Welcome to DU! The truly grassroots left-of-center political community where regular people, not algorithms, drive the discussions and set the standards. Join the community: Create a free account Support DU (and get rid of ads!): Become a Star Member All Forums Issue Forums Culture Forums Alliance Forums Region Forums Support Forums Help & Search

redqueen

(115,096 posts)
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 11:37 AM Apr 2013

On Pay Equity Day, Why Women Are Paid Less Than Men

...

The truth is, the choices women (and men) make do not occur in a vacuum. The fastest growing sectors of the economy are female dominated, but they are also jobs with low wages and large gender wage gaps. These are the occupations that are adding the most new jobs, so one can hardly blame women for taking them –especially as our economy continues to slowly recover. And while it is true that some women choose to take time out of the workforce to care for children or other relatives, the preexisting wage gap is often the reason they do so. In a married couple it often makes the most economic sense for the parent with the lower salary to be the one to take time off, and if a woman’s wages barely (or do not) cover the extremely high costs of childcare it make not make economic sense for her to keep working. But taking time away from work lowers wages in the long run and helps some employers justify discriminating against women workers in terms of pay and promotions,contributing to the vicious cycle that is the gender wage gap.

Unfortunately, regardless of what some would like the public to believe, the gender wage gap is real and has significant impacts on women’s lives in both the short and the long term. Even women who “do everything right” still feel the impact in the end. While the wage gap is not as large as it once was, progress has stalled in recent years. Legislation like the Paycheck Fairness Act,which would protect workers who discuss their salaries and impose greater sanctions against employers who discriminate, and policies to provide paid family and medical leave and expand access to preschool and childcare would go a long way to help rectify this inequity.

http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2013/04/09/1839281/on-equal-pay-day-why-women-are-paid-less-than-men/

32 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
On Pay Equity Day, Why Women Are Paid Less Than Men (Original Post) redqueen Apr 2013 OP
k and r--and waiting for the usual suspects. . . niyad Apr 2013 #1
The ones who smear me as not being a 'real' feminist, and claim I never post about 'real' issues, redqueen Apr 2013 #3
I find it mildly amusing that you post a completely rational, important Vinnie From Indy Apr 2013 #7
Bellowing? WTF? redqueen Apr 2013 #10
remdi95 opiate69 Apr 2013 #19
awww, that is so sweet niyad Apr 2013 #21
This message was self-deleted by its author BainsBane Apr 2013 #24
Rec. The Link Apr 2013 #2
K&R haikugal Apr 2013 #4
It is libodem Apr 2013 #5
There are a dedicated few here who insist there is no wage gap. redqueen Apr 2013 #6
Again, why did you post this? Vinnie From Indy Apr 2013 #8
Why do you have a problem with what I said? redqueen Apr 2013 #11
Were your ears burning or what? The Link Apr 2013 #12
Is there something not factual about what she posted? Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #22
It is clear libodem Apr 2013 #13
Yes, the math has been done and checked and rechecked... redqueen Apr 2013 #14
+10.000 smirkymonkey Apr 2013 #16
No - SOME women earn .77 cents JustAnotherGen Apr 2013 #26
is it strange hfojvt Apr 2013 #18
HuffPo doesn't say the gap doesn't exist BainsBane Apr 2013 #20
I did not represent anything about the Sommers article hfojvt Apr 2013 #30
My journal entry on Republican Christina Hoff Sommers and her false claims: Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #23
Thank you for linking to that. nt redqueen Apr 2013 #29
You've Got to be kidding me with that noise JustAnotherGen Apr 2013 #27
"I think the claim of 77 cents on the dollar is clearly nonsense" BainsBane Apr 2013 #31
Congress has been dragging its feet on pay inequality for a very long time slackmaster Apr 2013 #9
I agree. Thank you! smirkymonkey Apr 2013 #15
k&r Starry Messenger Apr 2013 #17
This message was self-deleted by its author HiPointDem Apr 2013 #25
k&r HappyMe Apr 2013 #28
men react to getting" paid" less mercuryblues Apr 2013 #32

redqueen

(115,096 posts)
3. The ones who smear me as not being a 'real' feminist, and claim I never post about 'real' issues,
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 11:59 AM
Apr 2013

or the ones who swear this is all lies and the wage gap is a myth and really there's no such thing as male privilege?

I'm starting to no longer be able to tell them apart.

Vinnie From Indy

(10,820 posts)
7. I find it mildly amusing that you post a completely rational, important
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 12:13 PM
Apr 2013

article about an issue affecting all women and then, rather than wait to see the reaction of DU'ers, immediately start bellowing about persecution and enemies at the gate. Would it not be better to have just a modicum of patience and reply to posts as they are written and posted here? Just a thought!

Cheers!

redqueen

(115,096 posts)
10. Bellowing? WTF?
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 12:18 PM
Apr 2013

I replied to a response without bellowing, thank you. I made a point directed at people who make it a point to lie about others. That's something that bothers me. Interesting that you find it amusing, though.

Feel free to ignore things that don't concern you. Or, you know, continue to look for opportunities to... whatever.

Response to niyad (Reply #1)

libodem

(19,288 posts)
5. It is
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 12:07 PM
Apr 2013

Discrimination, pure and simple. We, women need better negotiating skills at the outset, during the wage discussion. We must believe in our own abilities and know our worth.

Men are able to brag and boast and overstate their capabilities. We are more likely to be humble and modest and grateful for a chance.

Confident negotiations are a beginning. It can be a practiced and learned skill. (While we wait for society to catch up)

Good article. I can't imagine any "usual subjects", disagreeing on this issue. Equal pay for equal work is a given liberal stance. I'm preparing for a shock, that I hope does not happen.

redqueen

(115,096 posts)
6. There are a dedicated few here who insist there is no wage gap.
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 12:10 PM
Apr 2013

That it's really not that bad. That it isn't such a big deal. Etc, etc, ad nauseam.

Vinnie From Indy

(10,820 posts)
8. Again, why did you post this?
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 12:15 PM
Apr 2013

Was this post merely your daily "knock this chip off my shoulder" routine or do you really want to start a rational discussion about the topic raised in the article? Why not let DU'ers weigh in before lashing out at phantom enemies.

Cheers!

redqueen

(115,096 posts)
11. Why do you have a problem with what I said?
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 12:22 PM
Apr 2013

Hm?

Would you rather I shut up about the fact that there are "usual subjects", who disagree on this issue?

redqueen

(115,096 posts)
14. Yes, the math has been done and checked and rechecked...
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 01:19 PM
Apr 2013

and for some industries, the gap is smaller. However to ignore the millions of women who aren't in one of those industries is simply wrong. The fact that some women are almost being paid fairly does not mean all our struggles on this issue are over and we can all relax now.

JustAnotherGen

(31,681 posts)
26. No - SOME women earn .77 cents
Wed Apr 10, 2013, 06:18 AM
Apr 2013

Others earn .70 cents on the dollar or .64 cents on the dollar . . .

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/29/wage-gap-african-american-women-infographic_n_2568838.html

According to the latest U.S. Census Bureau data, women in the United States are paid just 77 cents for every dollar paid to men on average. But a closer look reveals that for African-American women, this disparity is much worse, with women of color earning just 70 cents for every dollar paid to men and just 64 cents for every dollar paid to white, non-Hispanic men.

What's more: It's happening in the 20 states with the largest number of African-American women working full-time and year round, studies show.

“Women of color are hard hit by a kind of perfect –- and perfectly devastating –- storm caused by discrimination, a struggling economy and the country’s failure to adopt family friendly workplace policies,” said Debra L. Ness, president of the National Partnership for Women & Families, in a release. “These new data show that the wage gap is costing women of color thousands of dollars in critical income each year that could be spent on food, rent, health care and on meeting other fundamental needs for their families,” she added, underlining the Partnership's findings that closing the wage gap would afford a working African-American woman more than two years’ worth of food; almost 10 months’ worth of mortgage and utilities payments; more than 16 months of rent; more than three years’ worth of family health insurance premiums; or 4,549 additional gallons of gas, each year.

Previous research has shown that the gap often starts right out of college -- as women are less likely than men to be fully employed one year post grad -- and has a significant impact on the burden of student loan debt. Women on Wall Street are even more likely to feel the pinch.



When one asks me why I'm a feminist - it is THIS issue. This is my core reason for being a feminist.

Money is power. It is independence. It is a longer life and a better quality of life. It is women not "settling" because it's financially better for them to do so.

One of the best things my father ever said to me ( said it to my mom too) - "my wife and daughter are not cheap goods and they aren't for sale.". Note: after his military career Dad was a purchasing, mergers, acquisitions, corporate henchman. He taught me how to negotiate and ask for what I DESERVED.

And in spite of this - I still got the sucker punch of being promoted and inheriting a man with a chip on his shoulder that made more money for me. Company solution? Move him to a manager who was a man that he made less obey than.

Lily Ledbetter was a good start. But we need a Paycheck Fairness Act NOW so i can go back and sue for what happened in 2008. So a woman who has 20 years on the job can go back and sue. The PFA that failed? It had protection in it for those who wished to right a wrong.

Some hipster too cool pseudo liberal will come long and say - Buy its money and greed and you are being just like the Koch Brothers and you have to give up you progressive card.

Really? To that I say go Cheney Yourself! It's only money - but it's YOUR money honey - so go get what is yours.

hfojvt

(37,573 posts)
18. is it strange
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 09:38 PM
Apr 2013

for somebody to be "dedicated" to things they believe to be true?

Is it nauseous for somebody to believe something different that what you are sure is true?

I think the claim of 77 cents on the dollar is clearly nonsense, but I don't find that claim to be sickening.

Either one can debunk a claim or they cannot.

If you get tired of always making the same arguments, then why not make a journal entry? You can there set up all the standard arguments and knock them down http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=389x1539550

Some other organizations may have already done this http://www.huffingtonpost.com/christina-hoff-sommers/wage-gap_b_2073804.html

But as I read that article I notice it is from the AEI. Not a place I consider credible. And now I think this is the person that Somerby was quoting.

BainsBane

(53,001 posts)
20. HuffPo doesn't say the gap doesn't exist
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 09:51 PM
Apr 2013

Last edited Tue Apr 9, 2013, 10:37 PM - Edit history (1)

As you have misrepresented. It tries to explain why it exists. Your own link proves you wrong.

hfojvt

(37,573 posts)
30. I did not represent anything about the Sommers article
Wed Apr 10, 2013, 11:20 AM
Apr 2013

my intention really was to google and find a site arguing in favor of the gap. My search came up with this article, which I am making no claims about one way or another. I noted that it was from the AEI, which I consider to be a crap organization like the Tax foundation, the Cato Institute, the Heritage foundation, etc., etc., ad nauseum. I usually end up having to debunk the putrid sludge they trowel out.

Heck, I did not expect anybody to click the link. Nobody ever does that.

JustAnotherGen

(31,681 posts)
27. You've Got to be kidding me with that noise
Wed Apr 10, 2013, 06:22 AM
Apr 2013

Let me guess - you loved the movie "The Help" too - right?

 

slackmaster

(60,567 posts)
9. Congress has been dragging its feet on pay inequality for a very long time
Tue Apr 9, 2013, 12:16 PM
Apr 2013

I wish voters would wake up and purge the ranks of recalcitrant members.

Response to redqueen (Original post)

Latest Discussions»General Discussion»On Pay Equity Day, Why Wo...