes. At present its VA for me, insurance for her.

[Matariki]

1. I love my heat pump

It works great in the relatively mild northwest climate. My heating bills went down to a third of what I was paying with the gas furnace.

[madokie]

2. There will still be times where the pellet stove will be needed

I'd say that for the average winter this unit should cover us for 75 percent of the time.
Is your heat pump the inverter type?

[Matariki]

5. It's this Bryant hybrid model

http://www.mnhtac.com/images/Bryant_223A_Lit.pdf

Not sure what inverter type means actually. Mine has cooling as well but I rarely use or need it in Seattle's climate. I've got a backup gas furnace, but it only kicks on once in a while when the temperature drops below 35 or so. The technology is kind of awesome.

[madokie]

6. Whats meant by inverter type is basically the compressor is variable speed

rather than either on or off. Its speed changes with the call for either more or less heat or cold. This one we bought uses variable frequency to vary the speed of the motor so it uses ac motors, some use variable voltage and they use dc motors. Some even use two speed compressors and they are better than the on and off kind, energy wise, but not as efficient as the inverter type like ours is.
I'm really excited to see how this one we have will do this summer and next winter. Didn't buy it in time to really get a feel for how it is going to actually be for heat. Hoping for the best, expecting the worst so I won't be too disappointed

[Matariki]

20. Aha. So yes, that's what I have then.

The one you got looks really compact, does it go in a window or something?

[madokie]

21. fastens to the wall up by the ceiling

I put the outside unit under it on a concrete pad I poured. Two insulated copper pipes, one 3/8" the other 1/2", the electric wire connecting the two and a drain hose for the condensate through the wall with a cover over them.
real quiet here in the house as well as outside as nothing that makes any vibrations are attached to the house.
The compressor is a rotary type so its not making any noise either. the only noise is the fans and neither is running very fast. the fan in the inside unit is 4 inches in diameter and 34 inches long so it doesn't have to turn very fast either to move a lot of air.
right now the air outside is 39 degrees and the little wheel in the meter is barely turning like its not pulling much current. Looks like it is about the same as when we have the pellet stove on. I know thats not a good test but its the best I can do without taking the cover off the electric panel and putting my clamp on amp meter on the wire to see how much current its pulling.

[madokie]

19. Yes it is.

Heat pumps are the way to go for a majority of our heating needs. I'm sure there is climates where they're not so good but for us we hoping it is

[woofless]

3. We put one in our cabin in extreme NW WA state.

The mini split ductless heat pump cut my electric bill in HALF compared to the previous year. We supplement with a pellet stove when the temp. is consistently at or below freezing, but otherwise it runs about all the time. We rarely need the AC but when we do it is much appreciated. Many homes here have no AC. We were fortunate enough to be able to take advantage of rebates from the Federal stimulus and from Puget Sound Energy. I am sure we have already saved what we spent out of pocket. Super product. Now tell me why no one is making them in the US.

[madokie]

4. No idea, same reason I guess so many products are not made here

it sucks and appears that there is nothing you or I can do about it.

[Eleanors38]

7. Keep us posted on the "mini-split" A.C. Have a good retirement...

I kind of figured out my retirement had seeped around me when there was absolutely no work for a 60+ guy, so started pulling SS at 63, a little sooner than I wanted. It was that or burn through a small savings and a minimalist IRA. I'll be eligible for medicare in eight (count 'em) 8 days. My IRA is still intact, and my savings have held up due to my pitiful SS monthly check, but I think I made the right decision. Fishing sounds good! I'll have to get my old break box van in better shape before I venture far afoot. Usually I fix the damned thing myself, but between the sweat, bad coordination, and questionable eyesight, I might just take it to the shop!

[madokie]

8. Thanks,

I will try to remember to send a pm when I know more about how its working out for us. In the whole scheme of things I hope this mini-split will be a step in the right direction. Our pellet stove proved to be a good decision.

[Eleanors38]

9. You're post prompted me to do a little research on the mini-splits...

My CA/CH failed years ago, and I need something for Texas summers. The price looks good for one of these units, esp. with regards electricity in winter; our electric rates go down while gas goes up. Rather have the former. Replacing the central is just too expensive.

[madokie]

10. Most times we only use a small portion of our homes anyway

I know we don't need a central unit that keeps the rooms that we don't really use at 72 degrees summer or winter. Our floor plan is open so one of these made a lot of sense to us

[Eleanors38]

12. True, that. My old '48 house is built like a housetailer! BR and sunroom take up one end.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

22. My understanding is 30% percent of efficiency in traditional systems...

... is lost in the ducts. Worse if your ducts are un-insulated or outside the insulation envelope (in an attic or crawl) - like mine.

An added benefit is cutting the duct work out of the system and heating/cooling the air directly.

These systems work great in older homes not built with ducts in the walls.

Great thread. This and the one in DIY has really set me in motion to tackle this project this summer.

[madokie]

23. I think you'll be glad you did when you do.

so far its exceeded my expectations. Time will tell though
By having an open floor plan with plenty of ceiling fans makes duct work not necessary. Ceiling fans on low doesn't use much electric either and they do a good job of mixing the air. The one benefit with ceiling fans that I like is the stuff in the air they remove as evidenced by what collects on the blades. Every bit of which I don't have in the air I'm breathing.

[Hassin Bin Sober]

24. We have all our ceiling fans running anyway.

We have 10 foot ceilings in most of the condo and 13 foot in the small bedroom.

I'm in a third floor condo so when I rehabbed I was able to steal some attic space. Makes for a cool look but it made blowing in insulation a pain in the ass.

The stupid stupid stupid thing I did was not insulate the duct work when I had the ceilings open 13 years ago. DOH! But some of that was taken care of when we blew in insulation. The main trunk is buried in two foot if cellulose. I deleted the two flex lines running to the living room and taped directly in to the main trunk. Those uninsulated flex ducts were murder on the efficiency.

That will all be a moot problem when I go mini-split.

I just didn't pay that much attention to energy conservation when I had the opportunity. I thought "how hard can it be to heat/cool a 1200 foot condo?". Two summers ago I got a $300, $400 and $200 electric bill all in a row. THAT'S how hard.

That was really an eye opener prompting us to really look at conservation. We insulated the attic with cellulose, cleaned our A-coil that was filthy and installed reflective coating on our west facing windows that get brutal afternoon sun.

Replacing the 20 plus year old central air unit with mini-splits is the next step, I think. We will keep the 13 year old furnace as a back up for sub zero days but probably use the heat pump 80% or more of the time in winter/fall.

[madokie]

25. Hind sight

that amazing thing.
We're hoping to use our mini split as much as the weather will allow. The paper work says its good for down to 5 degrees. We seldom if ever get that cold here

Our sons central air wasn't keeping up last summer in those 110 plus days so I got a can of some kind of spray that cleans the A coil and cleaned it and that fixed his problem. These mini splits have a drying mode it goes through when it shuts down that is supposed to help keep them from getting gunked up. I just hope all the claims pan out. If they do we'll be a couple happy campers, my wife and I

[Mosby]

11. A SEER rating of 19 is really high

Don't know much about the HSPF rating for heat.

I always thought split systems were a little less efficient than the regular all in one units.

I don't have a reversable heat pump, use a gas pack instead. They have gotten a lot more efficient with heat due to impovements with the heat exchanger.

[madokie]

16. According to what I found out from talking to heat and air men

and my online research. The increase in efficiency is pretty much the use of a variable speed compressor in these units now as compared to a few years ago. They've been using these inverter type units in Japan and China for several years now so they're not new as in a new development rather they are new to our shores but have been in use for a while now. In other words the wrinkles have already been ironed out , for my lack of a better way to explain what I'm trying to say. You can still buy the mini-splits that don't use the inverter technology but their SEER is around 13 to 14 and they cost about a third less. I could have gotten the same thing with a SEER of 13 for around 700, 800 bucks.. If you want to go up to a SEER of 25 to 26 the price for the same size unit is around 2400 bucks. According to my research that is.
Maximum of 1480 watts used on this one for 19000 btu's is pretty good. thats what a portable plug in resistance type heater uses on high and they won't heat anywhere as large of an area as this will.
Its 41 degrees out here now with a 20 mph wind and this unit is not having a problem at all keeping the house at 73 degrees. Hey we're getting old '-) so we like warmer temps plus we got used to the higher temps that the pellet stove afforded us so thats why we keep the temps up

[MadHound]

13. All good ideas, but. . .

I suggest that you don't put the Explorer on blocks for two thirds of the year. In fact the worst thing you can do to a vehicle is leave it standing for long periods of time. When you want it, and get it down off the blocks, you could very well find that it isn't running. Fluids can change, for instance if you leave gas in the tank, it will age and do damage to your engine upon firing up. Likewise if you don't start it up for eight months, virtually every single drop of oil will migrate to the oil pan and when you start it up that first time, the lack of oil will do damage to your engine. Then there are pests, and electrical problems, and . . .

My suggestion, leave it off the blocks, and once every week or two, take it out for a spin. It won't cost you terribly much, and will help keep that Explorer running for a good long while.

[Auntie Bush]

14. Did you install the unit yourself or have it installed by a licensed installer?

I ask because my son just took a course and exam... then received a license to install mini-splits.. It looks so easy I wonder why the course. He does weatherization and now can do the mini-splits too. I thought that was quite an accomplishment...but it seems something anyone can do.

[madokie]

17. I installed the inside unit and placed the outside unit but had a heat and air

tech do the connections. I don't have a vacuum pump and gauges. He charged us 150 bucks to do the connecting. It came precharged with r410a freon so there wasn't an added charge for that. As it stands now I've got a little less than $1500 in this project. That includes the material that will put a roof over the top and a wind break on the north side. A few days ago it was 34 degrees out with a 20 or so mph wind and with my none contact thermometer the outside unit was putting out 7 degree air while the inside unit was keeping the house at a toasty 73 degrees. The area that we have it in is a tad over 600 sq ft with open doors to my computer room and our bedroom and bath. We have ceiling fans in all our rooms that we leave on low circulating up all the time and that insures that the bedroom and this room stays close to the same temp as the 600 sq ft area is. We never turn the ceiling fans to the other direction as we find this to work the best for keeping the room air without pockets of hot or cold.

[Lars39]

15. You've both got your eyes on when she retires,

but have some fun and quality time now, too. Life's short, ya know?

[madokie]

18. Thanks for that advice

and yes we do. I've completely re built this old house from an all new floor plan, new plumbing, new electric, new windows new house wrap, new siding, new metal roof, new insulation and all new interior starting with the outside walls complete with hardwood, ceramic and bamboo floors, depending on the room and including crown molding, window and door trim etc. Oak cabinets and all. New old house setting on a tad over an acre of land. We bought it for a song 11 years ago at a sheriffs auction and like I said completely re built it to our liking. I've done all the work myself as I'm an old construction worker who is proficient at all the different trades. Take a lot of pride in my work too I might add. We love our home very much, probably about as much as we love each other.

[phantom power]

26. seer 19 is good

[madokie]

27. 33 degrees out right now and a toasty 72 in here

Curiosity is going to get to me yet to where I have to pull the cover off the breaker panel so I can put my clamp on amp meter on the wire to see how much current its using. At any rate I'd just about bet that its costing less than pellets would and pellets are cheaper than my other choice of resistance heat.

Life is good when one wants it to be