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Raise your hand if you're glad our foreign policy right now... (Original Post) JHB Apr 2013 OP
^^ blm Apr 2013 #1
Oh, certainly. If this is the responsibility of some right-wing nutcase in Texas, they Baitball Blogger Apr 2013 #2
This message was self-deleted by its author bowens43 Apr 2013 #3
Oh, shit will be coming soon! Patriot act II Logical Apr 2013 #4
I'm withholding judgement. They're better than the Dubya/Cheney gang, but not much. reformist2 Apr 2013 #5
But not much is ass madokie Apr 2013 #6
No comprendo. reformist2 Apr 2013 #7
What I'm saying is what you typed is BULLSHIT madokie Apr 2013 #9
You are sadly mistaken. reformist2 Apr 2013 #10
I'm sorry but this some more of your bullshit madokie Apr 2013 #11
Guantanamo is still open and drones strikes have increased drastically. FreeBC Apr 2013 #16
Guantanamo is in spite of obama madokie Apr 2013 #18
You seem to apply a double standard. FreeBC Apr 2013 #20
Again, Obama is not a dictator madokie Apr 2013 #21
Drone strikes do not require congressional approval FreeBC Apr 2013 #22
"Cheerleading" davidpdx Apr 2013 #30
But they wouldn't have the same foreign policy. We'd still be in Iraq. Zen Democrat Apr 2013 #46
Actually many influential republicans are against drones. FreeBC Apr 2013 #23
Seems like a very similar interventionist mindset for the benefit of multinational corps byeya Apr 2013 #17
again Obama is not a dictator madokie Apr 2013 #19
I guess we should make a list of foreign policy stances FreeBC Apr 2013 #26
you are soooo right, madokie! mountain grammy Apr 2013 #37
I'm with ya, mountain grammy! classof56 Apr 2013 #45
Well... Bonobo Apr 2013 #8
If it turns out to have been perpetrated by a right-wing militia or white-supremacist group, pampango Apr 2013 #12
Even if it's foreign Islamists, it's not like they weren't trying geek tragedy Apr 2013 #25
The current foreign policy is either... Bonobo Apr 2013 #38
No, naive is believing is that if we just played nicey-nice geek tragedy Apr 2013 #40
So be brave. Which is it? Bonobo Apr 2013 #42
After you tell us how you know that Obama's foreign policy was a cause geek tragedy Apr 2013 #43
I don't believe that the so-called Islamists need any provocation to support their hatred. olegramps Apr 2013 #47
And there's the first DU'er to blame the Boston bombing on Obama. geek tragedy Apr 2013 #24
Truly, you sound like a petulant child. Bonobo Apr 2013 #28
Please let the FBI know that you've solved the Boston bombing case, geek tragedy Apr 2013 #29
What I think is that, despite my many policy disagreements with the administration,... JHB Apr 2013 #35
Now there is something we can agree on. JDPriestly Apr 2013 #13
We would have been invading the wrong country by now. JaneyVee Apr 2013 #14
Fuck that. Zax2me Apr 2013 #15
I agree, it's too early to jump to conclusions whether this was a foreign or domestic attack davidpdx Apr 2013 #33
I get that we don't also have to contend with opportunists eager to seize on an excuse... JHB Apr 2013 #36
Sure... but that's not saying much. harmonicon Apr 2013 #27
Sometimes I think they're still pulling the levers n/t whatchamacallit Apr 2013 #31
I wonder which Country we would have discovered WMDs in? RyanThomas Apr 2013 #32
Right now I will say it makes me feel slightly better it's not in a full blown right wingers hands Arcanetrance Apr 2013 #34
I'm just glad that there are adults in the White House Harry Monroe Apr 2013 #39
Both hands in the air! mountain grammy Apr 2013 #41
And I' so glad that the adults are letting law enforcement do their jobs Harry Monroe Apr 2013 #44
No. donheld Apr 2013 #48

Baitball Blogger

(46,570 posts)
2. Oh, certainly. If this is the responsibility of some right-wing nutcase in Texas, they
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 08:19 AM
Apr 2013

would probably have us attacking Mexico.

Response to JHB (Original post)

madokie

(51,076 posts)
9. What I'm saying is what you typed is BULLSHIT
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 08:41 AM
Apr 2013

in your OP. and doesn't belong here IMHO
there is a big difference between President Obama/Biden and the shooter and w

madokie

(51,076 posts)
11. I'm sorry but this some more of your bullshit
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 08:47 AM
Apr 2013

I'll leave it at that. I'd rather not have my reply canned

 

FreeBC

(403 posts)
16. Guantanamo is still open and drones strikes have increased drastically.
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:06 AM
Apr 2013

Are they better than Bush/Cheney? yeah

Would you be defending this marginal improvement so strongly if these were republicans in office and not democrats? I doubt it.

madokie

(51,076 posts)
18. Guantanamo is in spite of obama
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:10 AM
Apr 2013

I'm sure the republicons have a lot to do with the drone strikes too. The president is not a dictator as you seem to imply

 

FreeBC

(403 posts)
20. You seem to apply a double standard.
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:16 AM
Apr 2013

Think about it: If these were republicans in office with the same exact foreign policies as Obama, you would be incensed. I don't think you are being honest with yourself if you claim differently.

Again, I'm not saying they are worse than Bush/Cheney, but that's an awfully low standard for comparison.

 

FreeBC

(403 posts)
22. Drone strikes do not require congressional approval
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:23 AM
Apr 2013

Maybe technically they should, but effectively Obama is calling all the shots on drone strikes.

Closing Guantanamo could potentially be blocked by congress, but we'll never know because he hasn't really tried to do it and obviously has no intention of doing so.

You really seem to be cheerleading here. Others are discussing this subject rationally and you are playing "our guys good/their guys bad."

davidpdx

(22,000 posts)
30. "Cheerleading"
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:59 AM
Apr 2013

Please get a grip or leave. I have no problem with you stating opinion, but the name calling is just juvenile.

Zen Democrat

(5,901 posts)
46. But they wouldn't have the same foreign policy. We'd still be in Iraq.
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:38 AM
Apr 2013

And we wouldn't be getting out of Afghanistan. And we'd be in Syria and Libya too. We're withdrawing from the War on Terror and now have a "get the perps" policy. Bush/Cheney had the military in hot wars AND drone strikes.

Just remember that it was John McCain in 2008 who said we'd be in Iraq for 100 years. The Republicans have the most vested interest in the military state because that's been the answer for unemployment and economic prosperity since WWII.

And last year Mitt Romney was saber-rattling with the likes of Cheney's lieutenants as advisors.

If you want to equate President Obama with this evil cast of characters, you're in the wrong place.

 

FreeBC

(403 posts)
23. Actually many influential republicans are against drones.
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:26 AM
Apr 2013

Not for the right reasons or anything, but drones are cheap and republicans like huge military spending projects that guarantee them lots of kickbacks.

 

byeya

(2,842 posts)
17. Seems like a very similar interventionist mindset for the benefit of multinational corps
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:08 AM
Apr 2013

with little regard for human rights.
How many of the 100s of overseas military bases have been closed?
But, if "better than Bush" is the standard, Obama meets that.

madokie

(51,076 posts)
19. again Obama is not a dictator
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:13 AM
Apr 2013

you figure it out from there. I've better things to do this morning than to continue this charade of its all obama's fault

 

FreeBC

(403 posts)
26. I guess we should make a list of foreign policy stances
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:29 AM
Apr 2013

and mark the ones we like as "Obama" and the ones we don't like as "those pesky republicans"?

classof56

(5,376 posts)
45. I'm with ya, mountain grammy!
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:37 AM
Apr 2013

Madokie nailed it!

BTW, I was just shuffling through some files and came upon Molly Ivins' obituary, which I had clipped from a newspaper. What a sad day that was, for all of us. Her voice may be silenced but her words live on!

Blessings.

Bonobo

(29,257 posts)
8. Well...
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 08:39 AM
Apr 2013

On the other hand, if you don't think relentless attacks by the US in Pakistan, Afghanistan, Yemen as well as other ME policies have anything to do with this, I think you are not thinking it through.

pampango

(24,692 posts)
12. If it turns out to have been perpetrated by a right-wing militia or white-supremacist group,
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 08:51 AM
Apr 2013

I doubt that "relentless attacks by the US in Pakistan, Afghanistan, Yemen as well as other ME policies" will be what motivated them. Many in these groups think Obama is a secret Muslim who is not doing enough combat 'Islamic terrorism'.

At this point we don't know whether this is a case of domestic or foreign terrorism. If it is the latter, you are probably right.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
25. Even if it's foreign Islamists, it's not like they weren't trying
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:28 AM
Apr 2013

to commit bombings inside the US before Obama became president, or before we invaded either Afghanistan or Iraq for that matter.

Bonobo

(29,257 posts)
38. The current foreign policy is either...
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:20 AM
Apr 2013

increasing antagonism and therefore risk to the security of the US

or it is decreasing it.

If you are arguing that it is unchanged, which is incredibly unlikely, then you are making an argument for it being a poor foreign policy.

So I can only conclude that your position is that the current foreign policy has increased the security of the US --and I suppose you therefore must discount the idea that deaths of innocent people around the world DOES NOT create more enemies of the US.

Seems like a naive if not outright stupid belief system, but you go with it if it makes you feel good, Geek.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
40. No, naive is believing is that if we just played nicey-nice
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:25 AM
Apr 2013

with the rest of the world there would be no risk of terrorist attacks.


By the way, now that you've determined that Obama is at fault for these attacks, you should really get on the horn with the FBI and explain how you know the motives of the bombers.



Certainly drone attacks have proven to be counterproductive, but it's irrational to conclude that drone attacks are the only reason why anyone would want to butcher Americans.

Stop by lower Manhattan and see the memorial there if you need a refresher. Or the sites of the embassy bombings in Africa. Etc etc etc.

Or the victims of Islamist terror attacks in India, etc.

Bonobo

(29,257 posts)
42. So be brave. Which is it?
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:31 AM
Apr 2013

A) The current foreign policy has resulted in a greater number of enemies of the US hell bent on revenge.

B) The current foreign policy has resulted in fewer numbers of enemies of the US.

C) It has remained the same.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
43. After you tell us how you know that Obama's foreign policy was a cause
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:33 AM
Apr 2013

of the Boston bombing, as you claimed downthread.

On the other hand, if you don't think relentless attacks by the US in Pakistan, Afghanistan, Yemen as well as other ME policies have anything to do with this, I think you are not thinking it through.


No, I don't think relentless attacks by the US in Pakistan, Afghanistan, and Yemen had anything to do with the Boston bombing.

How am I not thinking it through?

As an alternative, you can disown that claim.

olegramps

(8,200 posts)
47. I don't believe that the so-called Islamists need any provocation to support their hatred.
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 11:05 AM
Apr 2013

Anyone who is not a Islamist extremist is considered to the be the enemy regardless of their nationality or religion. The war between the Sunni and Shia has been ongoing for 1500 years.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
24. And there's the first DU'er to blame the Boston bombing on Obama.
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:27 AM
Apr 2013

Take a bow, sir. We knew we could count on you to point the finger at Obama over this.





Bonobo

(29,257 posts)
28. Truly, you sound like a petulant child.
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:50 AM
Apr 2013

Newsflash: Foreign policy involving attacking and killing innocent people results in increased antagonism towards the country that did the killing.

Now EXACTLY rocket science.

 

geek tragedy

(68,868 posts)
29. Please let the FBI know that you've solved the Boston bombing case,
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:56 AM
Apr 2013

since you are declaring that you know both the identity and the motive for the bombers.

Because, otherwise, you are just hatefully blaming Obama for something that is not his fault.

JHB

(37,128 posts)
35. What I think is that, despite my many policy disagreements with the administration,...
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:14 AM
Apr 2013

...we are not further encumbered by a cluster of ideologues with chips on their shoulders to vindicate their discredited (in most quarters) favored courses of action. And their proteges, looking to make their own reputations by continuing that 'fight".

JDPriestly

(57,936 posts)
13. Now there is something we can agree on.
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 08:59 AM
Apr 2013

Obama's foreign policy probably isn't perfect, but it is so much better than the foreign policy of the Republicans.

I think we should close some of our bases overseas, but the military and intelligence are very entrenched in our government. It's probably next to impossible to loosen their grip on their profitable bureaucracy.

 

Zax2me

(2,515 posts)
15. Fuck that.
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:04 AM
Apr 2013

We were still attacked. With Obama in office and HIS foreign policy.

But - hundreds injured several dead. And you get politics out of this?

davidpdx

(22,000 posts)
33. I agree, it's too early to jump to conclusions whether this was a foreign or domestic attack
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:07 AM
Apr 2013

or to start pointing fingers. People should be thinking good thoughts for those who have been injured and for the families of those killed. I'm sure the finger pointing will start soon enough. Give it around a week.

Honestly I have a hunch it isn't foreign, but then again I could be wrong.

JHB

(37,128 posts)
36. I get that we don't also have to contend with opportunists eager to seize on an excuse...
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:17 AM
Apr 2013

...to launch adventures that have nothing to do with what has happened, no matter who turns out to be responsible.

harmonicon

(12,008 posts)
27. Sure... but that's not saying much.
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 09:48 AM
Apr 2013

Our foreign policy is still completely atrocious. Just because things could be worse doesn't mean they're good as-is.

RyanThomas

(23 posts)
32. I wonder which Country we would have discovered WMDs in?
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:04 AM
Apr 2013

Or it would be Iran. Yeah. Iran did it in Romneyland. Time to invade. On the other hand...

We would have cut Big Bird so with the estimated savings of 300 million total from all of PBS we might be able to finance the invasion for a couple minutes. No doubt the noble sacrifice of Big Bird would forever endear him as a glorious martyr for the march on Tehran and the subsequent decade long war against the resistance. All cheer the great leader Romney!

Arcanetrance

(2,670 posts)
34. Right now I will say it makes me feel slightly better it's not in a full blown right wingers hands
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:12 AM
Apr 2013

But bush didn't go to war and pass the Patriot act the very next day either so I will wait and see where the aftermath leads us.

Harry Monroe

(2,935 posts)
39. I'm just glad that there are adults in the White House
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:25 AM
Apr 2013

And not Frat Boy Shrub or his ilk. If it was determined that the Saudis had a hand in this, Rmoney would probably use this as an excuse to invade Iran, because as you know, this ruse worked so well last time.

Harry Monroe

(2,935 posts)
44. And I' so glad that the adults are letting law enforcement do their jobs
Tue Apr 16, 2013, 10:33 AM
Apr 2013

First and foremost, let them do the detective work and find out who is behind this. We need to be careful and measured in any response withing the government this time, something that was completely lacking after 9/11. Rampant hysteria ruled the day, and the Bushies took full advantage of it to promote their ultimate agenda.

I'd rather them take their time and be right rather than "Rush" to judgement with speculation and hysteria wrapped in the American Flag disguised as "truth" in order to fulfill some other hidden agenda the Administration may have.

So glad adults are in charge for a change. I shudder to think how Rmoney would have responded in the coming weeks or months.

donheld

(21,311 posts)
48. No.
Wed Apr 17, 2013, 02:34 AM
Apr 2013

Bradley Manning. Personally I believe Multinational corporations dictate too much of our foreign policy.

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