Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

Yavin4

(35,357 posts)
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:01 PM Apr 2013

Why are we so obsessed with the religion/ethnicity/race of these killers?

There have been several discussions about the race/ethnicity/religion of the killers. Why? Why are we so pre-occupied with finding this fact? So that we can hold an entire race/religion/ethnicity accountable?

Let's say that we find out that the killers are muslims. What are we going to do with that information? Go to war with all Muslims all over the world?

Can someone please explain?

35 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
Why are we so obsessed with the religion/ethnicity/race of these killers? (Original Post) Yavin4 Apr 2013 OP
I'm not...I think racist types are. we can do it Apr 2013 #1
We aren't, but we are thinking about the M$M and other Americans treestar Apr 2013 #2
This is no diff than what we are doing to gun owners. Stretch714 Apr 2013 #18
+1 Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel Apr 2013 #21
american privilege. we do this routinely to other nations & are shocked when it's done to us nt msongs Apr 2013 #3
Motivations. What motivated them? If they were white extremists we'd want to know snagglepuss Apr 2013 #4
They are/were pretty clearly "white" as it's normally thought of Fumesucker Apr 2013 #13
Because of "collective punishment." Think "history." nt kelliekat44 Apr 2013 #5
You'd have been shouted down had you asked this on Monday Dreamer Tatum Apr 2013 #6
It seems human nature Dyedinthewoolliberal Apr 2013 #7
Trying to figure out what their grievance was, if any. TwilightGardener Apr 2013 #8
If they had a grievance, wouldn't they have made a statement about it? n/t Yavin4 Apr 2013 #11
They made their statement, loud and clear. snagglepuss Apr 2013 #16
It would be nice to know why they made the statement in the first place. Stretch714 Apr 2013 #29
Because it's normal? Warpy Apr 2013 #9
because we want to know why they did what they did. cali Apr 2013 #10
Why would someone's race/ethnicity/religion be a pretext for their motive? Yavin4 Apr 2013 #15
no, you misunderstand me. cali Apr 2013 #23
Jihadis world wide have made it explicit that they want to restore the Caliphate. snagglepuss Apr 2013 #26
This message was self-deleted by its author cthulu2016 Apr 2013 #12
Because of 9/11.. kentuck Apr 2013 #14
Yep. redqueen Apr 2013 #19
Exactly gaspee Apr 2013 #20
Obviously nt Zorra Apr 2013 #28
Agree with emphasis on after actions LeftInTX Apr 2013 #31
The MSM is like a band that knows one song and has to play for 4 hours olddots Apr 2013 #17
Personally, CountAllVotes Apr 2013 #22
Several DUers have been preoccupied over the bombers' race, nationality, and political views. Quantess Apr 2013 #24
Same reason we blame inanimate objects - we like to blame anything other than the person The Straight Story Apr 2013 #25
For me, Tim Wise sums it up nicely... Liberal_Stalwart71 Apr 2013 #27
Not obsessed but interested MaineLinePhilly Apr 2013 #30
who the hell is 'we '? Trajan Apr 2013 #32
Because we are tribal animals. RevStPatrick Apr 2013 #33
I'll take a stab. Phlem Apr 2013 #34
Because DU's bigots want to know if they're in the clear Scootaloo Apr 2013 #35

treestar

(82,383 posts)
2. We aren't, but we are thinking about the M$M and other Americans
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:02 PM
Apr 2013

And how they will obsess over it or use it to advance their agendas.

 

Stretch714

(90 posts)
18. This is no diff than what we are doing to gun owners.
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:11 PM
Apr 2013

A few nut jobs with guns kill people and we think all gun owners are nut jobs. We do it with religious groups all the time.

snagglepuss

(12,704 posts)
4. Motivations. What motivated them? If they were white extremists we'd want to know
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:03 PM
Apr 2013

were they NRA freaks, KKK, neo fascists.

Fumesucker

(45,851 posts)
13. They are/were pretty clearly "white" as it's normally thought of
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:07 PM
Apr 2013

And they seem to qualify as extremists.



Dreamer Tatum

(10,926 posts)
6. You'd have been shouted down had you asked this on Monday
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:03 PM
Apr 2013

by the legions who assured us it was the Tea Party.

Dyedinthewoolliberal

(15,485 posts)
7. It seems human nature
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:04 PM
Apr 2013

or maybe unenlightened human nature to seek this kind of thing out. Then we have a focus for our blame and fault finding.
"they are all that way", "it's what we expect from them" etc

Warpy

(110,909 posts)
9. Because it's normal?
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:05 PM
Apr 2013

Everybody wants to know exactly what loosened their screws to the point they though blowing up women and kids would be a good idea.

Besides, finding out they're "others" means we don't have to be suspicious of friends and neighbors who are not.

Yeah, right.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
10. because we want to know why they did what they did.
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:05 PM
Apr 2013

people always want to know motive. And religion may have been motive or part of it. Are you saying we shouldn't examine why because you're afraid it will be used as a pretext? (a reasonable fear)

Yavin4

(35,357 posts)
15. Why would someone's race/ethnicity/religion be a pretext for their motive?
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:08 PM
Apr 2013

The DC Beltway snipers were an African American father-son team. Their race had nothing to do with their actions nor did it motivate their deeds.

If anything, the fact that they weren't White may have hampered the investigation.

 

cali

(114,904 posts)
23. no, you misunderstand me.
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:12 PM
Apr 2013

It sounds like you are fearful that if these acts were perpetrated in the name of Islam, the U.S. will do something ugly/stupid. I think that's an understandable concern.

I said nothing about religion being a pretext for the motives of the suspects. I said that it is natural to want to understand motive and that religion or ethnic background could figure into that. For instance, if we were talking about an attack on a march on MLK day (and that was planned a couple of years back), race might indeed be part of the larger picture.

snagglepuss

(12,704 posts)
26. Jihadis world wide have made it explicit that they want to restore the Caliphate.
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:13 PM
Apr 2013

Bin Ladin and others of his ilk made it clear they wanted the US out of Islamic lands. Islamists are the ones have defined their violence in terms of religion. Ethnicity is in play because some Islamists are fighting an ethnic battle eg Chechynans.

Response to Yavin4 (Original post)

redqueen

(115,096 posts)
19. Yep.
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:11 PM
Apr 2013

We saw that incident used as a flag to rally Americans to support two needless wars. Wars which have brought this country to its knees financially, along with all those tax cuts for the rich, the new DHS and TSA...

That would be my first thought, is that people are worried what this incident might be used for.

gaspee

(3,231 posts)
20. Exactly
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:12 PM
Apr 2013

Those of us who were paying attention remember the demonization and attacks on wide swaths of people and are worried it will happen again. At least they come from a country we won't start a war with. Who knows, maybe we'll attack another country... hmmm... I wonder which one.

 

olddots

(10,237 posts)
17. The MSM is like a band that knows one song and has to play for 4 hours
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:10 PM
Apr 2013

I can't explain why but it seems the news bizz profits from war and fear almost as much as munitions companies .

Wars have been based on religion/ethnicity/and race =works every time.

CountAllVotes

(20,854 posts)
22. Personally,
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:12 PM
Apr 2013

I don't give a damn what race they are or where they are from.

They are killers!

May they both rot in f'ng HELL!!!!!!!!!!!!!



Quantess

(27,630 posts)
24. Several DUers have been preoccupied over the bombers' race, nationality, and political views.
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:13 PM
Apr 2013

I have not been proud of DU for the past couple of days.

The Straight Story

(48,121 posts)
25. Same reason we blame inanimate objects - we like to blame anything other than the person
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:13 PM
Apr 2013

Either religion made them do it, they were kept down by the man and sought revenge, guns filled with magical demon power dragged them out and made them do it, they were abused by someone and that person is to blame, etc.

One we assign a cause we can either rush to war or run out yelling for more laws. Never mind it could be less than 0% (ie 0.3%) of a group/etc act in that way, we want to use it to rally the troops to our biases.

And anyone who does not agree hates america and is a nut.

It works that way on the left and the right.

 

Liberal_Stalwart71

(20,450 posts)
27. For me, Tim Wise sums it up nicely...
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:14 PM
Apr 2013

<snip>

The Right, hours after Monday's bombing, was already casting the blame on Muslims. As Steven Rosenfeld notes in AlterNet, "Almost immediately predictable hysterical right-wing voices jumped into the debate — and surprisingly were featured on liberal Salon.com — including the anti-Muslim media hound Pam Geller, who immediately blamed a Jihadi for the bombing." The Langar Hall website reported on Monday, "Some right wing pundits have been even more blatantly racist this afternoon in response to the explosions. Fox News commentator Erik Rush went so far as to tweet this afternoon that Muslims are evil, and 'Let’s kill them all' after immediately blaming the explosions on Muslim terrorists without any evidence."

In his latest commentary, Terrorism and Privilege: Understanding the Power of Whiteness, anti-racism writer and educator Tim Wise underscores how, even as we grieve the victims, the Boston Marathon bombing is a powerful lesson about race and white privilege. But I dare say there is more; a much less obvious and far more uncomfortable lesson, which many are loathe to learn, but which an event such as this makes readily apparent, and which we must acknowledge, no matter how painful. It is a lesson about race, about whiteness, and specifically, about white privilege. I know you don’t want to hear it. But I don’t much care. So here goes. White privilege is knowing that even if the Boston Marathon bomber turns out to be white, his or her identity will not result in persons like yourself being singled out for suspicion by law enforcement, or the TSA, or the FBI.

White privilege is knowing that even if the bomber turns out to be white, no one will call for your group to be profiled as terrorists as a result, subjected to special screening, or threatened with deportation.

White privilege is knowing that if the bomber turns out to be white, he or she will be viewed as an exception to an otherwise non-white rule, an aberration, an anomaly...White privilege is knowing that if the Boston bomber turns out to be white, you will not be asked to denounce him or her, so as to prove your own loyalties to the common national good. It is knowing that the next time a cop sees you standing on the sidewalk cheering on runners in a marathon, that cop will say exactly nothing to you as a result.

White privilege is knowing that if you are a student from Nebraska — as opposed to, say, a student from Saudi Arabia — that no one, and I mean no one would think it important to detain and question you in the wake of a bombing such as the one at the Boston Marathon. And white privilege is knowing that if this bomber turns out to be white, the United States government will not bomb whatever corn field or mountain town or stale suburb from which said bomber came, just to ensure that others like him or her don’t get any ideas. And if he turns out to be a member of the Irish Republican Army we won’t bomb Dublin. And if he’s an Italian American Catholic we won’t bomb the Vatican.

In short, white privilege is the thing that allows you — and me — to view tragic events like this as merely horrific, and from the perspective of pure and innocent victims, rather than having to wonder, and to look over one’s shoulder, and to ask even if only in hushed tones, whether those we pass on the street might think that somehow we were involved.

It is the source of our unearned innocence and the cause of others’ unjustified oppression.”

<snip>

More here:

Source: http://www.war-times.org/node/562

 

MaineLinePhilly

(72 posts)
30. Not obsessed but interested
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:21 PM
Apr 2013

John King described the suspect as being "dark skinned" so thats the only thing I have said in regards to this. The implication had far reaching effects, and now that they have turned out to be quite light/white/fair skinned, this is the part of the conversation I bring up. I hope John King apologizes for his shoddy journalism (and I use the word journalism loosely).

 

Trajan

(19,089 posts)
32. who the hell is 'we '?
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:24 PM
Apr 2013

These blanket statements are your choice ...

There is no we ...

Stop putting words into MY mouth ...

 

RevStPatrick

(2,208 posts)
33. Because we are tribal animals.
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:28 PM
Apr 2013

Our tribe = Good.
Their tribe = Bad.

Many of us have evolved past this, but tribalism still gets eyeballs in front of the advertisements.

Phlem

(6,323 posts)
34. I'll take a stab.
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:32 PM
Apr 2013

Because we are a country obsessed with reality TV shows (that aren't reality at all) and are being conditioned to make snap judgments based on what we see.
We never get a chance to know the real history of each participant and they aren't around for the next season for us to get to know.

Superficial information is all we need to make what we think is an informed decision. No critical thinking here.

They're all game show contestants.



-p

 

Scootaloo

(25,699 posts)
35. Because DU's bigots want to know if they're in the clear
Fri Apr 19, 2013, 02:39 PM
Apr 2013

If they're Arabs / Muslims, then any depth if broad-brushing bigotry is absolutely okay, as per the non-application of the ToS. In this case we will be regaled with what horrible fucking people all Arabs and Muslims are, how we need to blow up Mecca, and other charming statements, paired with a slew of "just saying's" and "I'm only asking questions's"

On the other hand if the attackers were white, black, Christian, gay, Jewish, or Asian, DU would wring its hands about the lack of easy access to mental health care, since all of these groups are inherently good and wonderful, unlike Arabs and Muslims, and so any violation from within their ranks is not an expression of natural inherent evil - like Arabs and Muslims - but rather a psychiatric problem that could have been solved with some single-payer and sympathy.

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»Why are we so obsessed wi...