Damn. Non Sequitur NAILS it today

[n2doc]

2014, or sooner.

[Robb]

1. Ruin public education, you get uneducated voters.

I don't think we get to blame them, actually.

[n2doc]

2. Why not, they voted for it n/t

[Robb]

3. Do you really think education has only been under attack

...for the last decade?

We have failed an entire generation, IMO.

[n2doc]

5. It has been under attack, serious attack, since prop 13 in Cal in the late 70's

When voters decided that they didn't want to pay for that education, especially if them 'other' people were getting it too.

Frankly our ancestors were not all that educated, but they tried. And they tried to keep up on who was screwing them over. Our present generation seems more likely to accept whatever swill Fox and Rush feed them.

[enlightenment]

8. One set of my ancestors, born in the 1780s,

had twelve children - nine sons. They were "frontier" people; farmers. At least one of them (probably the ggg-granpa) could, apparently read - and probably would write to some degree.

They named their sons after literary and political figures - "John Milton", "Albert Gallatin", "William Wilson", etc.

They weren't educated, but they were, as you said, informed and aware.

[OldDem2012]

27. Education in the US has been under attack a lot longer than the late 1970s....

...the elitists (otherwise known as the Top 1%) have always attempted to limit education, especially higher education, to wealthy, privileged people like themselves who could afford it. That's been happening in this country since the very beginning.

[KansDem]

34. I was living in California in 1978 when Prop. 13 passed.

I lived in the L.A. area.

Prior to the vote, I heard one couple swear up and down that if it didn't pass, they would have to move out of California. Well, it passed and the very next thing this couple did was buy a second house in Big Bear Lake. It became their "weekend retreat."

They confused "entitlement" with "need"...

[MrScorpio]

47. At first, I was going to go to CA and live with a relative and go to school

Well, after it passed those plans were cancelled.

I really wanted to go to school out there, but couldn't afford it. Who knows, I might have even stayed in Cali to live.

[AnotherMcIntosh]

37. I'm not sure that California voters in the late 70's "didn't want to pay for" education.

There were a number of scandals involving tax assessors leading up to the proposal of Prop 13.

A great many property owners could also see elderly, long-term property owners being forced out of their homes by ever-increasing property taxes.

Taxes are the price that we pay for civilization (or endless wars in the Middle-East and bonuses for banksters), but many people -- including Democrats -- did not see a correlation between ever increasing property taxes and education. Some genuinely believed that money was being squandered. Some were fearful that they would ultimately lose their homes.

[Blanks]

52. When you've retired...

And the schools that your children went to are abandoned and new schools constructed on the taxpayers dime, it can appear that the school system is squandering tax money.

I don't have any specific instance on mind, but I've seen a lot of abandoned schools and newly constructed schools across the country. It doesn't seem like school districts are always trying to get more bang for their buck.

[Cal Carpenter]

4. Both Dems and Repubs are chipping away public ed

(eg Arne Duncan as Secretary of Education)

So I suppose it's the almost half of Americans who DON'T vote that are doing it right? Is that your point?

[CreekDog]

48. because the children in public schools now didn't vote against themselves

the generation that was supposed to be looking out for them did.

is this so complicated?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

7. They vote for the party of the rich thinking it will make them rich...

That, and they consider Liberals to be the enemy.

Here's a gem from the holidays that gives you a glimpse into the culture.

[slackmaster]

14. They also vote for the party of everyone but the rich thinking their needs will be provided for.

It cuts both ways.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

15. Not really. Republicans are the party of Wall Street except to Rural America,...

.....that's where they talk about the "elitist" Liberals.

When you consider the Rural Base you will see why the Republican Party is always bringing up bestiality as a possibility. Imagine if you spent all of your time schmoozing with the rich in DC and when you went back to your district you held a town hall in a barn.

[bvar22]

28. Millions more Americans voted for the "D" the last 8 years,

but Education is STILL under attack by the Privatizers like Arne Duncan
who was appointed to the cabinet position of Secretary of Education by President Obama in 2009.
And, of course, there is Rahm.
He is destroying Public Education in Chicago.

So WHO do we vote for if we support Quality Public Education?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

29. Kucinich....

Hey,...you asked.

[merrily]

56. He did not run in 2012, did he?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

64. I still wrote him in during the primary....

I know,....made me feel like a Paulite....

[merrily]

65. Writing in Kucinich should not make anyone feel like a Paulite.

[merrily]

55. Is an answer to that question allowed on this board?

[merrily]

54. "Democrats" do not equal "liberals." Precious few liberals make it to a primary, let alone to

elected office.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

63. That was due to the DLC....

They kept claiming the loss of Michael Dukakis was absolute PROOF the nation had swung to the right. All through the right controlled media we kept hearing the mantra "This is a center/right country" until it was accepted as truth in DC.

It wasn't true then and if anything, this country has become even more liberal but there are still Clintonites to deal with who hold decision making positions.

[merrily]

66. Almost the entire DNC is now of that view.

Progressive Policy Institute, Third Way, New Democrat--all similar to DLC.

As I said, to this day very few liberals make it to a primary.

BTW, the DLC first took that position--this is proof that liberals cannot win-- when Mondale lost to Reagan.

Here's a little irony about Dukakis and the DLC.

"NDN is led and was founded by Simon Rosenberg in 1996 after his split with the Democratic Leadership Council, for which he worked. Before founding NDN, Rosenberg worked as a television news writer and producer and a political strategist for the Michael Dukakis and Bill Clinton presidential campaigns and the Democratic National Committee. NDN has offices in Washington, D.C., New York City, San Francisco, and Miami.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Democrat_Network

[Spitfire of ATJ]

68. When they claimed the DLC was shutting down everyone knew they were rebranding....

People in power don't give up for being wrong.

Obama has a LOT of liberal members that make up his machine and their victories overshadow the record of failure from the "New Democrats".

[merrily]

69. I am not sure I know what you mean by Obama's machine?

Do you mean his campaign people, like Axelrod?

Or his Presidential administration, Cabinet, White House advisors, etc.?

If so, I am not sure which liberal members of either of those you mean, or what victories you mean.

ETA: BTW, I don't think the DLC is rebranding. I think it felt it had accomplished its mission of all but eliminating liberals from positions of power within the party and eliminating most liberal candidates. Besides, I'm guessing Al From wanted to retire. And almost all the other Democratic think tanks are DLC oriented, like Third Way and Progressive Policy Institute.

[Spitfire of ATJ]

71. The thousands of dedicated young people who joined the effort....

Those people are the future of the Party as the old guard moves on.

[merrily]

72. Do you mean younger voters and volunteers?

[Spitfire of ATJ]

73. That room was filled with people who were in leadership positions within the campaign....

Equivalent to captain rank. Those idealistic liberals will move up within the party shifting the party to the Left.

People like Harold Ford are on their way out.

[merrily]

74. Ah, thanks.

I really hope that you are correct about the future of the Party.

[riverbendviewgal]

6. i highly recommend reading joe bageant's books and blog

Go to joebageant.com. He died a couple years and grew up in Appalachia among these people, his people. He writes of them and why they vote against their own interests. I had the honor to exchange a few emails with him before he got sick.

[dixiegrrrrl]

10. Second that recommendation.

All of his writings are available, for free download, at http://coldtype.net/joe.html

Coldtype has lots of other good free material, poking around the site is rewarding.

[riverbendviewgal]

22. Thanks for the heads up on Joe's site

I loved his writings. Got his books Deer Hunting and Rainbow. He gave me a good understanding of some people I knew at the time.

[AnotherMcIntosh]

38. Thank you.

What a prolific writer.

[BobbyBoring]

20. Joe actually grew up in Winchester Va

where I was raised. Not Appalachia geographically, but pretty close culturally. Great guy who I was lucky to know.

[riverbendviewgal]

21. You were lucky to know him.

Many places in America could be Appalachia. I am familiar with south eastern Ohio and it is like Appalachia in some parts.. I knew people who came from there. Very sad.

I was thrilled when Joe wrote back to me....We had a lot of things in common.

[mountain grammy]

9. I love the cartoon but it's missing a couple of things

A 'merican flag hanging off the trailer, a McCain/Palin yard sign, and a large cross on the front yard.
I know this place, I've driven by it all over the country.

[slackmaster]

11. That's because it's not a partisan comic. If it were, the items you mentioned would surely be in it.

It's a shot at the status quo in general - Entrenched self-serving career politicians who work to perpetuate their own power.

People keep sending the same batch of idiots back to Congress every two years and every six years.

[mountain grammy]

12. Good point, I can see that. Now leave me alone, my brain hurts.

guess we're all slackers, huh slackmaster?

[slackmaster]

13. Most voters are IMO lazy. Even when Congress polls very low in popularity, people still tend...

...to think highly of their own representatives.

They can't see the forest for the trees.

[LibDemAlways]

16. People in general are clueless. They can't even name the

Vice President much less their local reps. Those who bother to vote look for the R or the D next to the name and that's it. Schools perpetuate civic stupidity too. In 13 years (including K) at our local "Blue Ribbon" public school, my daughter never once encountered a teacher who mentioned "current events." Hate to sound like one of those crotchity oldsters, but when I was in school, what was going on in the world was considered important. Today everything is dumbed down and people wander around in a fog.

[riverbendviewgal]

23. The unfortunate thing is that they are "proud" of it

like my NJ bubba brother.

[xtraxritical]

24. That's for sure, average Americans revel in mediocrity.

That's why people laugh at Foxworthy and stupid videos like this. Sadly, not funny at all.

[JDPriestly]

31. Most voters are too busy with jobs and family to stay informed or distracted by the celebrity news.

[slackmaster]

42. Someone who is "too busy" to cast a thoughtful vote should stay home and not vote.

[erronis]

45. Not to be contrarian (re being busy)

But I really think most of us have it very easy compared to prior generations.

We may be more easily distracted and think that "our issues" are overwhelmingly important, but try comparing that to many who have had (and still do) to work 10-14 hours to survive, worry about food/clothing/lodging/safety for children.

Perhaps the pablum of the masses (TV/infinite cable) dulls the senses but I don't think most families really trying to cope are into celebrity news.

[chervilant]

51. Let's not forget

the ever popular, essential rebel flag ...

[woo me with science]

17. Hard to vote for your own interests, when the one percent pick the candidates

for both parties.

They are already lining up the new corporatists and warmongers for 2016.

[JDPriestly]

32. With Hillary at the top of the list. Sad.

[SammyWinstonJack]

58. BINGO!

[liberal N proud]

18. BAM!

[DemoTex]

19. DAMN! Almost like the artist saw my SC photo from January 2013!

[xtraxritical]

25. So not cool, clean it up for the earths sake.

[DemoTex]

33. They have, somewhat ..

Since I snapped this photo, they towed the wrecked pickup truck and took down the Redneck flag. But the whole stretch of SC-11 is a blight on the landscape.

[dawg]

35. Historically inaccurate.

No Confederate soldiers from SC ever fought under a Confederate flag with the word "REDNECK" superimposed across the cossed bars. Only the 4th & 6th Mississippi regiments, Peak's brigade from Southern Alabama, and scattered companies of the Army of Northern Georgia, ever used such a flag.

[DemoTex]

44. I don't think these Bubbas "get" history.

[WheelWalker]

46. +1

[WillyT]

26. K & R !!!

[Marr]

30. And with neoliberals in control of the Democratic Party, that's YOU, too.

You get two choices: corporate party A, or corporate party B. Coke or Pepsi. Two parties with the same economic and foreign policy agendas, who have split up social issues so as to give the illusion of choice.

The fact that our elections so regularly come out 50/50 these days is a testament to how phoney our two party system has become. The differences are so nuanced and market-tested that we regularly come down to a few votes difference.

[bvar22]

39. "the illusion of a choice"

No truer words spoken.


Our neighbors in Latin America have given us a Blue Print for real "change".

[nightscanner59]

41. That's why I plan on 2016 voting green

And pushing that message as long as it doesn't get taken down... like it does sometimes on D.U.

[Janecita]

59. You and me both!

[rhett o rick]

49. Well put. "The illusion of choice". That seem enough even for lots of DU posters.

Their pat response, "It's better than under Romney", shows their ignorance. No I take ignorance back. They are just in denial.

Ralph got it wrong when he said both parties are the same. Not true. One party is friendlier on social issues and for some here, that's enough for them.

[bullwinkle428]

67. Bingo. The scene could have been labeled "All American citizens minus the 1%."

[pam4water]

36. It's not like voting for Obama had that much better an out come.

[SammyWinstonJack]

60. True.

[lpbk2713]

40. A slice of life right out of Central Florida.

They'll do it every time.

[jtuck004]

43. I generally like the cartoon, but it gives the impression of poverty, yet the

behavior of voting is correlated more strongly with higher income. So that picture would be better with a middle class family, two cars in the drive, draining their retirement income accounts as they hope against hope that things are going to turn around, while they vote either D or R.

But that is harder to get across in a cartoon.

[rhett o rick]

50. You are making a great point. I work with people living in poverty and they arent that political.

There concerns are much more basic. And they dont see that any politician is going to help them.

[colsohlibgal]

53. Bullseye!

Since I'm one of the 77 people who still get a physical newspaper in the morning, I let out a big "Yes!!" and reached for my scissors to clip it out today. The dead solid truth.

[merrily]

57. The assumption of a number of responses on this thread seems to be that the poor vote Republican.

[n2doc]

61. Yes. and?

One could more correctly say that poor rural voters vote republican. The toon doesn't imply otherwise

[merrily]

62. I am not sure that the assumption on this thread were limited to the rural poor.

I am not sure that the cartoon was, either. Permanent poverty is not only about rural poor.

My impression was that posters were making assumptions, perhaps without even realizing that they were making them. I often try to cut against doing that. I care about the process--or lack theireof-- by which we reach conclusions. And, in my thinking, my post was about the process, more than wbether the assumptions were correct or not.

As to the latter point, I am afraid that I not sure what your graphic says about how poor people voted versus how those above the poverty level voted.

[forestpath]

70. K&R