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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region Forums'President Pelosi' Trends on Twitter After Donald Trump Suggests Delaying the Election
President Donald Trump has suggested delaying the election due to his voiced concerns over mail-in ballots, and in the wake of his comments, "President Pelosi" trended on Twitter Thursday morning. In a tweet, Trump offered the idea, writing, "With Universal Mail-In Voting (not Absentee Voting, which is good), 2020 will be the most INACCURATE & FRAUDULENT Election in history. It will be a great embarrassment to the USA. Delay the Election until people can properly, securely and safely vote???"
Following Trump's tweet, many began to point out that a presidential term only lasts for four years regardless of whether an election is delayed and that Trump and his administration would be out on Jan. 20, 2021. In this situation, with the absence of a president and vice president, the Speaker of the House would become president. The current House Speaker is Nancy Pelosi, who is a Democrat from California. This idea has had people talking all over Twitter. Scroll down to see what they're saying.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/popculture.com/trending/amp/news/president-pelosi-trends-twitter-donald-trump-suggests-delaying-election/
wryter2000
(46,016 posts)Don't freak, as he wants you to. Troll him.
I_UndergroundPanther
(12,450 posts)Sounds wonderful to me!
Thekaspervote
(32,606 posts)Roc2020
(1,603 posts)talk about adding insult to injury It's the reverse with Trump. The injury of the tanking economy, his blotch handling of CV19 and groups like the Republican led Lincoln project just knifing him at every turn knowing the humiliation and insult he will lose in Nov. He is going through a crushing and painful reaping. I'd feel sorry for him except he is such a rotten person.
crickets
(25,896 posts)patphil
(6,029 posts)If there is no election, there is no House of Representatives after January 3rd.
There is still a Senate, made up of the remaining members who weren't up for election this November.
Since the Speaker of the House position would thus be vacant, it falls to the President pro tempore of the Senate; the next in the line of succession.
That "s Senator Chuck Grassley from Iowa.
So, if there is no election, it would be President Grassley. He'll be 87 in September.
disambiguation
(28 posts)1/3 of the senators would leave office, as you said - 21 republicans and 12 Democrats. That would leave 67 senators. Currently there are 53 republican senators, 45 Democratic senators and 2 independents who caucus with the Democrats. So, after January 3rd there will be 32 republican senators (assuming 2 that said they were retiring don't do it), 33 Democratic senators and 2 independents who caucus with the Democrats. As far as I know, there is no reason the senate can't meet between January 3rd and January 20th and elect new leaders. According to this site https://www.senate.gov/legislative/LameDuckSessions.htm, the Twentieth Amendment to the Constitution (1933) provides that new Congresses convene on January 3 of odd-numbered years. After January 20th, Trump would no longer be president and the President pro tempore of the Senate would assume the office. At least that's what it looks like from what I read. I doubt that the 33 Democrats and the 2 Independents would elect Grassley as President pro tempore.
tritsofme
(17,322 posts)After January 3rd, governors could fill the new vacancies, potentially restoring a Republican majority in the chamber prior to January 20 and the expiration of Trumps term. During the interim period where Democrats held a technical majority, a new organizing resolution could be filibustered, and the Senate leadership wouldnt necessarily have to change.
Towlie
(5,307 posts)grantcart
(53,061 posts)Filibuster wouldn't be in the new rules.
In any case there is always a 'nuclear' option where the majority accepts a new interpretation of the rules.
The Senate leadership's term expires on the 3rd even though 2/3 of the Senate is still in office.
Realize this is all in the theater of the absurd.
tritsofme
(17,322 posts)the current organization structure of the Senate would remain, regardless of membership changes.
The new majority on Jan 3 could eliminate the filibuster, and pass their new organizing resolution, but again, their majority would only exist until Republican governors filled up the new vacancies, which would presumably happen prior to Jan 20.
grantcart
(53,061 posts)"Congress" is commonly used as a term referring to the House of Representatives and the Senate referred to by its name the Senate. This is actually incorrect.
The House and the Senate meet "in congress" for two year terms. This is the 116th Congress. It is the 116th formulation of the House and the 116th formulation of the Senate. This term of Congress expires on 1/3/2019 and a new Congress will be established.
This Congress started on 1/3/2019 and ends on 1/3/21. All of the offices, appointments and rules terminate on that day. There is no continuing offices, resolutions or rules. There is a procedure in each body to certify new members and only until that is completed can the 117th Congress of the United States begin its work. It will first elect its officers and then approve the standing rules. Until that happens there is no 117th Congress and no position of authority in the House or the Senate is "carried over".
Each Congress lasts exactly 2 years and then end. We don't have a Congress, we have had 117 official meetings of Congress, each constituted with its own leaders and rules with a starting day and an ending day.
In threads like this many will suppose that the Speaker continues, the Senate continues, etc. None of that is true because the 116th Congress will, like the 115 Congress's before it, come to an end, its term having expired.
It has also been postulated that Grassley will be the President Pro Tem (or Patrick Leahy) because they are the longest serving Senators in their party. That is by custom. If the PPT position were to actually become a likely President by succession I would assume that both parties would select someone more suitable for President, like Mitt Romney for the Republicans or Senator Warren for the Democrats.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/116th_United_States_Congress
The 116th United States Congress is the current meeting of the legislative branch of the United States federal government, composed of the Senate and the House of Representatives. It convened in Washington, D.C., on January 3, 2019, and will end on January 3, 2021,
tritsofme
(17,322 posts)Only senators beginning a new term take the oath of office at the start of the new Congress, the Senate does not re-adopt its rules. If no new president pro-temp is chosen, Grassley remains.
As Robert Byrd remarked: The United States Senate is an unbroken thread, running from our time back to its first meeting in New York in April 1789. By this I mean the Senate is a continuous body. While the entire House of Representatives is elected every two years, only one-‐third of the senators run at each biennial election. Since two-‐thirds carry over, our rules are continuous and do not have to be readopted at the beginning of each Congress
grantcart
(53,061 posts)within minutes.
A few known facts:
2 + 2 = 4
Presidential/Vice Presidential Terms are 4 years
House of Representative Terms are 2 years
Senate terms are 6 years
The House of Representatives and the Senate formally constitute a legal body called "the Congress" for exactly 2 years.
The officers of both the Senate and the House last exactly 2 years with one exception, the Vice President.
It is true that certain traditions in the Senate are continuous but we are not talking about those esoteric ones. This thread is about the Officers of the Senate having continuous standing.
This is undiluted bull, without any basis of fact and easily proven.
It is true Robert Byrd was President Pro Tem of the Senate. He served in that position for 2 and 1/2 years. It was not a single election that he continued in.
On Jan 3 2007 he was elected to a 2 year term to that office.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/110th_United_States_Congress
January 3, 2007 January 3, 2009
Senate President Dick Cheney (R)
Senate President pro tem Robert Byrd (D)
House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D)
On Jan 3rd Robert Byrd's term as President pro tem ended.
The 111th Congress admitted its new members and with the change in membership a new election was held, as it has been done for 222 years to elect new officers.
Senator Byrd was then elected President pro tem of the 112th Congress until he died in 2010
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/111th_United_States_Congress
January 3, 2009 January 3, 2011
Senate President Dick Cheney (R),
(until January 20, 2009)
Joe Biden (D),
(from January 20, 2009)
Senate President pro tem Robert Byrd (D),
(until June 28, 2010)
Daniel Inouye (D)
(from June 28, 2010)[1]
The only office in the Senate that is not voted on for a new term on January 3rd of every odd year is the Vice President which has its own Constitutionally defined term.
The reason that many people misunderstand the term of the Senate (not Senators but the Senate) and the House of Representatives goes to a basic misunderstanding of the word "Congress". Because it has become common for people to address Representatives to the House as "Congressman" or "Congresswoman" it has become common to think that the word Congress is a substitute for the House of Representatives.
It is not
The Constitution defines Congress as:
Article 1
Section 1: Congress
All legislative Powers herein granted shall be vested in a Congress of the United States, which shall consist of a Senate and House of Representatives.
People talk about Congress but there has never been a continuing meeting of Congress, each Congress (both Senate and the House) are reconstituted every 2 years. Each Congress is separate.
There is an obvious reason why Senate Officers elected by Senators must be elected upon the enrollment of each Congress: 1/3 of the members are newly elected, so it makes sense that all of the members, new and old would have a voice in the election of the officers.
As stated at the beginning this is an issue that is well documented, and is without debate.
With Each Congress the Senate elects new officers (except for the Vice President)
Here are a list
January 3, 2019 January 3, 2021
Senate President
Mike Pence (R)
Senate President pro tem
Chuck Grassley (R)
House Speaker
Nancy Pelosi (D)
The 116th United States Congress is the current meeting of the legislative branch of the United States federal government, composed of the Senate and the House of Representatives. It convened in Washington, D.C., on January 3, 2019, and will end on January 3, 2021,
It is a fixed term. Even Pence's term is fixed. When he is defeated his term as Senate President will end on Jan 20, 2021. It is in black and white.
Here is a comprehensive list of the officers of the 117th Congress
Listed alphabetically by party, until majorities are determined. Note: Democrats refer to themselves as a "Caucus," Republicans refer to themselves as a "Conference."
Senate President
Mike Pence (R), at least until January 20, 2021President: Mike Pence (R), at least until January 20, 2021
President pro tempore: TBD
President pro tempore emeritus: TBD
Democratic leadership[edit]
Democratic Leader: TBD
Democratic Whip: TBD
Assistant Democratic Leader: TBD
Chief Deputy Whip: TBD
Deputy Whips: TBD
Caucus Chair: TBD
Policy Committee Chair: TBD
Caucus Vice Chairs: TBD
Caucus Secretary: TBD
Campaign Committee Chair: TBD
Policy Committee Vice Chair: TBD
Steering Committee Chair: TBD
Outreach Chair: TBD
Steering and Outreach Committee Vice Chair: TBD
Republican leadership[edit]
Republican Leader: TBD
Assistant Republican Leader (Republican Whip): TBD
Chief Deputy Whip: TBD
Deputy Whips: TBD
Conference Chairman: TBD
Conference Vice Chair: TBD
Campaign Committee Chair: TBD
Policy Committee Chairman: TBD
Party leaders[edit]
House of Representatives[edit]
Listed alphabetically by party, until majorities are determined.
Speaker: TBD
Democratic leadership[edit]
Democratic Leader: TBD
Democratic Whip: TBD
Assistant Democratic Leader: TBD
Senior Chief Deputy Democratic Whip: TBD
Chief Deputy Democratic Whips: TBD
Caucus Chairman: TBD
Caucus Vice-Chairman: TBD
Campaign Committee Chairman: TBD
Steering and Policy Committee Co-Chairs: TBD
Organization, Study, and Review Chairman: TBD
Policy and Communications Chairman: TBD
Republican leadership[edit]
Republican Leader: TBD
Republican Whip: TBD
Republican Chief Deputy Whip: TBD
Senior Deputy Whips: TBD
Conference Chair: TBD
Conference Vice-Chair: TBD
Conference Secretary: TBD
Campaign Committee Chairman: TBD
Policy Committee Chairman: TBD
Here are the exact parameters of the 117th Congress
The 117th United States Congress is the next meeting of the legislative branch of the United States federal government, composed of the United States Senate and the United States House of Representatives. It is scheduled to meet in Washington, D.C., from January 3, 2021 to January 3, 2023. The elections of November 2020 will decide control of both houses.
The reason that all but one of the offices are TBD is because there is "NO CARRY OVER" of any office in either the Senate or the House.
As to the general nonsense of the Senate being "a continuous body", this tripe has been handed out by Senators like Byrd who wanted to create a myth of the Senate as "the greatest deliberative body in the world".
It is not
And it is not continuous, because if it were then Grassley and McConnell would continue in their positions and they will not.
This self mythologizing of Senators by Senators has been thoroughly destroyed in peer publications, you should find this well received peer review article useful on they myth of a continuous Senate.
Burying the Continuing Body Theory of the Senate by Aaron-Andrew P. Bruhl William & Mary Law School
https://scholarship.law.wm.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=2805&context=facpubs
tritsofme
(17,322 posts)majority, however the 108th Congress began with Democrats still holding the gavels, despite their minority status.
The reason being that Daschle and Frist were still in dispute on the organizing resolution for that Congress, how committee seats would be split, funding, etc. And Democrats indicated they would deny cloture on a new resolution while negotiations continued.
For more than two weeks into the new Congress, the previous organization held. Democrats even chaired a few hearings, while new members were left without committee assignments.
Now, in 2003, Democrats did not similarly delay the resolution electing Ted Stevens president pro-tempore, however you will search in vain for a resolution passed at the start of the 109th Congress selecting him anew, he remained without a vote in that new Congress.
Unlike the speaker, the term of the president pro-temp continues until the Senate chooses a new one. Go ahead and look at a list of Senate resolutions (lets do a little more vigorous research than Wikipedia here friend), the president pro-temp is only voted on when there is a change, as the Senate is a continuing body.
Though, I do agree it is astonishing that people become so invested in defending facts that can be found easily, within a few minutes. In the future, you may want to check your math before pouring on the smugness.
grantcart
(53,061 posts)is largely more correct than the authorities I cited.
The Office of the President Pro Tem is extended but only to the end of their term as Senator. If Grassley was facing election this November, his term would not be continued.
https://crsreports.congress.gov/product/pdf/RL/RL30960
Four years later the Senate resolved the question of the President pro tempores tenure when it
adopted a resolution originally introduced by Senator William M. Evarts of New York. As
adopted by the Senate on March 12, 1890, the resolution read:
Resolved, That it is competent for the Senate to elect a President pro tempore, who shall
hold the office during the pleasure of the Senate and until another is elected, and shall
execute the duties thereof during all future absences of the Vice-President until the Senate
otherwise order.22
That resolution is still in effect. Under its terms a President pro tempore, once elected, holds the
post continuously whether or not the Vice President is absent (although, of course, he may not
preside over the Senate unless the Vice President steps down from the chair). The tenure of the
President pro tempore ends upon the expiration of the term for which he was elected Senator, a
precedent dating back to at least 1841. He may, of course, resign, or the Senate may elect another
in his stead at its pleasure.
So your assertion that the term of the President Pro Tem of the continues past 2019 is correct but it is not an open ended extension as you implied. Grassley's term as President Pro Tem does have an end date and that date is Jan 3 2021. All in all your understanding which was not entirely correct was a lot closer to the record.
As to my doing additional searching beyond a reasonable public source, there was no evidence to suggest that it was incorrect. If you knew what the rule was why didn't you state it correctly and cite the authority.
As to the more general question of the Senate being a continuous body, you persist in the incorrect assumption that the Senate is continuous and the House is not.
As cited above in the Constitution the Senate and the House together, not separately for a "Congress" whose sessions are not continuous. They are termed events that start and finish on the same day for both houses. All of the Officers of both bodies finish the term on Jan 3rd of odd years and all of the Officers begin their terms on the same day, with the exception of the Vice President and the above noted exception of the President Pro Tem whose term ends on the last day of his Senate term.
Needless to say even though Grassley's term is continued it is unlikely he will be extended in that term because since he serves at the pleasure of the Senate he would not survive a resolution to replace. In that circumstance the Senate has established something called the President Pro Tem Emeritus for past PPT who lost the position by change of majority starting with Thurmond. Leahy, having been PPT now holds that position.
louzke9
(296 posts)Afterwards, HOWEVER, I don't think he can challenge the outcome of the Senate and Congressional election results. Since the results of the elections is based on electoral votes, wouldn't Trump have to challenge voting results at the State levels? Wouldn't he have to prove fraud in each state? In the meantime, Trump's current term expires. IF the COURTS REJECT Trump's lawsuits, Biden wins. If the results get tied up in court, Nancy Pelosi becomes interim President.
dansolo
(5,376 posts)The Speaker of the House isn't required to be a member, so she would remain as Speaker even if no election occurred.
grantcart
(53,061 posts)That term started on 1/3/2019 and finishes on 1/3/2021
Each Congress, including both Senate and House have a 2 year term. At the end of that term all of the offices, appointments and rules terminate.
A new election will elect a new speaker for the 117th Congress. That office will last exactly 2 years and then terminate.
You are correct that the Speaker doesn't need to be a member, but the office of speaker is for the term of the congress that currently exists. On 1/3/2021 the 116th Congress will no longer exist and there will be no Speaker until a new Congress is credentialed and elects a new Speaker.
Tumbulu
(6,267 posts)and so there will be a House and she will still be the speaker.
If some states have elections that become contested, or are made to be delayed, that does not stop the other states - such as CA - from operating.
Hortensis
(58,785 posts)the 117th house as its members, Democratic and Republican, elected their new speaker.
This January, as in 2016, there simply is no comparable alternative to Nancy Pelsoi, America's highest ranking woman in history. Speaker Pelosi's described as running her strongly united caucus like a machine, both against the Republicans and in creating important new legislation that must wait for January 3 to start being passed into law.
Out here, there'd be such outrage against anyone who'd try-try-again to sabotage liberal Democratic leadership, under Pelosi or anyone else, that they'd have even less power to make trouble. After all, we're all living with the consequences of their cumulative hostile actions over the entire 2015-2016 election period. Sympathy is...lessened.
And of course, Senator Sanders himself is currently united with Pelosi's and Schumer's liberal Democrats to run Republicans out of power. So I suspect most of those who tried to defeat Pelosi in 2016, like the blue dog #FiveWhiteMen group and the Quad-cum-Trid and others helped to office by the anti-Democratic JD/Brand New Congress, would largely content themselves with a few dissident speeches to their followers.
Cha
(295,899 posts)Mariana
(14,849 posts)Speaker Pelosi is up for election, too. If there isn't an election, Speaker Pelosi loses her position on January 20, just like Trump and Pence do.
Cha
(295,899 posts)it go to? Do you know? TY.
Mariana
(14,849 posts)Currently this is Chuck Grassley, but I imagine the new Senate, consisting of all the members who weren't up for election this year, could select a new one before Inauguration Day.
Cha
(295,899 posts)GigiLeigh
(73 posts)From March 24, 2020
On Tuesday, the Los Angeles Times published an analysis piece suggesting that President Donald Trump would risk making Speaker Nancy Pelosi president if he attempted to delay the 2020 presidential election.
Attorney and journalist Ian Millhiser took contention with that account. . .
If there is no election before January 20, Trumps term expires on that day, as does Pences so neither one of them is president.
Third in line is the Speaker of the House. But if there is no election, every house members term expires on January 3. So Pelosi isnt president. . .
Fourth in line is the president pro tempore of the Senate, who is the senior-most member of the majority party. Currently that is Chuck Grassley.
But wait! 23 Republicans are up for election in 2020, and only 12 Dems are. If there is no election, all of their terms expire. . .
If 23 GOP senators lose their seats and only 12 Dems, that means a Democratic majority, so Patrick Leahy becomes the senior-most member of the majority party, and fourth in line.
So he becomes president on January 20, when Trumps term expires.
https://www.uspresidentialelectionnews.com/2020/03/could-we-see-president-patrick-leahy-next-year/
First time poster so I hope I did this right. LOL
Rhiannon12866
(202,970 posts)Cha
(295,899 posts)Wow.. that is good news!
I'm guess they know that, too.. or should.. and were just trying to dangle a Shiny thing to distract from John Lewis' memorial & the Ghislaine Maxwell Documents being unsealed by US District Judge Loretta Preska!
Mahalo and Welcome to DU, GigiLeigh
GigiLeigh
(73 posts)marble falls
(56,358 posts)AZ8theist
(5,339 posts)More like 1/1000000000000000000000000000000th.
The man-baby is a fucking blithering IMBECILE.
dansolo
(5,376 posts)She will remain as Speaker until a new Speaker is chosen.
Tumbulu
(6,267 posts)and she will remain Speaker of the House.
My guess is that T will try to delay elections in some red states.
I cannot see CA participating in such a game.
Cha
(295,899 posts)be holding their elections?
I hear today that dt said he was just being an a Distracting Asshole when he said that yesterday.. not in those exact words.
Response to JonLP24 (Original post)
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