Has anyone else wondered why no disguises?

[Robb]

I mean, you hold up a liquor store, you at least grow a beard or wear a fake mustache.

You drop off bombs in the middle of a busy retail street, on that street's most televised day of the year -- when everyone and their dog have their phones out shooting video, snapping pictures... And you don't even wear big dark glasses?

Who does this without even the most perfunctory attempt at a disguise? It's gnawing at me.

[MineralMan]

1. Not every wrongdoer is a bright person.

I believe that is the explanation you were looking for. And, no, not everyone who holds up a liquor store grows a beard. Here in the Twin Cities, they always publish the security camera images. Someone who knows the person and dislikes the person calls the cops. That strategy works a treat in most cases.

[madokie]

6. Intelligence has nothing to do with brightness either

[MineralMan]

9. That's certainly true, as well.

[brush]

41. Not sure about that

One can be intelligent as hell in one area and not be intelligent, or bright, about things in other disciplines. Seems to me they weren't smart enough to realize we are living in "1984". Maybe because they haven't been in the country that long they thought could just blend in, especially with their — ahhh . . . non-dark skin — with no one the wiser. All of us that have lived through the technology explosion beginning with computerization in the 80s know that cameras are everywhere out in public, especially in big cities. They seem to have missed that.

[sabrina 1]

32. Except by all accounts they were intelligent.

[MineralMan]

33. As madokie pointed out, intelligence does not always

mean that someone is bright. Indeed, the two often seem to be unrelated. Two words; two meanings.

[sabrina 1]

37. Intelligence doesn't always mean 'not bright' either. The truth is no one knows anything about this

tragedy, why they did it, how they made the bombs, did they do it alone etc. Actually it is Russia they should have been angry at, assuming their background is what it is claimed to be. We don't know that either for sure. Opinions are dime a dozen. Mine is as good as anyone else's at this point. Because we have no facts except the horrific and tragic end result of the crimes they committed.

And then are the statements from people who knew them best.

[MineralMan]

38. As you wish, Sabrina 1.

Thanks for your commentary.

[Schema Thing]

51. as I said to my friend last night, "this case shows that 'smart' is a very relative term"

If all your friends are of meh intelligence, and they say that you are brilliant, it could be that you are brilliant or it could be that you are just slightly smarter than they are. Or you may just have a good memory compared to average, and test well. A lot of people give way too much credit to that.



These lads either intended to be found out (and perhaps had bigger plans for their flameout) - which I seriously doubt, or...

they just weren't particularly smart.


I think it's probably the latter. Which would also *help* to explain why they went down this path in the first place.

[sabrina 1]

77. As I said, things are not always as they seem. We don't have a clue whether what they did do was the

plan, or whether they were just stupid. I know I don't have a clue and wouldn't even begin to try to figure it out at this point.

[BeyondGeography]

2. Dopes?

Never underestimate the capacity for stupidity, especially among young males. The older brother probably thought the dark glasses were enough. The younger one may have thought he looked cooler with the hat on backwards.

[LisaL]

11. Apparently he liked to wear his hat backwards.

There were so many people at the marathon. I bet those two didn't think they would be noticed or figured out.

[seabeyond]

3. i heard the oldest always wore facial hair and never had cap or sunglasses. someone

who knows him says the picture was totally unrecognizable because of those three items.

you took note, that i merely am saying "i heard". not fact. just what one of the friends said on cnn or something.

[jakeXT]

20. Here without hair and with glasses

[seabeyond]

25. true that. i guess it depends if picture taken a couple weeks ago, or a couple years ago,.

but, that was the reason a past friend who knew the whole family said he did not recognize when he saw the picture.

thanks.

[MjolnirTime]

4. Glory.

[htuttle]

5. I think they were sure that they would get away with it

That's probably why they didn't leave the Boston area. It seems like they just went home afterwards.

[malaise]

8. No their car was in the garage

It's all very strange- why was there no getaway plan?

[LisaL]

15. Why is that strange?

Most criminals don't have getway plans.

[treestar]

18. They might have planned to set more bombs.

And believed they would not be caught. There was something about Jokar in school on Wednesday, acting normal.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

35. that's possible

[emulatorloo]

40. Yep, lots of explosives found at their place by police.

Don't think they were done yet.

[malaise]

49. Then they were really really stupid because they did not even disguise

themselves

[snagglepuss]

45. No I think it was smart. Everything they did was to appear that they

were spectators moving through a crowd, having a getaway car when other people escaped on foot would have raised suspicion. The only thing they didn't figure is that a camera could have caught them setting down a backpack among a crowd.

[malaise]

50. That makes no sense

Their mother, the shoplifter was caught on camera.
You cannot live in a society and not know all stores have cameras

[snagglepuss]

55. Even with cameras people still shoplift and get away with it. I think it is pure luck

that the place the bombs were placed was within camera range. I'm sure that not every inch of sidewalk space in Boston has a camera trained on it.

[malaise]

72. Well the losers lost

Hope the next sent of murderers learn a lesson

[LisaL]

7. I am guessing they didn't realize how many cameras were there and thought they would

blend in with everybody else.

[Barack_America]

10. The older brother wore glasses.

And the younger brother seems ridiculously gullible....OR....this does go further and these two were set up to take the fall.

[snagglepuss]

48. They admitted being the bombers when they hijacked the car so how can they be setup?

[Barack_America]

65. I was thinking more along the lines of puppetry.

That these guys were meant to get caught.

[snagglepuss]

66. Who are puppet masters?

[Barack_America]

67. I would imagine that's question #2 for the younger brother.

After 'are there any more bombs'.

[The Second Stone]

75. Jeff Dunham and Achmed

are behind this.

[snagglepuss]

76. Who?

[jakeXT]

12. They were not involved in that robbery

They happened to be there at the time when 7/11 was robbed. I haven't seen video of them placing something.

The description sounds vague...

According to Bloomberg, Jeff Bauman, 27, of
Concord, N.H., was at the finish line waiting
for his girlfriend to cross when a man in a cap,
sunglasses and a black jacket over a hoodie
looked at him. The man dropped a bag at his
feet and left.
http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2013/04/boston_marathon_bombing_victim_jeff_baumans_description_helped_officials_zero_in_on_suspect.html

[randome]

43. Right. They did not rob the liquor store.

They just happened to go to the same store that was robbed recently.

[treestar]

13. Maybe figured the crowds would mean so many pictures

that it would be impossible to get the needle out of the haystack.

I recall thinking there were so many photos, it might not help. The speculation on DU would be about some fellow with a backpack in a photo, yet there was nothing to use to say it wasn't just a backpack. Even the black ones that fit the description could have been so numerous there was no way to prove the carrier of the backpack in the photo was the one with the bomb.

Even when the FBI released the video of the Tsarnaevs, I figured that they to have more than just the video to think those were the actual perpetrators.

[niyad]

14. stupidity, arrogance, who knows? as for the liquor store thing--I caught a segment on some

news show last week--a guy was getting ready to hold up a convenience store. right in front of the security camera, he pulls up a mask to cover his face (oh, and he was wearing pajamas).

[Art_from_Ark]

16. Well, Mark David Chapman shot John Lennon at point plank range

and then just sat down in the courtyard of Lennon's apartment building until the police arrived.

Who knows what goes through the heads of people committing crimes like that?

[Squinch]

17. Maybe they thought their god would protect them. And then give them virgins.

[alsame]

19. They weren't too smart. No cash on hand, no

pre-paid travel plans, no car...absolutely no contingency plan in case they were IDed.

[jakeXT]

23. His mechanic was too slow, his Mercedes wasn't ready.

http://www.masslive.com/news/boston/index.ssf/2013/04/cambridge_mechanic_boston_bomb.html

[snagglepuss]

52. Arrogence not stupidity. They assumed that since they appear so all-American

they wouldn't be suspected.

[emulatorloo]

56. Yeah, this was the guy who said women would get "bad ideas" if he took of his shirt.

Totally arrogant.

Tamerlan says he usually doesn't take his shirt off
http://www.democraticunderground.com/10022710625

[City Lights]

21. The older brother wore glasses and cap with brim forward.

His face was not as easy to recognize as the younger brother. I, too, find it baffling that the younger brother strutted around with his cap backwards, allowing his face to be seen so easily by the cameras.

[Jim__]

22. I really did wonder about wearing the hat backwards and no sun glasses.

It was like advertising. It made me think that they were foreigners and would have been out of the country by the time the FBI released the pictures.

[El Fuego]

74. Me too. I think something went wrong with their plan.

I felt like he was showing his face on purpose. I mean, wouldn't you at least wear sunglasses on a sunny day? They must have been planning to leave the country as soon as it was over, but ran into obstacles.

[kenny blankenship]

24. Highly likely that Tamerlan planned this as a suicide ride

and never expected to get away or survive. He got out of the SUV and after trading fire with the police, he charged towards their position with an explosive device strapped to his chest. That's not a spur of the moment type of decision for most people. Someone who does that has been mentally preparing themselves for death long before initiating the fight, and not only accepts it but is pretty much insisting that it end this way.

[Lone_Star_Dem]

26. I did, but the uncle helped clear that up for me. They're losers.

Like many losers in our society, they were cocky and not very bright. Their whole plan wasn't well thought out. Which considering the amount of time and effort it took to put together the items they acquired, build all their explosive devices, get ammo/guns and put it all into a plan of attack, makes me wonder if they were trying to prove themselves to someone. I know, useless and stupid speculation. Yet I've still wondered.

[jakeXT]

27. Didn't he say he last saw them in 05/06?

The younger one was like 12 years old...

[Lone_Star_Dem]

30. I was simply borrowing his phrase.

I'm not giving it weight because he said it insomuch as saying it appears to me they were indeed losers.

[nolabear]

28. Speculation, but being martyred for a cause may be part of the idea.

It can be part of the fantasy that allows one to dehumanize the "enemy" and commit heinous acts against innocent people. You are working for a higher cause, giving your life, your sacrifice will be lauded and songs will be sung about you.

I doubt any of this involved cowering in a boat or having your death photos being flogged around the internet and having crude comments made.

[Buzz Clik]

29. You drop off these bombs when the race is nearly over and the crowds are thin.

Ninety minutes earlier, multiply the carnage by 5.

Lots of questions.

[ecstatic]

31. When I saw the released pics, I thought...there's no way these guys will be caught

They were in disguise and that's what made them stand out. I remember rolling my eyes when Clint Van zandt was talking about how nervous the guys were now that their pics were everywhere. But it turns out, he was absolutely right: The move to release the unclear pics didn't really help people recognize them, but it caused a psychological response in the brothers that ultimately led to their capture.

[Rosa Luxemburg]

34. IRA must have had better disguises?

things have moved on since the IRA but I think they may have used disguises for bomb planting. Not so many security cameras etc?

Why would someone wear a prominent white baseball cap that looked too large?

[reformist2]

36. Wouldn't that have creeped people out?

My guess is that people wearing disguises in a big crowd like that would have had people screaming.

[sufrommich]

39. My guess is that they originally planned to

be wearing those backpacks when they blew up and chickened out,hence, no plan for after the explosions.

[kestrel91316]

42. Hubris is the name for it. They assumed they would blend in, that the

crowds were too thick. And Tamerlan wore sunglasses and the brim of his cap partially obscured his face.

Their bloated egos told them they wouldn't get caught. They were wrong.

[ananda]

47. Except that ...

... they had made lots of bombs themselves, and they had guns and ammo too.

[MineralMan]

54. Far-fetched beyond anything I've seen, except

from Alex Jones. Bizarre, at best.

[emulatorloo]

57. welcome to DU.

[MineralMan]

58. Actually, I've been here for quite some time.

Perhaps you were welcoming the other person. Just in time, too, I suspect.

[emulatorloo]

61. I know, I was joking.

As in Welcome to the New DU, the home of Alex Jones/Glenn Beck style conspiracy theories.

[MineralMan]

63. Ah, OK. It's always so weird when the Alex Jonesians

show up here. They aren't around long enough for us to get a good look at them though, in most cases.

When I was a young lad, I used to catch snakes in my wanderings around my tiny community and the countryside around it. I'd keep them in an old aquarium for a few days, and then release them. My parents put an end to my naturalist tendencies, though, when I brought home a small rattlesnake. I guess they didn't have confidence in my abilities to handle that one.

[emulatorloo]

69. The burden of proof for your theory that Bombers worked for FBI is on you, not me.

[MineralMan]

70. Alex Jones says it's true.

For some, that is Gospel, it seems.

[NYC Liberal]

71. Did the FBI also give them fake guns with fake bullets, which were then substituted for real ones?

[Zorra]

46. Who does it? Someone who will be idolized and memorialized because of their crime, by a

substantial number of people that they wish to impress, who usually belong to a certain group.

And/or, someone who is so convinced of the absolute righteousness of their actions that they are proud of what they are doing, and want everyone to see, and who believe that they will be killed in flight after the commission of their crime.

[marions ghost]

68. Pride--like you say

and bravado. Righteousness of purpose.

However I think they planned to stick around and do a few more bombings around town after this one. I do think they were really surprised at the videos. When I saw the vid I thought--OK they've got em (and probably they had other evidence as well). The authorities knew they were still in the area (Jokar went to get his car and went to classes on Wednesday using an ID card--blows my mind). The cops just wanted to flush em out. Ready to roll & knew it would be only a few hours.

I did wonder why the bombers would be so bold as to not even attempt a disguise. They probably figured that their best disguise was the one they were familiar with--go as Americans.

[Zorra]

78. Maybe they even believed they were invincible under divine protection.

The sheer arrogance indicates this to me.

Anyone who blows up kids has serious issues with their conception of reality.

[Pisces]

59. Dumb kids that don't expect to get out alive. These were not masterminds. Same type that shoots

up a school. THey want to be known. They want to be infamous.

[Drahthaardogs]

60. A dumb ass who has no idea what they are really doing.

Kind of like the "deer" hunter who carries a 12-inch Bowie knife. Seriously?

[Starry Messenger]

62. College-aged kids aren't really masterminds.

The younger one was 19. Anyone who works with adolescents knows that thinking things through to a logical endpoint isn't always a strong-point.

[longship]

73. They should have used these.

[smirkymonkey]

79. Arrogance?

That would be my guess.